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  1. #1
    Ultimate Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Default Art Spiegelman's rejected Golden Age TPB essay

    Art Spiegelman wrote an essay about Marvel as a prelude for TPB Marvel: The Golden Age 1939–1949, but the house of ideas rejected it because it compares Donald Trump to the Red Skull.
    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...kull-trump-dig

    So it was printed in the UK's Guardian newspaper instead.
    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ise-of-fascism

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    "Orange Skull" would have been too literary a reference for Trump supporters to grok and I doubt many of them would be interested in a folio collection of Golden Age comics anyway. So it does feel weak and pointless on Marvel's point to make a fuss about this introduction.

    If you are going to get an outsider comic artist like Spiegelman, best believe he's gonna type with the gloves off.

    As it is Spiegelman, a guy who's not a big fan of superhero comics (as he admits there) was a choice made to get some real prestige for this. And now they come out looking as cowards.

    I mean if Marvel wants to be this bi-partisan thing since Perlmutter's company employs many left-wing people on editors and writing staff and among artists and so on, it would have been stronger if they let Spiegelman publish that intro.

  3. #3
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    Marvel trying to be apolitical? They haven't shown Trump, which by itself is a pretty big sign of how they feel. Then you have the current story in Avengers and the Secret Empite story and I know that there sre seversl others.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    Marvel trying to be apolitical? They haven't shown Trump, which by itself is a pretty big sign of how they feel. Then you have the current story in Avengers and the Secret Empite story and I know that there sre seversl others.
    Marvel is never going to be fully apolitical, but I definitely think the post-Cebulski era has been trying to cut any overly direct references to real life politicians. While in the Alonso era you would get the literal face of Donald Trump put in the body of M.O.D.O.K., now in the Cebulski era, you can't even make jokes alluding to him.

  5. #5
    Spectacular Member Doombot's Avatar
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    Keep modern, foaming at the mouth, anti-Trump opinions out of my Golden Age stories please. One has nothing to do with the other and it tiresome and will not age well.

  6. #6
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    That quote would likely date the collection after a single year, but even if that is the reason they cut it, it's not worth the optics.
    Dance games are my divine punishment from the Lord. May my furnace be forever fueled.

  7. #7
    Astonishing Member JudicatorPrime's Avatar
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    Spiegelman finishes his essay by saying: “In today’s all too real world, Captain America’s most nefarious villain, the Red Skull, is alive on screen and an Orange Skull haunts America.”
    Is that it? Yes, it should have been pulled. Not because of the political slant, but because it barely rates as satire, let alone a real, honest to goodness burn. I struggle with people who find a bull horn in the heart of a conflagration only to use it to shout, "Hey guys, I think something is on fire." If you're going to cut a man, by God, unsheathe the sword and don't use the pommel.

  8. #8
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    Big-boned, oddly colored, obsessed with his own ratings? He's no Red Skull, he's Mojo!

  9. #9
    Fantastic Member mikelmcknight72's Avatar
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    I'm glad they cut it for a variety of reasons. It doesn't sound like it was a terribly appropriate context for the injection of personal politics, and Marvel has every right to determine that they want to dial back on the injection of politics into their product. It is rarely a good idea to alienate half of your customers, both potential and actual.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doombot View Post
    Keep modern, foaming at the mouth, anti-Trump opinions out of my Golden Age stories please. One has nothing to do with the other and it tiresome and will not age well.
    But why shouldn't we? Plenty of books were political back in the day, they were just against facism. Nowadays people get offended if you don't praise Nazis enough!

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member JackDaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    But why shouldn't we? Plenty of books were political back in the day, they were just against facism. Nowadays people get offended if you don't praise Nazis enough!
    The comment strikes me as a bit feeble, and is going to be become dated soon (the world has gone completely insane if the Donald is re-elected)...I can see why Marvel wouldn’t want to irritate a fair wad of its customer base for such a peripheral comment.

  12. #12

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    We must stop Marvel
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  13. #13
    Fantastic Member mikelmcknight72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    But why shouldn't we? Plenty of books were political back in the day, they were just against facism. Nowadays people get offended if you don't praise Nazis enough!
    If you truly care about and enjoy comics, then you should want healthy sales. Without healthy sales, the industry truly will be doomed. Alienating half of the buyers, current and potential, is sure to hurt sales. Therefore.....

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackDaw View Post
    The comment strikes me as a bit feeble, and is going to be become dated soon (the world has gone completely insane if the Donald is re-elected)...I can see why Marvel wouldn’t want to irritate a fair wad of its customer base for such a peripheral comment.
    Quote Originally Posted by mikelmcknight72 View Post
    If you truly care about and enjoy comics, then you should want healthy sales. Without healthy sales, the industry truly will be doomed. Alienating half of the buyers, current and potential, is sure to hurt sales. Therefore.....
    Mu point is, there is a reason why conservative politics aren't usually the "good guy" in media, but there's especially a good reason why stories aren't kind to Trump and the far-right. They are objectively bad and really hard to make sympathetic and relatable characters.

    And yes, adding Trump or any president into stories would date the stories too much, but while the Marvel leadership would like to claim that they are apolitical, the stories and events being put forth don't show that. You can't totally divorce politics from these stories, that isn't how art works. That isn't how it's ever worked.

  15. #15
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    Always enjoyed reading Marvel heroes punching out the bad guys. No reason why we can't see Captain America punching trump like we saw with Hitler.

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