X-Men Monday (8/19/19)

[Dante Milton]

All I want to know is is his work on Astonishing and NM still worth it. Because I liked what I saw there.

I mostly enjoyed New Mutants, but the ending lacked resolution. You had to get that in his Uncanny run and even then it was lackluster. Gorham's art was great though.

Didn't bother with Astonishing because Greg Land.

[Tycon]

Astonishing: yeah

Dead Souls: lmao no

This. Astonishing was cute but Dead Souls will give you hives.

[nandes]

I still can't believe they blamed Bishop spending centuries hunting that stupid baby on the frickin' Demon Bear. But anything to fix him, I guess.

I think the Demon Bear possession actually came AFTÊR the Hope hunting?

Nothing about Bishop's motivations to hunt and kill Hope were actually retconned. Psylocke and Storm simply entered his mind and brainwashed him back to the 90's.

[MechaJeanix]

It is always interesting to hear from the writers. I think Rosenberg is talented, though I do not care much for his writing. I think he starts really strong but his middles and ends need a lot of help (see Phoenix Resurrection, Uncanny run, etc). I did like his short Astonishing X-men run and felt it was fun.

I just didn't feel the Uncanny story overall. It had too many deaths and they didn't carry much impact or weight. The Wolfsbane story should be unforgivable, but people will continue to excuse it away and make excuses for him. I see so many people on comics twitter take up for him even though they acknowledge that his story "hurt people". We just do not value the trans experience or the lives of trans people. I'm hoping one day making a mistake like the Wolfsbane death story would be career ending for someone, but that might be expecting too much.

[powerpax]

Nothing about Bishop's motivations to hunt and kill Hope were actually retconned. Psylocke and Storm simply entered his mind and brainwashed him back to the 90's.

And they're all cool with letting it go at that?? Okay!

[Silver Fang]

And they're all cool with letting it go at that?? Okay!

Well they work with Magneto & Mystique, whom Bishop isn't any worse than. So I don't see the issue. Especially with a half-assed character assassination that shouldn't have happened in the first place. Sacrificing & villainizing Bishop, making him the Creed to the Cable (Wolverine) family. Whichever writer is responsible never needs to write the X-Men again.

[fsger]

And they're all cool with letting it go at that?? Okay!

Yes, even Jean of all people seemed to like Bishop more after he molested her adopted son for years just to kill a baby. (because that is something Jean would totally do)

Well they work with Magneto & Mystique, whom Bishop isn't any worse than. So I don't see the issue. Especially with a half-assed character assassination that shouldn't have happened in the first place. Trying to sacrifice Bishop to make Cable look good by making him the Creed to the Cable/Wolverine family.

other people like Emma or Cyclops make mistakes and it is brilliant writing and totally justificable to hate the characters but making Bishop make mistakes or disliking him for that is not.
got ya, the victim card always works.

[powerpax]

I'm more than willing to welcome Bishop back bc I thought the story was a stupid mistake. But the rationale for how they undid it is pretty flimsy.

[Silver Fang]

I'm more than willing to welcome Bishop back bc I thought the story was a stupid mistake. But the rationale for how they undid it is pretty flimsy.

This brings up the old thread. If a bad story is done, should writers ignore it like nothing happened or try to fix it?
https://community.cbr.com/showthread...t-would-you-do

The latter could do more harm than good. If it's not acknowledged, it could be written off as filler. lol

[spirit2011]

Well they work with Magneto & Mystique, whom Bishop isn't any worse than. So I don't see the issue. Especially with a half-assed character assassination that shouldn't have happened in the first place. Sacrificing & villainizing Bishop, making him the Creed to the Cable (Wolverine) family. Whichever writer is responsible never needs to write the X-Men again.

It was really bad that writers and editors thought it was a good idea destroy Bishop character in favor of Cable and Hope.

[fsger]

It was really bad that writers and editors thought it was a good idea destroy Bishop character in favor of Cable and Hope.

but that happened, I thought you weren't a fan of excuses seeming that you don't let anybody forget about Emma or Cyclops mistakes and judge them only for that.
Lets be fair.

[Silver Fang]

It was really bad that writers and editors thought it was a good idea destroy Bishop character in favor of Cable and Hope.

Ah yeah. Similar to Rosenberg's handy work with de-powering Triage for being similar to Elixir. But that's a can of worms some will get triggered by. lol

[spirit2011]

AH yeah. Similar to Rosenberg's handy work with depowering Triage for being similar to Elixir. But that's a can of worms some will get triggered by. lol

Hope everyone gonna ignore that. Rosenberg'run there is some clear insensibilities.

but that happened, I thought you weren't a fan of excuses seeming that you don't let anybody forget about Emma or Cyclops mistakes and judge them only for that.
Lets be fair.

I'm being fair, they just did it many times

[Strong Girl Daken]

It was racist to make Bishop a villain. Flat out. Bishop isn't real. Using a racist story written by real people to moralize and justify whatever vendetta just feeds that racism.

[PsychoEFrost]

It was racist to make Bishop a villain. Flat out. Bishop isn't real. Using a racist story written by real people to moralize and justify whatever vendetta just feeds that racism.

I don't see how it is or was racist. The only explanation I've ever gotten is "because he's the only high profile black male on the team, so having him do a face/heel turn is racist."

No. No it's not. It was dumb, don't get me wrong. But there was nothing "racist" about his words or actions. His story was exaggerated, but still fit with his character since his debut (that he'll do just about anything to make sure his horrible future doesn't happen).

He was used because there were only six time travel relevant characters at the time. Rachel was MIA, Kitty was a no go, Shard was dead, and it made more sense for Bishop to try and kill Hope then for Cable to do it (since Hope's connection to the Phoenix lends itself more to Cable and his family than Bishop).