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  1. #466
    Mighty Member Spider-Chan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PraiseBeFeige View Post
    Jay Washington had seemingly nothing to do with the production of Spider-man or Venom. Why would he know this information???
    He was quoting the same "sources" of Collider. Now, here's the thing: they never had sources. In fact, it was never news.

    John Schnepp (RIP) of Collider in January of last year mentioned that he "Thinks that Holland is going to be in Venom". He thinks. He never says that he has sources, or that he heard it somewhere, he says he thinks that he is going to make a cameo. Watching the video, you realize that he's basically speaking into existence. He Hope's that Holland might make a cameo because, in his words, "they can't have Venom or Black Cat without Spidey, it makes sense for Holland to show up". It was never news, it was a fan being hopeful.

    Of course, other sources passed it as a rumor that Holland might make a cameo. As you mention, Jay Washington is a comedian who probably has a connection in the media industry, but nothing too deep to know about something like that, so he very likely misquoted Schnepp and now it's being passed again as a rumor that Disney forced them to cut the cameo.

    Don't take the word of some random guy from youtube kidsッ\_(ツ)_/ッ

  2. #467
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    Very rational look at the planned Tom Holland cameo for Venom and the reasons behind its removal (but by all means let a precious few freak out that it’s Midnight Edge again)...

    Wish granted;

    Midnight's Edge is not a trustworthy source.

    Was that enough freak out for you or do you need things up a few notches?
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  3. #468
    Astonishing Member Derek Metaltron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Wish granted;

    Midnight's Edge is not a trustworthy source.

    Was that enough freak out for you or do you need things up a few notches?
    People do like to say that without giving a credible reason why beyond ‘wah I don’t like them’, but whatever you prefer. Everything I have seen them talk about including talking about the plans by Sony to remove Spider-Man from the MCU seems to have come to pass, so I can only look at it from my perspective.

    Whilst we at it...



    Can’t be as sure with this one but it’s at least encouraging if Sony and Marvel are talking again.

  4. #469
    Mighty Member Spider-Chan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    People do like to say that without giving a credible reason why beyond ‘wah I don’t like them’, but whatever you prefer. Everything I have seen them talk about including talking about the plans by Sony to remove Spider-Man from the MCU seems to have come to pass, so I can only look at it from my perspective.
    Literally speaking, three videos that were posted on this thread alone have been proven to be debunked. He is a guy who speculates more than report (the video of why the characters are so different in the MCU is the crown jewel). If that's not enough to convince you, I'm not sure what does.

  5. #470
    Astonishing Member Derek Metaltron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Chan View Post
    Literally speaking, three videos that were posted on this thread alone have been proven to be debunked. He is a guy who speculates more than report (the video of why the characters are so different in the MCU is the crown jewel). If that's not enough to convince you, I'm not sure what does.
    First up ME is an entire group, not one guy - Andre does a fair proportion of the content but not everything. Second they have pretty successfully covered the Sony situation since the fallout of ASM2’s failure and seem to understand it just fine. I am not saying they are perfect - I have a more positive perspective on Star Trek Discovery and the Star Wars sequels than they do - but nothing they have covered has exactly made me assume they are liars or trend jumpers as a few others feel. If you feel otherwise that’s fine, but I dislike people downplaying content like this because it’s not to your taste. So we can agree to disagree.

  6. #471
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    People do like to say that without giving a credible reason why beyond ‘wah I don’t like them’, but whatever you prefer.
    My reason is that very little of what they have has been shown to be accurate and they freely mix established fact with speculation, not only sometimes failing to label them as such, but presenting speculation as iron-clad fact. Watch their Star Trek: Discovery videos if you want to see why there are those of us who don't trust them; the "alternative license myth" they've been pushing as a fact alone is enough to make me skeptical of anything they have to say. (There's also the little bit that, despite claiming to be "spin-free," they have their own agenda, but that's more the former then the latter.)
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  7. #472
    Incredible Member TheDarman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    First up ME is an entire group, not one guy - Andre does a fair proportion of the content but not everything. Second they have pretty successfully covered the Sony situation since the fallout of ASM2’s failure and seem to understand it just fine.
    I think the fact that they put out a video simultaneously trashing the MCU version of Spider-Man, while making up the fact that Sony made them use different versions of characters (so they wouldn't lose the rights to those characters in the event of a split like this one) than the traditional ones in order to make Sony the bad guy demonstrates to me that they will twist the facts to fit their particular agenda.
    With Great Power, Comes Great Responsibility

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  8. #473
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarman View Post
    I think the fact that they put out a video simultaneously trashing the MCU version of Spider-Man, while making up the fact that Sony made them use different versions of characters (so they wouldn't lose the rights to those characters in the event of a split like this one) than the traditional ones in order to make Sony the bad guy demonstrates to me that they will twist the facts to fit their particular agenda.
    Or see them on Star Trek: Discovery;a lot of fear-mongering that CBS/Paramount want classic Trek completely replaced with the Abrams movies and new stuff, and grasping at any straws that would suggest that Discovery is failing, not working, being rejected by viewers, etc.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  9. #474
    Mighty Member Spider-Chan's Avatar
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    Interesting interview to the Russo bros.

    “It wasn’t easy,” adds Joe Russo. “Kevin [Feige] went through a lot. There were a lot of ups and downs, and he kept walking into our office and we’d go, ‘Look, we’ve got to do it with [Sony],’ and he’d go, ‘OK, I’ll figure it out,’ and walk back into his. He was looking for the way out. He wanted to open that door and have us go, ‘We figured it out! We don’t need Spider-Man!’ because it’s a lot of work to get two major corporations to play nice with each other, and the fact that it happened at all, we should all be dancing and celebrating that we got that little bit of time.”

    “I think that’s why Joe and I are not so devastated or surprised that there’s been a falling-out, because it was so hard to make it happen in the first place,” offers Anthony Russo.


    Yeah, already saw that coming. I was even surprised Sony would play with Marvel, but it was clear that Sony was in a weak position at the time.

  10. #475
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    I'm sure it was in the works since Into the Spiderverse won an Academy Award. Thats a great big double middle finger to Disney and Marvel, winning in animation and with a Marvel character. FATALITY!
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  11. #476
    Incredible Member Jman27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    I'm sure it was in the works since Into the Spiderverse won an Academy Award. Thats a great big double middle finger to Disney and Marvel, winning in animation and with a Marvel character. FATALITY!
    why should disney care about animation when they have pixar and the multiple animation movies they put out each year? Although based on that variety article from the Sony Ceo they are pretty confident they will be fine without the mcu. I want to know how Morbius will perform cause that a movie without spider-man and/or venom in it
    "He's pure power and doesn't even know it. He's the best of us."-Matt Murdock

  12. #477
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jman27 View Post
    why should disney care about animation when they have pixar and the multiple animation movies they put out each year? Although based on that variety article from the Sony Ceo they are pretty confident they will be fine without the mcu. I want to know how Morbius will perform cause that a movie without spider-man and/or venom in it
    I don't think it will do well, honestly. The vampire trend is over and gone, while Leto's career is (seemingly) taking a step back, not forward. It didn't seem like the best idea to have "Morbius" be the next SUMC movie after "Venom." I think that Silver Sable/Black Cat movie would have been dope as heck after "Venom."
    The Amazing, Spectacular, Sensational Web-Slinger!

  13. #478
    Mighty Member Spider-Chan's Avatar
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    I expect Morbius to underperform. The director is acceptable but uninspired, and Leto has never been a box-office draw. Leto has never really had the energy and charisma to carry a solo movie the same way Hardy did. Add to that Leto's previous CB role was badly received by nearly everyone and that is the most mainstream movie he had been until now, Morbius doesn't have much in it's favor.

  14. #479
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Chan View Post
    I expect Morbius to underperform. The director is acceptable but uninspired, and Leto has never been a box-office draw. Leto has never really had the energy and charisma to carry a solo movie the same way Hardy did. Add to that Leto's previous CB role was badly received by nearly everyone and that is the most mainstream movie he had been until now, Morbius doesn't have much in it's favor.
    Which begs the question of why fast track this and split up Sable/Cat?
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  15. #480
    Incredible Member TheDarman's Avatar
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    Now, we have a panic ensuing because of a public statement from the CEO of Sony Pictures. In a recent interview, he stated that Spider-Man would be fine on his own and that he has faith in people within Sony. He made it clear that there was no ill will between Sony and Marvel and that, while the door was closed on Spider-Man returning to the MCU, it was “for the moment”. And despite the fact that that statement was far less definitive than Kevin Feige’s statement on the issue, where he said that Marvel had told all the stories that they had wanted to tell with Spider-Man, people have gone crazy, thinking that Spider-Man is officially done.

    Here are a few things to keep in mind. One, there is literally nothing else that Sony can say at this point unless a new deal has been worked out. Given the public negotiations seem to largely have ended, my guess is that negotiations are still ongoing. And Sony, like Disney, can’t be going out into public and appearing desperate. If negotiations are ongoing, as I suspect they are, Sony going out in public and begging Disney to take them back is only going to hurt Sony in private negotiations and give Disney more leverage. Obviously, Sony doesn’t want that. And, frankly, Disney doesn’t want that either. That’s why Kevin Feige is making definitive statements about how they finished the story they wanted to tell with Spider-Man, even though it was only two months ago we were hearing about how the next Spider-Man movie would tell a Peter Parker story that had never been told before. It’s all about exuding strength and making it seem in public that they don’t need the other party. Sony and Disney both know that they are better off making a deal with each other than they aren’t. There is too much money on the table, and too many creative limitations otherwise, to not come to an agreement. Right now, though, they can’t say that publicly.

    Two, the split itself isn’t the only thing that would be holding up a deal. There are a ton of other things that would need to happen before an agreement could be reached. For example, they have to renegotiate the length of the agreement. That is going to be a difficult conversation to get past. I’d guess Sony would prefer a longer agreement so that renegotiations don’t occur again so soon and leave Sony having to accept an ever-higher cut of their movies and IP going to Disney every time they renew in four to five years. Meanwhile, I suspect that Disney would want shorter renewal periods because then they can continue to renegotiate towards that 50/50 split number or end the deal when Sony has finally had enough. So, while we might seem to have an agreement on the exact split, there is a lot more to work out. Indeed, there have even been (what I consider, frankly, to be unreliable but, still, could be nevertheless true) reports that Sony wants Tom Holland’s Spider-Man to be able to go between the MCU and their own films. That’s a whole new element in negotiations that weren’t there before. And Sony also wants to make television projects with Spider-Man characters, something they can’t do given Disney has the rights to make television shows with Spider-Man. The point is that there is a lot more to work out independent of financing with the movies themselves.

    Frankly, I would just calm down. Sony hasn’t set a release date for a third Spider-Man film. They still haven’t found a director, even if it is just getting Watts back for another installment. They have only begun writing the film. Even if Sony does this in an even more hardline negotiation tactic, I don’t think it is really over until the cameras start rolling on a Spider-Man film without the MCU. We’ve seen productions be delayed and scripts undergo rewrites. I don’t even think it will come to that, but we do have to be patient. The first thing that we’ll hear about a new agreement will be a new agreement. There won’t be rumblings and no studio executive is going to make any statement that even hints negotiations are ongoing so as to not hurt their position. It’s showbusiness guys. We’ve got a little while longer to wait.
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