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  1. #61
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schumiac View Post
    It is as simple as this for me: You do NOT update names of fictional characters created ages ago based on popularity/sensitivity of a."current" time because the fictional heroes are ageless and timeless. Perceptions of people may change in time, an unpopular name may become popular again at some point etc etc as people and times change but fictional heroes and their names are constants. They are the name character was created with and known as. The name carries their "history" which is not something to be ashamed off and ignore but rather proud of. Dick Grayson still being around after 80 years IS a big deal. So what if his name shows it. Who cares? It wont stop people from reading him (including younger generation). It wont prevent him from being popular or regarded as cool (assuming he is written properly). His name doesnt take anything from him...

    And really the argument comes down to "no one in MY time and MY proximity is called Dick anymore so he shouldnt either". Again. He is timeless and ageless and in a fictional world and obviously in HIS world the name Dick is still used.

    Besides it would look ridiculous for a character who wnet with Dick Grayson for 80 years to suddenly stsrt being called "Ric" or Rick" or "Rich". I mean what,, one day he woke up and decided the name he was given by his parents and what everyone has been calling him so far is "bad" and not hip enough so decides to change it and everyone just goes with it? Lol Even the stupid amnesia story wouldnt really work to justify it imho, even if it was written half-decent. Because in the end he would have to get his memories back and once they are back no reason for him to stick with same name he went by during a traumatic time over the name and family and friends have been using for all his life. And dont even get me started on the whole "all he remembers is his circus life so he changed the name his BIOLOGICAL PARENTS gave him -and one of the only things he knows and remembers about himself- and started going with something else to distance himself from all things Bruce" thing.. and Ric? Really Ric? I rather he went with John or completely made up a new name while at it.

    Also, dont deny Dc their Dick" jokes...
    Yeah in-universe changing his name would be a pretty big middle finger to his parents. You know the people who he loved so much that he became a superhero because of their deaths.

    There are real issues with this industry and Dick's name isn't one of them.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff Blade Runner

    "In a short time, this will be a long time ago." - Werner Slow West

    "One of the biggest problems in the industry is apathy right now." - Dan Didio Co-Publisher of I Wonder Why That Is Comics

  2. #62
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrd156 View Post
    Funny I was dressing up as Dick Robin when I was 4 and loving him in BTAS in 2002 and he's been my favorite fictional character ever since. He's was pretty accessible for me at an extremely young age. The name Dick has never been an issue and never will be one because it's not.
    "2002" is almost 20 years ago. I'm talking about the current generation like how many young fans know or care about Dick Grayson?

  3. #63
    Spectacular Member Schumiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    Because if you want your character to survive, you need to make them accessible for the younger generation. Older fans won't live forever and no character can be "ageless" and "timeless" unless they get updated regularly every few decades.
    No, if you want your characters to survive and remain relatable you update your stories and storytelling and keep your stories interesting and relatable. You don't rename a character and/or change the very basic and fundamental aspects of them - you might as well be creating a brand new character based/inspired by an old one then... No kid is ever going to say "Nightwing is so cool. Wait, his real name is Dick?! Nope, cant read this anymore, I dont read characters whose name I am not familiar with and none of my friends have." Dick Grayson has survived for 80 years just fine and even now the kids interested in comics and shows like Young Justice or Teen Titans etc know him as Dick Grayson and like him as Dick Grayson. There are tons of fictional characters out there who have been around for ages, even hundreds of years and no one would ever dream of renaming them and give them "modern", "popular", "common", "relatable" names because the name of the character is a fundamental part of them and one of their recognizable traits. People are already familiar with that name, and have associations with it and it has a history...
    Last edited by Schumiac; 09-02-2019 at 12:42 PM.

  4. #64
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    You think Batman, Spider-Man....etc survived because they only updated their stories? These characters went through so many changes since their creations (Batman is nothing like he was in the 40s or 60s for example nor Dick is) to make them accessible. Even characters like Sherlock and King Arthur went through changes.

    Grayson is hardly anywhere close or relevent like the characters I mentioned and big part of any character's appeal is having cool name/appearance which he lacks in both. So, he isn't "ageless" or "timeless" and if you want him to survive for another 30 years, they need to make some serious changes to him.
    Last edited by Rise; 09-02-2019 at 12:54 PM.

  5. #65
    Astonishing Member Pohzee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    You think Batman, Spider-Man....etc survived because they only updated their stories? These characters went through so many changes since their creations (Batman is nothing like he was in the 40s or 60s for example nor Dick is) to make them accessible. Even characters like Sherlock and King Arthur went through changes.

    Grayson is hardly anywhere close or relevent like the characters I mentioned and big part of any character's appeal is having cool name/appearance which he lacks in both. So, he isn't "ageless" or "timeless" and if you want him to survive for another 30 years, they need to make some serious changes to him.
    One of the things they haven't changed is their name though.
    It's the Dynamic Duo! Batman and Robin!... and Red Robin and Red Hood and Nightwing and Batwoman and Batgirl and Orphan and Spoiler and Bluebird and Lark and Gotham Girl and Talon and Batwing and Huntress and Azreal and Flamebird and Batcow?

    Since when could just anybody do what we trained to do? It makes it all dumb instead of special. Like it doesn't matter anymore.
    -Dick Grayson (Batman Inc.)


  6. #66
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    Because they didn't need to.

    Neither Dick or Nightwing is catchy or cool names like Batman/Bruce or Spider-Man/Peter.

  7. #67
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    Because they didn't need to.

    Neither Dick or Nightwing is catchy or cool names like Batman/Bruce or Spider-Man/Peter.
    First of all, that's subjective, and second, Peter, Bruce, and Richard are all really common names. At least Dick elicits a chuckle. ^^

  8. #68
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    He electits mocking, not "chuckle".

    Yes they are which is why they didn't need changing and what I meant by "cool" and "catchy" is Batman and Spider-Man which I know many people think they are more cooler names than Nightwing (even a lot of his fans were happy that he left this name behind after Forever Evil).

    Edit: Also, I'm not saying change his name as Richard Grayson, simply change his nickname which he has no good reason to go by it.
    Last edited by Rise; 09-02-2019 at 01:22 PM.

  9. #69
    Mighty Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Yes they are which is why they didn't need changing and what I meant by "cool" and "catchy" is Batman and Spider-Man which I know many people think they are more cooler names than Nightwing.
    I'm not one of them. They work only because they've earned their place through the decades, IMO. Anything ending in "girl," "boy," "man," or "woman" is really very dull and no new characters should be created with such naming.

  10. #70
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    Then, you aren't one of "the many people" I talked about.

  11. #71
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    He electits mocking, not "chuckle".

    Yes they are which is why they didn't need changing and what I meant by "cool" and "catchy" is Batman and Spider-Man which I know many people think they are more cooler names than Nightwing (even a lot of his fans were happy that he left this name behind after Forever Evil).

    Edit: Also, I'm not saying change his name as Richard Grayson, simply change his nickname which he has no good reason to go by it.
    Which had nothing to do with the merits of the name of ‘Nightwing’, or it not being “catchy” enough.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 09-02-2019 at 01:51 PM.

  12. #72
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    "2002" is almost 20 years ago. I'm talking about the current generation like how many young fans know or care about Dick Grayson?
    Young Justice and Titans fans do. Titans fans seem to be made of a combination of NTT fans and the Teen Titans cartoon, but Young Justice fans range from millenial to Gen-Z. They have no problem with the name, and when the show make fun of "Dick", they're having fun with it too.

    It's the kind of thing that you just accept as part of the awareness that these characters are old.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    Then, you aren't one of "the many people" I talked about.
    Which one are they?

    My problem with this whole naming thing is the same as Superman's trunk and personality. I'm one of those who think the trunk should go, but it's back anyway, and I don't think it will go away because it's such a classic, and they tried making Superman younger and angstier to appeal for the current-gen, in New 52 and Year One. Worked for me since it came at the right time for me. I didn't like Superman, but those versions work, but both of them are gone now, right on time as I came to appreciate the real Superman.

    It's the kind of thing that they can try and can work for a time, as I said it worked for me on Superman, but it has to be the right time, and it won't last long.
    Last edited by Restingvoice; 09-02-2019 at 01:42 PM.

  13. #73
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    Gen-Z don't watch YJ because it currently being made for fans who watched the show a decade ago and Titans is targeting audience who are over 18 years old. These aren't "young fans".

    And I don't like the trunks either nor wanted them to be back, but they made it for nostlgia since the majority of readers nowdays are older fans which is why the industry is struggling to survive.
    Last edited by Rise; 09-02-2019 at 01:52 PM.

  14. #74
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    TTGo also seems pretty popular.

  15. #75
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    Gen-Z don't watch YJ because it currently being made for fans who watched the show a decade ago and Titans is targeting audience who are over 18 years old. These aren't "young fans".

    And I don't like the trunks either nor wanted them to be back, but they made it for nostlgia since the majority of readers nowdays are older fans which is why the industry is struggling to survive.
    Didn't Gen-Z start a decade ago? They're a kid in the early 2000 and now a teenager?

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