View Poll Results: Do you like bendis taking legion from clark

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  • Love it

    4 3.81%
  • ok with it

    52 49.52%
  • Hate it

    49 46.67%
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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Default Bendis taking legion from clark

    Do you like bendis taking legion from superman and giving it to jon?

  2. #2
    Mighty Member Yoda's Avatar
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    They haven't really done anything with it with Clark for like the better part of the last 35 years. With the exception of the post-Secret Origin to Flashpoint, when was it used for anything? It didn't exist until Secret Origin and was introduced and immediately erased in the New 52 after Morrison. I do like Johns Legion arc of Action Comics, but that and Legion of Three Worlds are the only stories in the modern era that I can recall that actively used the connection. I have a hard time thinking what exactly it adds to Clark's character or background other than some adventures in the future, which he can still have in this set up. Really all it amounts to is essentially bragging rights to being the inspiration for the Legion.

    Though generally I think the Legion works better with a Superboy, it seems like it's a good fit for Jon. yeah, I'm ok with it.
    Last edited by Yoda; 08-31-2019 at 09:36 PM.

  3. #3
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    There's no option that's a step further than hate it, so we'll go with hate it. But yeah, easily the worst idea Bendis has had thus far, and it unfortunately happened to be a big one.

    That the connection hasn't been used much in a long time is just evidence of DC's failing with it, as opposed to a justification to go backwards again after some writers in the past decade tried to fix the first time they had this bad idea.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 08-31-2019 at 09:58 PM.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  4. #4
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    I like Jon and would have no problem with him being in the Legion. I just hate everything about this set-up.

    They can't give Superman a defined past that actually appeared on the page, but instead had to go with a vague hodge-podge of ideas from the last few timelines jumbled together along with some 10-year unseen period where he was a father. Now we get Jon being skipped ahead several years again off panel. So to top it off we get a Legion that isn't the same one we have read before, but with very similar replacement members. Yet one more attempt to make everything familiar but totally different- <YAWN>

    And the whole scene with the Legion arriving seemed to be designed to undercut Superman. What exactly has Jon really done to make him memorable 1000 years from now? At least when if was young Clark we had been shown a decade of Superboy adventures and nearly two decades of Superman adventures that made it plausible he had that type of impact. Jon hasn't really done much of anything yet and the idea his offhanded comments are seen as the crucial moment on founding the UP seems forced. I'm not knocking Jon or what he has done, I'm knocking the lack of development they put into setting him up as surpassing his father's legend.

    This would have worked better using the most recent Superman/Legion connections and having a new generation of the team come back from a few decades afterward looking to recruit Jon based on Clark's time with the original LSH. At least then Clark would know who they were and what sending Jon into their future might be like.

    Right now Jon leaving with them makes the idea he was sent off with Jor-El seem sane in comparison. Now he is leaving with total strangers who claim to be heroes from the future. Based on the last time he left Lois and Clark, does this sound like something they'd approve of?

  5. #5
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    Not forgetting that he is now after Clark and Conner the third Superboy who is in a kind of legion.

    In Conners Case it was plausible because Barts mother and Barts cousin XS were also in the legion and so it was nice to see them.

  6. #6
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    I can't really be mad or anything I just think it's funny that no one wants anything to do with any of the relateable stuff that was created for Superman's Post-Crisis origin. No one wants to be a farmer, or QB of the football team, or prom king or any of that stuff. They want the good stuff, the time travelling childhood friends, Superboy, childhood adventures, a dog that flies with you, the full power set. Which makes me wonder if no one else wants any of this stuff that was forced onto Superman in the 80's why should Superman have to put up with it. His "relateable" childhood sucks and should be scrapped.
    Rules are for lesser men, Charlie - Grand Pa Joe ~ Willy Wonka & Chocolate Factory

  7. #7

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    With the characters all being changed to fit the modern comic anyway, I see no issue with changing it to Jon. I wonder if Kara is also no longer a part of the LSH history.

    This isn’t the Legion I love, but it’s Legion and we have gone through changes before and it was interesting, so I am willing to give it a chance.

  8. #8
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The World View Post
    I can't really be mad or anything I just think it's funny that no one wants anything to do with any of the relateable stuff that was created for Superman's Post-Crisis origin. No one wants to be a farmer, or QB of the football team, or prom king or any of that stuff. They want the good stuff, the time travelling childhood friends, Superboy, childhood adventures, a dog that flies with you, the full power set. Which makes me wonder if no one else wants any of this stuff that was forced onto Superman in the 80's why should Superman have to put up with it. His "relateable" childhood sucks and should be scrapped.
    Actually, this version of superman had been a farmer. And critically the previous run was regarded well.the character doesn't shy away from his humble origin and returns to it when he is not a reporter. Smallville, man of steel.. Etc had his farming background extensively. Man of steel had clark being tried of the family business, only to be grateful of it later. As for, being football player. I don't see anything wrong with it. Secret origins had clark tryingout along with other sports and feeling bored of it. I also prefer clark being a vegetarian like in birthright. But, that isn't happening. What can you do?
    dude,this is'nt a pre crisis versus post crisis thread. And the current superman is neither postcrisis nor precrisis superman. If you want laugh at byrne reboot make another thread. Also, this debate has overstayed it's welcome period, in my opinion. A pure precrisis version or post crisis version of the character is not returning anytime soon.

  9. #9
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    Why does another franchise have to serve Superman just for Superman to be in that franchise? A high tide lifts all boats. A shared universe benefits from different properties supporting one another. DC's problem, in building a shared universe, too often has been that individual groups don't want to share.

    I don't know if I'm going to bother reading about the Legion, again. I really love the concept of the LSH, but I like to think that their history exists--and if they don't have a Clark Kent in their past, then this is probably yet another total reboot of the franchise which willl simply regurgitate everything I've already been through before. I want the Legion to go forward and they can only do that if they get beyond retelling their origins.
    verbum sapiente satis est

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Actually, this version of superman had been a farmer. And critically the previous run was regarded well.the character doesn't shy away from his humble origin and returns to it when he is not a reporter. Smallville, man of steel.. Etc had his farming background extensively. Man of steel had clark being tried of the family business, only to be grateful of it later. As for, being football player. I don't see anything wrong with it. Secret origins had clark tryingout along with other sports and feeling bored of it. I also prefer clark being a vegetarian like in birthright. But, that isn't happening. What can you do?
    dude,this is'nt a pre crisis versus post crisis thread. And the current superman is neither postcrisis nor precrisis superman. If you want laugh at byrne reboot make another thread. Also, this debate has overstayed it's welcome period, in my opinion. A pure precrisis version or post crisis version of the character is not returning anytime soon.
    I know this version of Superman and pretty much every other version since Byrne were farmers and probably nothing can be done about it I just find it funny that no other characters seem to want anything to do with any of Byrnes origin ideas but seem magnetically drawn to the Pre-Crisis ideas. Jon is Superboy, has the Legion, has a full powerset, etc; his childhood is closer to Superman's pre-crisis childhood than Superman's post-crisis childhood.

    Also I'm fine with Superman being a farmer just not at the expense of all the other things that should be in his origin.
    Rules are for lesser men, Charlie - Grand Pa Joe ~ Willy Wonka & Chocolate Factory

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The World View Post
    I know this version of Superman and pretty much every other version since Byrne were farmers and probably nothing can be done about it I just find it funny that no other characters seem to want anything to do with any of Byrnes origin ideas but seem magnetically drawn to the Pre-Crisis ideas. Jon is Superboy, has the Legion, has a full powerset, etc; his childhood is closer to Superman's pre-crisis childhood than Superman's post-crisis childhood.

    Also I'm fine with Superman being a farmer just not at the expense of all the other things that should be in his origin.
    Well, that's debatable. Jon has never felt like he is different or lonely . He was always surrounded by supers after he got powers. Before that, he was pretty normal kid. His powers only stabilised, recently. Also, pre crisis superboy didn't have anyone try to suppress his powers while he grew up in Smallville.jon's smallville(Hamilton) is a county full of literal alien refugees. jon's father and mother are both extraordinary,compared to the kents.
    He also has weird assassin turned goodboy seeking redemption robin as his bestie. Clark was never bruces friend as child.
    Anyways, this is out of topic. We can move to jon thread for this. If you want.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 09-01-2019 at 06:10 AM.

  12. #12
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    It doesn't matter, when this Bendis nightmare run is over, Geoff Johns will have to do some kind of soft reboot to fix all this anyway lol.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by The World View Post
    I can't really be mad or anything I just think it's funny that no one wants anything to do with any of the relateable stuff that was created for Superman's Post-Crisis origin. No one wants to be a farmer, or QB of the football team, or prom king or any of that stuff. They want the good stuff, the time travelling childhood friends, Superboy, childhood adventures, a dog that flies with you, the full power set. Which makes me wonder if no one else wants any of this stuff that was forced onto Superman in the 80's why should Superman have to put up with it. His "relateable" childhood sucks and should be scrapped.
    Nah. I can see why some people would think that way, and there's a lot of fun to be had in "wacky adventures since birth" Superman but one of the things that I really like about Superman's post Crisis/Donner movies/Morrison New 52 iterations is that his "Superman" life of sci fi and adventure started when he moved to Metropolis. He lived a (relatively) normal life, and when he reached adulthood he had the option of continuing to live a (relatively, still!) normal life.... but instead took a deep breath, moved away, and devoted his time in roughly equal parts to being a crusading journalist and costumed champion of the oppressed.

    That threshold and point of decision isn't as strong if he's been hanging out with his friends from the 31st Century every long childhood summer.



    Similarly, if the Legion is an optimistic view of the future it makes much more sense for them to be inspired by things that we haven't seen happen yet than for them to be taking their lead from Superman-as-we-know-him. Sure, Jon hasn't done much to earn their admiration - but isn't that sort of the point? The Legion is proof that Superman is right, that things will work out, and that his way works - because they're from thousands of years in the future and grew up telling stories of the things the House Of El will accomplish on Earth in the coming decades.


    All these changes make sense to me.

  14. #14
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    If I’m correct, it’s now:
    Clark: original legion
    Kon-El: Zero hour Legion
    Kara: Threeboot legion
    Jon: Rebirth Legion?

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    It totally blows and I hate it (as much as I can "hate" a story decision I dislike in a silly superhero comic lol).
    I don't know what the benefits are to this. Jon could easily just be the second/third Superboy to join the Legion (depending on whatever is happening with Kon) and it would be fine. But now the Legion is getting rebooted yet again, which continues to make them a cluttered joke, and Clark loses another bit of his lore and childhood to a supporting cast member who doesn't even need it.

    I was ok with what Bendis was doing, even the Lois stuff (because at least we got Rucka's book out of it), but I think this may have soured me on the whole thing. Oh well, I guess I will just have to wait and hope for Hickman to be done with the X-Men and come over to DC to fix the Legion (and the Titans).


    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    That the connection hasn't been used much in a long time is just evidence of DC's failing with it, as opposed to a justification to go backwards again after some writers in the past decade tried to fix the first time they had this bad idea.
    Yeah some bad comics from the 80s doing this and establishing a trend that lasted for a long while doesn't mean the creative decisions are very sound, or that Superman and the Legion have really benefited from them. DC does stupid stuff all the time and sticks with it. Superman's world becomes smaller and less diverse, his childhood more boring, and the Legion getting cut off from Superboy and Supergirl got the ball rolling on all their insipid retcons and reboots.

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