X-Monday #26 (9/2/19)

[fsger]

Lol at scemma/fans feeling offended, after how scemma and emma came to prominence it is so ironic. If anything emma/scemma were treated way better than they ever deserved.

[spirit2011]

She cheated, he tried to kill her. They were both under the Phoenix influence at the time, so the pass should apply to both. He was being a jerk, also considering how she was being supportive.

"under the phoenix influence". Even before Emma was having doubts and was obvious her attraction to Namor, like when Unit ordered then to make out and he was surprised how easy it was.

[Snoop Dogg]

what if every time moira died her life looped back to the last S/J/E convo

[Havok83]

It wasn't deliberate? wth

Emma was the best treated ex, even doing the worse.

He treated Jean well in X-Factor.

[spirit2011]

He treated Jean well in X-Factor.

Well he wanted to get back with her

[powerpax]

what if every time moira died her life looped back to the last S/J/E convo

Kill me first

[powerpax]

Looking back to everything that went down in the X-Books at the time, yeah, this sound pretty accurate.

I think it's accurate up to a point, namely the very recent present. Hickman's take on Scott and the X-Men seems quite simpatico to many aspects of Rightclops/Gillen/AVX.

[TheDeadSpace]

Namor's trident is being a little jerk and unnecessary. And I don't think he has treated other exes so badly, at least not deliberately.

He was hurt and angry.

To add to that, a missing portion that wasn't posted had Emma mention that Scott is actually conflicted towards her despite his words. Considering Scott's recent actions of pushing everyone away at that moment, Scott probably said the worst thing he could think of to make her leave. He seemed like he gave up at that point.

[H-E-D]

AFAIC Scott was never more interesting than he was from Gillen through AvX to some of Bendis. Did I think the character was 100% in the right? Nope. I think he could've been called an antihero or villain at certain points in that era or AvX. But like Magneto, I always understood his reasons. That's the essence of good drama. That's what made it great reading. A book where my fave is the best most amazing hero ever at all times bores me.

The Scott we're seeing lately is close to that, which makes me happy.

Gillen's X-Men is underrated.

[TheDeadSpace]

what if every time moira died her life looped back to the last S/J/E convo

That's a terrible fate indeed.

[powerpax]

tfw you let your comixology unlimited trial expire but whenever you try to rejoin it keeps sending you to the learn more page. I'm stupid. edit: Fixed lol

[useridgoeshere]

Gillen's X-Men is underrated.

By Marvel, maybe, but I think fans rated it highly. It was just too short, especially with AVX shoved in there.

[Rivka]

What Marvel was going for was tragic irony: Xavier's protege and heir apparent (Scott) becomes instead the successor to Xavier's ideological nemesis (Magneto) and then ultimately kills Xavier himself. But, the attempt backfired because the X-franchise writers made Scott too sympathetic for the storyarc to work as intended. Moreover, ill-conceived retcons had essentially made Xavier into a villain himself. For fuck's sake, a sizable contingent on this forum think Xavier deserved to be killed and that Scott deserved a medal for doing it!

On a broader level, Marvel also failed to account for the massive cultural shift in attitudes toward race relations since the turn of the century. The liberal, integrationist, "judge people as individuals" philosophy Xavier was meant to represent is now considered obtusely naive at best and deceitfully racist at worst. Instead, revolutionary tribalism--"pride and power" as you say--is regarded as the morally correct orthodoxy. From that point of view, Magneto--and thus RightClops--are righteous, heroic visionaries, and Xavier is a foolish Uncle Tom.

Marvel missed all of this, and so it never occurred to them that readers would come to see Xavier's way as wrong and Magneto/RightClops's way as right.

After AvX, Marvel editorial wanted to change direction and shift the X-franchise back toward a more traditional status quo, including Cyclops himself. So, albeit in fits and starts, they've walked back the changes in Scott's character, and, rather than reference his RightClops persona as readers interpreted it, Marvel is referencing it as they intended it.

I don't agree with your assessment but I understand what you're saying. I don't think there has been a cultural shift at all--just a cancerous growth of tribalism and hate that is not normal and hopefully will be healed. I don't think Scott Summers rejected judging people as individuals, nor did he embrace tribalism by inviting the last of the mutants on earth to live on Utopia. The situation was survival, and Cyke took a self-defensive position but not a defensive one. Utopia was not about mutant segregation, but survival.

Most everyone I know, liberals and conservatives, still believe in judging people on their individual merits. How is that naive or racist? The idea of respecting individuality and identifying with a group at the same time, is something American culture has embraced for hundreds of years. You can identify as LGBQT, be an activist, march in support of full civil and legal liberty, be proud of who you are while at the same time be a unique individual with a different religion, different political affiliation, different understanding of human nature from the person marching next to you.

Scott Summers was a leader who attracted a broken Magneto to HIS cause, not the other way around. Magneto bent the knee to Cyclops, not the other way around. Scott forged a synthesis of Xavier and Magneto's philosophies, one that honored both. That's how I read it, and that's what I think Matt Fraction and Gillen were going for. Xavier's belief in individual dignity will never be outdated or naive. The crux of the problem is how do you solve the problem of social injustice. This is what the conflict between Magneto and Xavier was all about. (a) Xavier: Do you go about it gently, non-violently, trying to assimilate, fit in, win acceptance and hunker down when attacked--passive resistance. Be heroes, be the good guys, no matter what they do to you. Educate people about mutants, form a strike force or paramilitary group of kids to take down other mutants who threaten the peace (and later engage the corrupt forces of hate groups and the government). (b) Magneto: Violent retribution, pay back, pro-active aggression before you get hit. Show the world that you have a place in it, an eye for an eye. But also, Magneto was capable of bending, of changing, of trying Xavier's way. He was also capable when psychotic of going all the other way, to world domination and dictatorship of mutants.

I think it's very clear, given the disaster of a world we're in now due to tribalism, hate and violence, that the "liberal" belief in individuality, social justice, cooperation and solving conflict using non-violent means is more apropos than ever. I was saying this before: you don't have to give up your individuality, your own style, your own sense of self based on experience, self-identification, ancestry, etc in order to also--at the same time--identify as a citizen of planet earth, a member of the human species, and agree to cooperate and compromise to help save yourself and others from social, political, environmental threats. This seems to me the very essence of the X-MEN message.

Anyway, Scott Summers, Cyclops, as to Scott -- "Revolutionary" Scott was not about tribalism and hate and power politics. That's the entire point to me. He synthesized Xavier and Magneto's points of view. He wanted mutants to be accepted, to be counted among the heroes of earth but at the same time he told the world, mutants no longer would practice passive-resistance. They'd be pro-active, activist, and use their powers to defend themselves and any other mutants around the world. I fail to see how this is a bad development. He didn't separate mutants from humanity, but demanded respect.

As many others have pointed out, the problem for the X-Men--I mean among many--but the biggest problem with this straightforward message of tolerance, social justice, and the right to live in peace and safety the way you want, any place you want, with full equality before the law, is that mutants are actually super powered beings with incredible powers and might very well be the next stage in human evolution (but they're not a separate species yet). Are non-mutant humans wrong to be afraid of mutants? Scott Summers was trying to solve that conundrum and I think he was doing a credible, viable job! Marvel writers were doing a credible, viable job, starting with Morrison and moving through Bendis.

Speaking of Morrison, whose run I hated, and who I think was grossly overrated, he did handle this issue adroitly. His expansion of mutant population numbers, the creation of mutant culture, a "mutant town" and mutant-loving followers; i.e., making mutants into objects of celebrity or acceptance at a distance (but *Hey, no, I don't want no mutants living next door to me*) was an accurate depiction of minorities in modern society.

[Veitha]

"under the phoenix influence". Even before Emma was having doubts and was obvious her attraction to Namor, like when Unit ordered then to make out and he was surprised how easy it was.

You can be physically attracted to someone while in a relationship. Emma is hot, Namor is hot. Add super pheromones and that happened.
Jean was attracted to Logan. Are we going to keep her accountable for that? (I wouldn't, just following this kind of reasoning).

All I'm saying is, the end of Bendis's run made little sense to me when it comes to both Scott treating Emma like this and how he ended the revolution. Kinda out of character or uncalled for.

[Glio]

You can be physically attracted to someone while in a relationship. Emma is hot, Namor is hot. Add super pheromones and that happened.
Jean was attracted to Logan. Are we going to keep her accountable for that? (I wouldn't, just following this kind of reasoning).

All I'm saying is, the end of Bendis's run made little sense to me when it comes to both Scott treating Emma like this and how he ended the revolution. Kinda out of character or uncalled for.

All superheroes must be horny as hell all the time. If even Xavier has a body of Olympic sportsman.