House of x [4] : It will be done [spoilers]

[butterflykyss]

Except they wernet discreet bc they had Kurt teleport in there and got scene instead of using their telepath to do recon from their ship. And hacking is really the reason you think they didnt have a communicator? As if the ship, which is also tech based, couldnt be hacked, nor detected.

Because we've seen it in the MU for decades. People in space communicating with those on Earth is not a new thing. You act like they only have access to basic tech from the 1980s and not super advanced alien tech and/or that from the future

A TP connection also severely limits the utility of one of the mutants and sacrifices one of those precious omegas. Jean shouldnt have been on that mission but since she was, she could have been put to better use. She should have been scanning that base, given Scott and the team a layout of the interior and the individuals inside. She could have been forewarned about the missile attack and TK shielded the ship or at least the individuals inside to protect everyone. Exactly WHY didnt she do this bc at this point she hadnt even established any TP connection back to Earth

She's the only one there with area of effect powers and could have been better suited to handle multiple enemies than Monet. She can fly in space and would be protected from the deaths that Mystique, Kurt and Wolverine faced. TK shields and TP would have protected her and Scott. Jean was not utilized well in this issue at all.

kurt technically only got in one wing and at that point they already knew the xmen were there. they obviously was trying to be as discreet as possible.

the signal from the communicator can be detected and they could triangulate the location back to krakoa. having a communicator of any sort could have compromised krakoa which they did not want to do. that's why they fidnt bring any seeds.

[loke13]

Sounds like a good representation of what this situation is: War. Very few go out like badasses. Only Erasmus, Kurt and Logan did.

Oh I agree, I'm really curious to see how this issue is re-contextualized in the future because right now it seems like the humans are ready to make the sacrifice play too.

[TooFlyToFail]

Except they wernet discreet bc they had Kurt teleport in there and got scene instead of using their telepath to do recon from their ship. And hacking is really the reason you think they didnt have a communicator? As if the ship, which is also tech based, couldnt be hacked, nor detected.

Because we've seen it in the MU for decades. People in space communicating with those on Earth is not a new thing. You act like they only have access to basic tech from the 1980s and not super advanced alien tech and/or that from the future

A TP connection also severely limits the utility of one of the mutants and sacrifices one of those precious omegas. Jean shouldnt have been on that mission but since she was, she could have been put to better use. She should have been scanning that base, given Scott and the team a layout of the interior and the individuals inside. She could have been forewarned about the missile attack and TK shielded the ship or at least the individuals inside to protect everyone. Exactly WHY didnt she do this bc at this point she hadnt even established any TP connection back to Earth

She's the only one there with area of effect powers and could have been better suited to handle multiple enemies than Monet. She can fly in space and would be protected from the deaths that Mystique, Kurt and Wolverine faced. TK shields and TP would have protected her and Scott. Jean was not utilized well in this issue at all.

Scanning the base? You assume Orchid didn't implant TP-blocking tech in their people? That's probably the first thing they did.

Tech can always be compromised. For all we know Karima could have hacked them, as they didn't even know she was there. TP leaves your line secure. If Krakoa's location is found, they lose their advantage. That's also why they didn't want to take flowers. This is obvious stuff, yo.

Forewarned about what missile attack? Erasmus suicide bombed them from under them; they never thought they'd go that far.

TK the ship? The ship that already had impenetrable shields? They had to deactivate the shields to board the station, but that's when Erasmus did his thing. Can't be helped.

By the time Mystique was flown into space, Jean was already crippled. Same reason why she couldn't help Monet.

Jean being caught and injured in an explosion that killed Archangel matters. She shouldn't be written to just shrug off her injuries, when she's not portrayed to be a super fit, super athletic soldier like Nightcrawler.

[Havok83]

Scanning the base? You assume Orchid didn't implant TP-blocking tech in their people? That's probably the first thing they did.

Forewarned about what missile attack? Erasmus suicide bombed them from under them; they never thought they'd go that far.

TK the ship? The ship that already had impenetrable shields? They had to deactivate the shields to board the station, but that when Erasmus did he thing. Can't be helped.

By the time Mystique was flown into space, Jean was already crippled. Same reason why she couldn't help Monet.

Jean being caught and injured in an explosion that killed Archangel matters. She shouldn't be written to just shrug off her injuries, when she's not portrayed to be a super fit, super athletic soldier like Nightcrawler.

yeah just as you assumed they'd be hacking the X-communicators. The people can have TP blockers but that shouldnt prevent Jean from scanning the place. Telepaths can send out astral forms to do recon. She doesnt need to connect to a mind to do that. Im instantly reminded of Psylocke scanning the Xavier estate in her butterfly form in Claremont's first run

Not foreseeing possibilities is what gets you killed as it did here. If Jean had done recon, she would have known about the missle and protected them

That goes back to my first point. Besides Jean's TK is very powerful, more so than the ship's shields. Her TK protected the X-men's spacecraft from a radiation flare in the past and has withstood explosions

Again back to my first point

[TooFlyToFail]

Oh I agree, I'm really curious to see how this issue is re-contextualized in the future because right now it seems like the humans are ready to make the sacrifice play too.

Makes me interested if any Avengers will play a role. I could definitely see the Illuminati confronting Xavier down the line, in a future event, with Hickman writing this. Reed and his ultimate nullifer. Stark being concerned with Krakoa having info on his tech. Etcetera.

[butterflykyss]

Scanning the base? You assume Orchid didn't implant TP-blocking tech in their people? That's probably the first thing they did.

Tech can always be compromised. For all we know Karima could have hacked them, as they didn't even know she was there. TP leaves your line secure. If Krakoa's location is found, they lose their advantage. That's also why they didn't want to take flowers. This is obvious stuff, yo.

Forewarned about what missile attack? Erasmus suicide bombed them from under them; they never thought they'd go that far.

TK the ship? The ship that already had impenetrable shields? They had to deactivate the shields to board the station, but that's when Erasmus did his thing. Can't be helped.

By the time Mystique was flown into space, Jean was already crippled. Same reason why she couldn't help Monet.

Jean being caught and injured in an explosion that killed Archangel matters. She shouldn't be written to just shrug off her injuries, when she's not portrayed to be a super fit, super athletic soldier like Nightcrawler.

you are making great points. just thought this neded to be said.

[TooFlyToFail]

We assume Jean can do that because another TP did? Didn't know that's how powers worked. Her being Omega doesn't mean she can do everything just because. Also, how often has Jean ever done what you said? I don't remember a story where she's done recon like that.

Again, what missile? It was a makeshift bomb done on the spot. Erasmus went McGuyver on them.

More so than the ship's shields? We don't know that, at all. Regardless, they didn't see Erasmus being that desperate.

[TooFlyToFail]

Thanks! Not saying that there's not any issues, it's just that this Jean thing is just people being mad their favorite didn't steal the show. That's not the point of this story. A story in which Apocalypse was beaten like a child, and killed off screen. This is effectively a war story. The scenarios and emotions depicted lend itself to that.

[Havok83]

We assume Jean can do that because another TP did? Didn't know that's how powers worked. Her being Omega doesn't mean she can do everything just because. Also, how often has Jean ever done what you said? I don't remember a story where she's done recon like that.

Again, what missile? It was a makeshift bomb done on the spot. Erasmus went McGuyver on them.

More so than the ship's shields? We don't know that, at all. Regardless, they didn't see Erasmus being that desperate.

No, there's no assumption. Jean has been seen to do that. Astral projection is well within her skillset

Missile, bomb, same difference. It doesnt change the point I was making

[loke13]

Thanks! Not saying that there's not any issues, it's just that this Jean thing is just people being mad their favorite didn't steal the show. That's not the point of this story. A story in which Apocalypse was beaten like a child, and killed off screen. This is effectively a war story. The scenarios and emotions depicted lend itself to that.

Thank you someone had to say it lol Hickman definitely wants to get across the bleakness of this war between the Mutants and Humans/Machines. But this also makes me curious where the Ascension era fits into to all this considering it's post-war.

[TooFlyToFail]

No, there's no assumption. Jean has been seen to do that. Astral projection is well within her skillset

Missile, bomb, same difference. It doesnt change the point I was making

Well within her power and seeing her do that on even a semi-regular basis are two different things. If it is something she does, it's rare because I don't remember any case of her doing this. If it's a rare thing, then her not doing it here is hardly an issue.

It's not the same difference. Erasmus made that bomb on the spot, in seconds, directly under their ship. Completely different from a missile that can be tracked, and seen flying at you, from a distance.

[JKtheMac]

Well youre definitely not gonna wanna hear what Hickman and JDW think of X-Men continuity

In my perspective since I only follow the x-universe the continuity isn't that big of an issue

I'm sure upon closer examination some things would bother me but im not looking into it

But to me I don't care about whats going on in Avengers/Spider-Man unless its a big event and those are easy to place in continuity for me

Everyone knows X-Men continuity has got so twisted up that it’s essentially meaningless, but Marvel are still not going to discard it by sprinkling the comics into ten lifelines of a character. The continuity that we know will remain intact. The only question is how big the retcon is. As far as the retcon we can entirely ignore the previous lives of Moira and imagine she just has always had amazing insight into the people around her and what they are likely to think or how they are likely to act.

Theories that seek to suggest that each comic book run, and or era, are somehow represented in the ten timelines are just inherently illogical. People can complain about Hickman’s sometimes convoluted approach to comics but they can’t accuse him of being illogical.

[TooFlyToFail]

Thank you someone had to say it lol Hickman definitely wants to get across the bleakness of this war between the Mutants and Humans/Machines. But this also makes me curious where the Ascension era fits into to all this considering it's post-war.

I think it's hinting towards a Human vs Mutant vs Machine war event, that then ties into Warlocke's people becoming involved because the Sentinels try to enact a pre-mature Ascension. I mean, there's got to be a reason why in the DoX Cyclops has the main squad going into space.

You'll go nuts if you think about it logically. To hold something the size of the Mother mold, that control collar had to have been huge. Wolverine's claws are only seventeen inches long and their penetrating power ends at his knuckles and his reach ends with his stubby arms. If he slashed the side of a house, would the house suddenly slide apart in two pieces? No. Wolverine's claws make no sense.

Lol, I just assumed he went berserker fury on it and his adamantium claws worked like a really hot knife through melting butter!

as to my favorite parts in this issue is was that the x-men really care about each other and thats what made this issue the most amazing for me.

mystique cover Paige's body.
Cyclops closing Warren's eyes
The logan/Kurt scene
Scott wanting to get Jean Home
Monet worrying about Jean in her own way

We also have to remember omega's are a resource so in this world Jean despite what she is capable is not a piece any mutant should just be willing to sacrafice.
In the midst of all that horror you saw the love they had for each other followed up by the x-men morning.

On the flip side you had the robot showing no care to the overally emotional human woman who thinks her lost is so much more than others suffered because her husband died while trying to come up with a way to destroy an entire race of people and she wanted vegnance whereas Charles just wanted his people to live, to have any kind of chance. Beautiful.

Karima was pushing the doctor to act. To make sure the death of the one you loved wasn't for nothing. It was literally the same mindset the X-Men had. Cyclops was closing Warren's eyes, and as he did so effectively said "This is what we signed up for, no time for hesitation."

Yeah, the Doctor wanted vengeance. She's human, and she never thought this would happen.

This is not black and white. Did you forget that the mutants let Sabertooth, a serial killer, do whatever he wants as long as he's useful? Or that they're about to partner up with Sinister?

Mobile Suit X-Men
written by Yoshiyuki "Kill them all" Tomino
directed by Jonathan "Multiverse Brain" Hickman

Lol, pretty much.

When I was a kid in the 80's, I watched Transformers every afternoon and got used to Optimus Prime always winning and always leading his team through ka-raaaazy missions. And then Transformers the movie came out, and they made everything realistic, and it turned out if you get shot by lasers or ambushed from behind by people with guns, you died. All my favorite autobots became corpses, and Optimus Prime died on a workshop table, and I was like "But they survive **** like this all the time, why is everyone dead? Why are there consequences? am I gonna die one day? MOOOOOM!"

Anyway, this is what happens when X-adventures get real.

This made me laugh, because I too was taken aback by the Transformer gore.

This wasn't my dad's Transformers lol.

Heavily implied by her conversation with Kurt last issue that the mutants kicked her out for not being a mutant. You cut a dog loose, you can't complain when she finds a new master.

Nice observation!

Hickman needed fodder to make the suicide bomb have weight and picked a fav and Warren who he'll prolly do something weird with later.

"Erik, this is a real problem."

"Yes."

"Maybe you could go and..."

"I'm the Secretary of State, Charles."

"..."

"Cyclops is the Secretary of Defense, Charles."

"..."

"..."

"Can we send Lor--"

"This conversation is over, Charles."

Likely exactly what happened. They made him disown his other kids, so he ain't losing the one mutant child! "I need grandkids, dammit!"

Teen Jean was part of the Poison hivemind and technically felt every death that occurred in Venomized and she was fine. Saved herself and everyone else, all while building a new body out of TK

Teen Jean literally makes no sense, so not the best example. Regardless, Hive mind means no will of her own. She wasn't conscious at the time.

[Su_Whisterfield]

FFS, Jean propably just didn't want to let her beau go on a suicide mission alone with Wolverine unsupervised, lol.

Pfui, Woverine’s got Kurt. Radiant. With open arms.

[terrancejameson]

Going through this thread, one would forget that

1) Jean was injured in the explosion, and isn't a physically fit soldier like everyone else.

2) She's connecting the minds of 15 people across 10s of millions of miles, while in pain and distress over the fact that her friends were dying.

Her portrayal makes sense given the situation, and the fact that she's not an Omega TK user.

Magneto isn't there because he's one of their 2 supreme leaders. Duh.

I do appreciate seeing the emotion and desperation from the human side. Yes, they cause great suffering towards mutants, but mutants can cause great suffering to humans as well. Are we gonna forget Sabertooth's showing, last issue, as a prime example of that? They fear a new Apocalypse being born, and wiping out humanity. Or that they would be replaced a the top of the food chain.

I think it's a very interesting grey dichotomy.

Speaking of grey....I wonder how Erik feels about his daughter being deemed a criminal and a pretender? I mean, he knows what role he played in her mental break and he knows that she didn't know she wasn't a mutant. I think it's clear, and deliberate that the all the info pages have a mutantkind bias tone to them.

So glad Hickman came back for X-Men, and will be so sad when he leaves.

This part. The only thing I'd add to this appears that Hickman perfectly crafted this scene to replicate Jean's traumatic power manifestation. Here she witnessed all of her teammates die. Not only is she telepathically linked to them all as they experience their last moments, she shares the moment with them and all of the people she's communicating with back on earth. She emotionally mature enough to compartmentalize enough to maintain the link in stead of breaking down completely. What happened here take unimaginable emotional and mental fortitude. She is no slouch. I just can't believe so many of her fans are quick to write this showing off as utterly weak and emotionally stunted. She's physically injured, emotionally shaken and mentally stressed to the umpteenth power. It seems to me most of her fans were spoiled by X-Men Red to believe that the telepathic, untouchable goddess is nerfed here. Hickman knew exactly what he was doing. Jean was flexing telepathically and that isnt enough for her fans.