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  1. #16
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Spectacular Spider-Man, Spider-Man PS4, Into the Spider-Verse, Ultimate Spider-Man. There's really only so many ways we can answer the same question, you know?
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  2. #17
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    The Spectacular Spider-Man Animated Series. Nothing else comes close.

  3. #18
    Incredible Member Hybrid's Avatar
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    Censorship issues aside, how would you rank Spider-Man: The Animated Series in capturing the Spider-Man character and mythos?

  4. #19
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    Censorship issues aside, how would you rank Spider-Man: The Animated Series in capturing the Spider-Man character and mythos?
    I feel like a lot of people look on the show with a ton of nostalgia. Not totally unwarranted, as the portrayals of the villains were pretty solid as well as Peter's voice. But I don't know: I think someone else mentioned how much they really adapted and changed from the source material for little to no reason. One of the biggest being Electro being Red Skull's son (spoilers for a 20+ year old show lol), and Mary Jane being a Hydro-Clone (that was really strange), plus Green Goblin showing up after Hobgoblin, and so on and so on. It was just weird! But I enjoyed it as a kid, that's for sure.
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  5. #20
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    Censorship issues aside, how would you rank Spider-Man: The Animated Series in capturing the Spider-Man character and mythos?
    The animation quality, character design and art-style is poor. Too overlit and garish.

    It adapted a lot of stories and bits from the comics but I don't think they ever got the spirit of it right. I think the adaptation of Venom in particular was very weak. Spectacular improved on that several times over.

    Of course, it's a successful show and it introduced the character to a lot of people, but I don't think it's completely satisfying. Not the way it ended at any rate.

  6. #21
    Mighty Member Uncanny Mutie's Avatar
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    Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon and PS4 game.

  7. #22
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    The animation quality, character design and art-style is poor. Too overlit and garish.

    It adapted a lot of stories and bits from the comics but I don't think they ever got the spirit of it right. I think the adaptation of Venom in particular was very weak. Spectacular improved on that several times over.

    Of course, it's a successful show and it introduced the character to a lot of people, but I don't think it's completely satisfying. Not the way it ended at any rate.
    The animation was trash. I can't tell you how many times they literally re-used the exact animation or scene of Spider-Man swinging, someone running through walls, what have you. It was crazy.
    Venom I'll disagree with there, as to this day, he's still one of the better adapted characters on that show. Was he really dangerous? I wouldn't think so. Entertaining as hell? Hell yeah lol

    But for the most part, I agree with you. The ending was all sorts of crazy/weird, and the storyline as a whole was off.
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  8. #23
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    The show introduced Venom better than the comics did, by having Eddie Brock around as a supporting character with reasons to hate Peter/Spider-Man, and tying the symbiote origin into the Spider-Man lore via John Jameson, rather than the outlandish Battleworld/Secret Wars.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebSlingWonder View Post
    The animation was trash. I can't tell you how many times they literally re-used the exact animation or scene of Spider-Man swinging, someone running through walls, what have you. It was crazy.
    Venom I'll disagree with there, as to this day, he's still one of the better adapted characters on that show. Was he really dangerous? I wouldn't think so. Entertaining as hell? Hell yeah lol

    But for the most part, I agree with you. The ending was all sorts of crazy/weird, and the storyline as a whole was off.
    The other problem with that series was that it was heavily serialized. That's not in theory a bad thing and when done well (like Justice League Unlimited in the final three seasons) it can be magic, but it wasn't done well in the Fox show. Episodes bled into each other and often in the most clunky way. To the point that nothing felt satisfying. Resolution for one plot and subplot didn't have room to breathe since immediately the show moved to some other future plot and it was jarringly done.

    Weisman's Spectacular run also had serialization but it was something more carefully built up, and individual episodes could be appreciated on its own, and even if it got cancelled, both seasons ended well and was fairly satisfying in my view.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    The show introduced Venom better than the comics did, by having Eddie Brock around as a supporting character with reasons to hate Peter/Spider-Man, and tying the symbiote origin into the Spider-Man lore via John Jameson, rather than the outlandish Battleworld/Secret Wars.
    A venom symbiote on the Moon doesn't have any sense of grandeur and mystery to it as opposed to Peter finding it on a smorgasbord world forged by a god that can give you anything one desires. And in any case eventually they adapted Secret Wars anyway for the little it was worth.

    And I disagree...no adaptation has ever beaten or exceeded Venom's introduction in the comics in ASM#299-300.
    Last edited by Revolutionary_Jack; 09-05-2019 at 08:31 PM.

  10. #25
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    The other problem with that series was that it was heavily serialized. That's not in theory a bad thing and when done well (like Justice League Unlimited in the final three seasons) it can be magic, but it wasn't done well in the Fox show. Episodes bled into each other and often in the most clunky way. To the point that nothing felt satisfying. Resolution for one plot and subplot didn't have room to breathe since immediately the show moved to some other future plot and it was jarringly done.

    Weisman's Spectacular run also had serialization but it was something more carefully built up, and individual episodes could be appreciated on its own, and even if it got cancelled, both seasons ended well and was fairly satisfying in my view.



    A venom symbiote on the Moon doesn't have any sense of grandeur and mystery to it as opposed to Peter finding it on a smorgasbord world forged by a god that can give you anything one desires. And in any case eventually they adapted Secret Wars anyway for the little it was worth.

    And I disagree...no adaptation has ever beaten or exceeded Venom's introduction in the comics in ASM#299-300.
    Right you are, amigo. "Final Curtain" definitely had that "series finale" feel (even when we didn't want it to end) because Weisman knew how to tell a story.
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  11. #26
    Incredible Member Hybrid's Avatar
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    Yeah, I'll admit I'm pretty nostalgic for the show but a lot of it hasn't aged well. What strikes me as odd is that I can't even claim the people making it were ignorant or apathetic of the source (in the same way I could with DCEU or FoX-Men). There's some deep cut references to the Spider-Man lore and unexpected characters, attempts to try something different to keep you on your toes, and create a distilled mythos unique of their own. The people there loved Spider-Man. In fact, the reason Spidey never punched people was not a case of censorship, but to make his fights more visually dynamic.

    So... I guess they just didn't have the talent to pull it off?

    Because everything I described what Spider-Man: TAS did is what Spider-Man PS4 did, only PS4 hit it out of the park.

  12. #27
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    Yeah, I'll admit I'm pretty nostalgic for the show but a lot of it hasn't aged well. What strikes me as odd is that I can't even claim the people making it were ignorant or apathetic of the source (in the same way I could with DCEU or FoX-Men). There's some deep cut references to the Spider-Man lore and unexpected characters, attempts to try something different to keep you on your toes, and create a distilled mythos unique of their own. The people there loved Spider-Man. In fact, the reason Spidey never punched people was not a case of censorship, but to make his fights more visually dynamic.

    So... I guess they just didn't have the talent to pull it off?

    Because everything I described what Spider-Man: TAS did is what Spider-Man PS4 did, only PS4 hit it out of the park.
    I wouldn't even say talent: just kind of that same thing where they wanted to subvert expectations and all that to make their own thing. Problem is with Spider-Man, no previous show got it completely on point with his mythos (more adding things than being comprehensive), so their method of creating the show didn't hold up because it was an adaptation, not a retelling if that makes sense. Spider-Man PS4 also adds things, but didn't go out of it's way to directly contradict certain aspects of the mythos (except for Doc Ock and MJ, I'm aware). Barring a few elements, I could totally see that story being told in a regular Spider-Man comic, which is the point. Not so much with the 90s show.
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  13. #28
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hybrid View Post
    Yeah, I'll admit I'm pretty nostalgic for the show but a lot of it hasn't aged well. What strikes me as odd is that I can't even claim the people making it were ignorant or apathetic of the source (in the same way I could with DCEU or FoX-Men). There's some deep cut references to the Spider-Man lore and unexpected characters, attempts to try something different to keep you on your toes, and create a distilled mythos unique of their own. The people there loved Spider-Man. In fact, the reason Spidey never punched people was not a case of censorship, but to make his fights more visually dynamic.

    So... I guess they just didn't have the talent to pull it off?

    Because everything I described what Spider-Man: TAS did is what Spider-Man PS4 did, only PS4 hit it out of the park.
    It’s possible to be a fan of something and still fall short.

    The problem with Spider-Man cartoons is that Marvel tend to use it as a vehicle for toy commercials or for promoting their entire line through it. This dates back to Amazing Friends but the Fox cartoon isn’t immune though it’s better than that awful in name only dreck ultimate cartoon which didn’t feel like Spider-Man after a while.

    What you don’t get is people trying to do the characters right.

    But you know in general Marvel is bad at cartoons. DC cartoons are better. And the only Marvel cartoons in that league animation and writing wise is Weisman’s spectacular and Xmen evolution.

  14. #29
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    It’s possible to be a fan of something and still fall short.

    The problem with Spider-Man cartoons is that Marvel tend to use it as a vehicle for toy commercials or for promoting their entire line through it. This dates back to Amazing Friends but the Fox cartoon isn’t immune though it’s better than that awful in name only dreck ultimate cartoon which didn’t feel like Spider-Man after a while.

    What you don’t get is people trying to do the characters right.

    But you know in general Marvel is bad at cartoons. DC cartoons are better. And the only Marvel cartoons in that league animation and writing wise is Weisman’s spectacular and Xmen evolution.
    Don't forget Avengers: EMH, Wolverine and the X-Men, and Iron Man: Armored Adventures. Basically, if it's made for Marvel, but not by Marvel, it's likely going to be a lot better, which is a damn shame lol
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  15. #30
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    The Raimi trilogy (minus 3) and Insomniac video-games.

    There are differences with 616, but they are marginal. For the most part they managed to get the spirit of a good Spidey read: Peter and Spider-Man's lives are going to crash.

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