HoX: Should the crew of the Orchis Forge be considered 'Innocent Civilians'?

[Triniking1234]

That's a tad pessimistic. If a society is that afraid of mutants getting together to overthrow humanity that they need giant killer robots to 'keep mutants in check' Then that society obviously ain't treating the Mutants right,

Well, Namor did flood New York.

And Magneto did almost nuke everybody.

so...

[hawkeyefan]

We are assuming high kill count numbers? It doesn't work like that But if we are doing this How many people has Ultron killed is Hank Pym responsible for that? How many people got killed because Hydra Cap? How many people died in Hulk rampage and save the subconscious he protects stop himself thing. Didn't Illuminati kill some worlds? The point is even the "good" Superhumans have solid body counts.

Now that I think about it all a bit, the mutant villains are pretty tame. Luckily they have those horrible humans to pose an actual threat!


But I'm honestly just messing around.

To be serious for a moment on this topic, I don't think that we have reason to believe that Orchis is in any way sanctioned. It seems made up of former members of many clandestine organizations. But is it actually answering to any world power? We have nothing that says it is. So therefore, anyone who is involved to the point where they are flown to Venus to board an orbital station where they are building weapons to curtail the mutant threat....well, they've made their decision, and I don't think any of them would be considered what we'd call innocent in that regard.

Having said that, however, I can't blame the X-Men for trying to hold life as precious. Even the lives of those that hate and fear them. It's kind of their thing, and kind of key if there is ever to be a de-escalation of hostilities. If they respond in kind, then all that happens is escalation, which continues until one side is dead.

It'll take one side to begin some kind of rolling back of hostilities.

[HeartofTheStoriesWeTell]

Now that I think about it all a bit, the mutant villains are pretty tame. Luckily they have those horrible humans to pose an actual threat!


But I'm honestly just messing around.

To be serious for a moment on this topic, I don't think that we have reason to believe that Orchis is in any way sanctioned. It seems made up of former members of many clandestine organizations. But is it actually answering to any world power? We have nothing that says it is. So therefore, anyone who is involved to the point where they are flown to Venus to board an orbital station where they are building weapons to curtail the mutant threat....well, they've made their decision, and I don't think any of them would be considered what we'd call innocent in that regard.

Having said that, however, I can't blame the X-Men for trying to hold life as precious. Even the lives of those that hate and fear them. It's kind of their thing, and kind of key if there is ever to be a de-escalation of hostilities. If they respond in kind, then all that happens is escalation, which continues until one side is dead.

It'll take one side to begin some kind of rolling back of hostilities.

Who set up orchis? I mean shield and sword agents are not being pulled by some red neck hick....

[jwatson]

Well, Namor did flood New York.

And Magneto did almost nuke everybody.

so...

Humans are destroying Namors home and killing his people as a byproduct.

And Humans did gas magneto's people and put him in a concentration camp.

so...

[Agent Z]

Well, Namor did flood New York.

And Magneto did almost nuke everybody.

so...

Yeah, something that gets ignored is that Namor was the Marvel public's first encounter with superhumans. When you're introduced to mutants by having them attempt to drown New York, it doesn't make a good first impression.

Humans are destroying Namors home and killing his people as a byproduct.

And Humans did gas magneto's people and put him in a concentration camp.

so...

The humans didn't even know Namor's people existed. And making your existence known by declaring war is the worst way to air your grievances.

[hawkeyefan]

Who set up orchis? I mean shield and sword agents are not being pulled by some red neck hick....

Given the diverse organizations involved, I don’t know if it’s any one government or the UN, or if it’s more a rogue shadow government kind of thing.

[HeartofTheStoriesWeTell]

Given the diverse organizations involved, I don’t know if it’s any one government or the UN, or if it’s more a rogue shadow government kind of thing.

Considering everything we already know, i think there is a shoe to drop here...so.eone was monitoring bank accounts then put the program into action...someone that has fingers in a lot of pies.

[Wolverine12]

If you’re clever enough to make it on to that team then you’re clever enough to understand the moral implications. Logan had it right. Let ‘em burn.

[BroHomo]

Humans are destroying Namors home and killing his people as a byproduct.

And Humans did gas magneto's people and put him in a concentration camp.

so...

lol riiiiiiight

The humans didn't even know Namor's people existed. And making your existence known by declaring war is the worst way to air your grievances.

ignorance doesn't gurantee innocence

If you’re clever enough to make it on to that team then you’re clever enough to understand the moral implications. Logan had it right. Let ‘em burn.

HA!!! YAS!

[Agent Z]

ignorance doesn't gurantee innocence

In the case of Namor's supposed grievances with humans, it does. You can't complain about your people being killed like it's an act of war when no one knows your people exist.