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  1. #1
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Default Retcon of Retcons?!?!

    I originally was going to make this a thread specifically devoted to a retcon of a retcon I came across last night for the first time. So I will start off with that first. In issues Uncanny Xmen 145-147, Claremont showed the ascension of Ororo to Roguestorm, a being that wielded near infinite power. Roguestorm would easily defeat Dr. Doom and send him cowering in fear the sheer power of her.



    However, Byrne in FF Issue 258, retconned Claremont's doom to actually be a doombot.



    For years, many people who wished to discredit the Roguestorm showing made mention that the Doom the xmen encountered was actually a Doombot:


    Well last night I discovered Al Ewing actually retconned that story back to the original story where Doom was in fact doom and not a doombot.



    As a Storm fan who loved the original story this brought sheer joy to my spirit. The All-Goddess had been redeemed. At any rate. Share your thoughts on this retcon of a retcon or post other instances similar to this where original stories you thought were retconned had been retconned back to it's original storyline.
    Last edited by butterflykyss; 09-11-2019 at 10:17 AM.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  2. #2
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    The Byrne retcon was stupid and an example of a writer being lazy and trying to make someone else's story "fake" instead of working with what's there to get where they need to be. And it was bad for Doom specifically because it made an IN-UNIVERSE MECHANIC for writers to call each other's stories fake.

    The Ewing retcon is genius because it completely fixes the problem while making Victor seem like a smart chessmaster, while also fitting his characterization of being image-obsessed, while also not making him come off like, to quote Chrissy Teigen, a "kitty cat bih".
    Our main character, a socially awkward outcast, gains newfound confidence and arrogance before committing a string of horrid acts. He then wears a fancy suit and proceeds to dance like a maniac to music that isn't actually there playing around him.

  3. #3
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Lets talk Magma aka Amara Aquila aka Alison Crestmere. Originally Claremont wrote it such that Nova Roma was an ancient Roman City in the Amazon but that was retconned in the 90s so that Europeans were kidnapped by Selene and Magma was really a brainwashed girl named Alison. When Claremont returned, he reversed that retconned and had her going back to her original backstory

  4. #4

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    Who is the clone...Strfye of Cable?
    Depends on whose story you read...and cable was never meant to be scott and jeans kid to start...so everything about him is a retcon and a retcon of a retcon...and i bet they retconed that too.
    In the real world i would be BOTH pro registration and Pro mutant rights. Xavier and Trask were both right.

  5. #5
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartofTheStoriesWeTell View Post
    Who is the clone...Strfye of Cable?
    Depends on whose story you read...and cable was never meant to be scott and jeans kid to start...so everything about him is a retcon and a retcon of a retcon...and i bet they retconed that too.
    How is this a retcon of a retcon? Cable was retconned into being Scott's son and that has never been reversed. Stryfe was never Nathan Christopher. X-Cutioners Song left it open ended and that was resolved within a year when the true identity of the kid and clone was revealed in Cable's series. Again, that has not been retconned

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    How is this a retcon of a retcon? Cable was retconned into being Scott's son and that has never been reversed. Stryfe was never Nathan Christopher. X-Cutioners Song left it open ended and that was resolved within a year when the true identity of the kid and clone was revealed in Cable's series. Again, that has not been retconned
    1st retcon- Cable was not related to summers...then they made him related
    2nd retcon- after establishing he was an imperfect clone they made him the orginal.
    During those two Cable did not know his own origin he thought he was from future not present.
    3rd retcon- during there honeymoon cyclops and jean are kidnapped psychicly and sent to the future where they raise cable... at the end when modern Scott goes to tell Cable he says he knew all along they were red and slim...

    Now not only was he NOT there son (said son was not even nathan but charles) but the revelation surprised him when 1st retcon hit...by 3rd retcon he always knew...

    Now i have been out of cable for a while...but there is a younger then we first meet cable but older then when red and slim tought him cable (now people here call him wifi) that is supposed to be more of a retcon too.
    In the real world i would be BOTH pro registration and Pro mutant rights. Xavier and Trask were both right.

  7. #7
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartofTheStoriesWeTell View Post
    1st retcon- Cable was not related to summers...then they made him related
    2nd retcon- after establishing he was an imperfect clone they made him the orginal.
    During those two Cable did not know his own origin he thought he was from future not present.
    3rd retcon- during there honeymoon cyclops and jean are kidnapped psychicly and sent to the future where they raise cable... at the end when modern Scott goes to tell Cable he says he knew all along they were red and slim...

    Now not only was he NOT there son (said son was not even nathan but charles) but the revelation surprised him when 1st retcon hit...by 3rd retcon he always knew...

    Now i have been out of cable for a while...but there is a younger then we first meet cable but older then when red and slim tought him cable (now people here call him wifi) that is supposed to be more of a retcon too.
    thats the thing, there was never a retcon that confirmed him as a clone. X-Cutioner's Song was intentionally vague about what his origin was bc it was to be the hook for Cable's future series

    Cable didnt know Scott and Jean raised him. He put it together prior to their wedding when Scott gave him advice which he acknowledged he had heard before. This was foreshadowing something that Lobdell would later write and he did. Months later, Scott (as Slym) would reiterate the same lines to a young Nate in the Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix, which made the earlier exchange make more sense. In Legion Quest, Cable reveals that he's known the truth for some time, not that he always did.
    Last edited by Havok83; 09-11-2019 at 03:00 PM.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    thats the thing, there was never a retcon that confirmed him as a clone. X-Cutioner's Song was intentionally vague about what his origin was bc it was to be the hook for Cable's future series

    Cable didnt know Scott and Jean raised him. He put it together prior to their wedding when Scott gave him advice which he acknowledged he had heard before. This was foreshadowing something that Nicieza would later write and he did. Months later, Scott (as Slym) would reiterate the same lines to a young Nate in the Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix, which made the earlier exchange make more sense. In Legion Quest, Cable reveals that he's known the truth for some time, not that he always did.
    Seems a bit of a stretch...when they obviously didn't have the future adventures of cyclops and Phenoix worked out too far ahead...

    But i think we are using different ideas of retcon...

    In my mind anytime you retroactively change countnuity you are retconing...is that not how you see it?

    Edit: and that ignores young cable/wifi
    In the real world i would be BOTH pro registration and Pro mutant rights. Xavier and Trask were both right.

  9. #9
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartofTheStoriesWeTell View Post
    Seems a bit of a stretch...when they obviously didn't have the future adventures of cyclops and Phenoix worked out too far ahead...

    But i think we are using different ideas of retcon...

    In my mind anytime you retroactively change countnuity you are retconing...is that not how you see it?

    Edit: and that ignores young cable/wifi
    Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix came out 2 months after Uncanny X-men 310. The two issues were definitely connected and not too far apart from each other.



    I wish I had the image from the mini but this scan is the first hint that Cable has which causes him to put the pieces together. This was clear foreshadowing that makes sense in retrospect

    Yes we have the same idea of retcons but it only happens if something that was clearly established is changed. Cable as a clone wasnt established. Hinted at is not the same thing as he just as easily could have been the original. There was no definitive answer until his series

    Teen Cable's story isnt finished being told so its hard to call that a retcon just yet. He's gonna have to get a mindwipe or amnesia bc he is learning things that Adult Cable didnt have knowledge of

    eta: Found it. It was actually Jean that said the line. Nate overheard her when he was sneaking around

    Last edited by Havok83; 09-11-2019 at 07:51 PM.

  10. #10
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    The Byrne retcon was stupid and an example of a writer being lazy and trying to make someone else's story "fake" instead of working with what's there to get where they need to be. And it was bad for Doom specifically because it made an IN-UNIVERSE MECHANIC for writers to call each other's stories fake.

    The Ewing retcon is genius because it completely fixes the problem while making Victor seem like a smart chessmaster, while also fitting his characterization of being image-obsessed, while also not making him come off like, to quote Chrissy Teigen, a "kitty cat bih".
    this post is 100% spot on. writers should do better within the confines of established canon as opposed to just retconning things they dont like.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  11. #11
    New Mutant TOTALITY's Avatar
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    I think Brian Cronin had a regular feature on his "Comics Should Be Good" blog (does that still exist?) devoted to retcons of retcons, and I think the X-Men supplied a lot of material. Can't remember his name for the feature though.. he also had one on dropped/unresolved plotlines, which, Claremont's could fill a textbook!

    I'm still half expecting Hickman to retcon the infamous Busiek Jean/Phoenix cocoon retcon before HOX/POX is over...

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