View Poll Results: Should they change Magneto's race

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  • Yes: Make him Black

    38 20.43%
  • No: Keep him Jewish White

    148 79.57%
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  1. #451
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    it's just a weaker story. and it's Magneto-in-name-only. i feel that it would be an asterik on even a successful marvel x-men reboot. you should have a problem with it. because it's just as easy to just create a new character who meets those other requirements (being a victim of bosnia, rwandan genocide, etc). introduce Exodus. show in his origin that an elderly Magneto saved him from one of those genocides. flashforward to Exodus choosing to pick up the baton of a long past mutant freedom fighter/terrorist. have him just go way over the top in his crusade against humanity. there. i introduced a contemporary magneto and included the Magneto with his origin intact. took me 3 seconds. if i can do that, what would be anyone else's excuse?
    I like you're Exodus origin by the way. But the problem I have with this is, you're essentially introducing Magneto lite. If Marvel studios is going to be introducing a Charles Xavier (who's likely going to be in his 30's or 40's). It's going to be real awkward that Magneto is not going to be there. Their origins are essentially linked. They became close friends, they built a school together. But they're inevitable falling out. Their difference in ideology is quintessential to the struggle within the mutant community. He is tied to the X Men in many ways.

    Now the idea of replacing Magneto with another character, is an option. I just think that'll be awkward, to introduce a character to take his place all because of not wanting to touch his holocaust origin. I'm not against the idea, this is not a hill that I want to die on. But I trust MCU's judgement, I think if they do bring in Magneto, they'll cast someone who'll do justice to the spirit of the character, but we'll see what happens.

  2. #452
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    This is has been quite a read and there's a lot of passion on both sides. I like Magneto and would rather have some other X-men characters take the spotlight, but I would like to see him someday. That said, on the topic of him being too old. I think that's weak.

    The MCU leans heavily into comicbook craziness, I don't see it as a stretch to have him have met Fabian Cortez or someone at some point and his rejuvenation had a side effect on keeping him in his prime. I'd rather have that than try to modernize him and remove his origins. With so much that this modern audience can accept (time travel, Asgard "magic", full blown M A G I C, infinity gems, Celestials and various aliens, and magitech) I think they can accept a minor explanation to his age without over complicating it.
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  3. #453
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichelleDiMera View Post
    Why isnt Captain America or Wolverine too old? They could be Magneto's father and grandfather age wise.
    Wolverine's healing factor slows his aging. Captain America was frozen in ice and his super soldier serum. I'm not saying they can't do some work-around for Magneto. I just think it'll be awkward considering his history is so tied to Charles Xavier, and it seems like a lot of effort just to keep an origin story. But again, as I've already said I have no idea how the MCU is planning on introducing mutants. So there's a lot of factors we don't know about yet.

  4. #454
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    I work under the assumptions that the whole reason of externals is to introduce the x-gene to the mcu.

    Honestly, use Charles and Erik as cameo artists.

    They keep playing chess in strange locations while they heckle the situation like waldorf and stettler and occasionally meddle in the plot thanks to their powers.

  5. #455

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    Quote Originally Posted by shades of eternity View Post
    I work under the assumptions that the whole reason of externals is to introduce the x-gene to the mcu.

    Honestly, use Charles and Erik as cameo artists.

    They keep playing chess in strange locations while they heckle the situation like waldorf and stettler and occasionally meddle in the plot thanks to their powers.
    i'd be up for that
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  6. #456

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    Quote Originally Posted by Variant View Post
    I like you're Exodus origin by the way. But the problem I have with this is, you're essentially introducing Magneto lite.
    he's a zealot. he exists as an example of Magneto's ability to inspire extremism. he's "lite" in the sense that he lacks the personal motive to do what he does. that's my whole point. people are talking about using Magneto while taking away/changing his formative years. you take that away and you have Exodus. that's why part of my idea was for a Magneto (old, war weary, and on his way out of the game) to personally rescue the mutant who would become Exodus from some kind of genocide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Variant View Post
    If Marvel studios is going to be introducing a Charles Xavier (who's likely going to be in his 30's or 40's).
    but should they? do they need to even? the general audience knows who Professor X is now. he's been parodied in comedy shows. the first scene of the movie theoretically could be Jean addressing the students with a prominent statue of the man who brought them together in the background.

    Quote Originally Posted by Variant View Post
    It's going to be real awkward that Magneto is not going to be there. Their origins are essentially linked.
    only because the movie linked them. "Erik" starts and loses a family prior to meeting Charles in the comics. they are both adults. thematically, both characters can be replaced. all you need are "good" mutants and "evil" mutants.

    Quote Originally Posted by Variant View Post
    They became close friends, they built a school together. But they're inevitable falling out. Their difference in ideology is quintessential to the struggle within the mutant community. He is tied to the X Men in many ways.
    sure. but all of that could be alluded to or shown in flashback; to allow the other characters to get focus. it could be something that SHIELD actively tried to cover up. and they could have been monitoring the school ever since; wondering when mutantkind was going to make its collective move. Magneto could have perished in some underwater cell a long time ago. maybe Pym created something to suppress the x-gene (the guy was alluded to as being a bastard). and that would explain why there isn't much public knowledge of mutantkind. but somewhere along the ilne, Mystique (or someone else who can operate off the radar) has been sabotaging the government's goal of preventing new mutancy. and on the other side of it, Cyclops and the others have been actively looking for any new mutants and providing them sanctuary at the school; galvanized by the renewed activation of the x-gene.

    Quote Originally Posted by Variant View Post
    Now the idea of replacing Magneto with another character, is an option. I just think that'll be awkward, to introduce a character to take his place all because of not wanting to touch his holocaust origin. I'm not against the idea, this is not a hill that I want to die on. But I trust MCU's judgement, I think if they do bring in Magneto, they'll cast someone who'll do justice to the spirit of the character, but we'll see what happens.
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  7. #457
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    More like...

    "Most Likely Will Never Happen..."
    Yeah, there's a good bet that's how it'll turn out. Guess some people really want to be offended by a rumor, and others really want to be offended by people being offended.

    Quote Originally Posted by MichelleDiMera View Post
    Why isnt Captain America or Wolverine too old? They could be Magneto's father and grandfather age wise.
    Cap is a "man out of time." Increasing the timespan he was frozen before being revived changes little about him. Wolverine just gets older and older (or rather, his lifespan increases), but since it was established fairly early on that he was really long-lived (and usually doesn't remember his past), that also doesn't change the character much. In the case of Magneto, he was ostensibly "normal" outside of his mutant powers, hence why it becomes harder and harder to have him continuing to live in the normal day as a Holocaust survivor; nothing in his backstory lends itself to him surviving in the modern day. There's a reason he was an old man in the films.
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  8. #458
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    I think what's most interesting about this thread topic is the timing of it. Mutants as Hickman is writing them are done seeking assimilation or acceptance into the human world. They are primed to take their place as the humanity's replacement. They are done seeking acceptance from humans. They are done watching as their children are murder in the streets by the repressive apparatus. They're done asking for tokenized representation. They are done asking for humans to accept them. It's now a mutant requirement.

    I think this is particularly interesting because it gives us a chance to look at THIS DEFINITIVE version of Magneto as he's currently portrayed in comics and ask if he would be down with a mediocre racebend shenanigan trip in order to feel heard, accepted and loved by the society that has vilified his people for as long as he's been alive.

    Would this Magneto feel pride because he was thrown a bone as a more intersectional mutant representative all the while knowing the mutants that were already on the roster are treated like less than dirt? Inquiring minds would like to know....

  9. #459

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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Cap is a "man out of time." Increasing the timespan he was frozen before being revived changes little about him. Wolverine just gets older and older (or rather, his lifespan increases), but since it was established fairly early on that he was really long-lived (and usually doesn't remember his past), that also doesn't change the character much. In the case of Magneto, he was ostensibly "normal" outside of his mutant powers, hence why it becomes harder and harder to have him continuing to live in the normal day as a Holocaust survivor; nothing in his backstory lends itself to him surviving in the modern day. There's a reason he was an old man in the films.
    if they had to do it (and i'm not saying that they should), they could always make Magneto a man out of time; plucked from the past and deposited into the MCU present maybe 5 years back from the present day. he'd more or less be a traumatized individual with fresh memories of the Holocaust and Anya's death; making him paranoid and dangerous because of his abilities. it could even be due to the machinations of a bigger threat; like Kang (inserting a little chaos into the timestream in preparation for his conquest). but, from there, it would be this man out of time's evolution into Magneto mutant terrorist leader. you could leave every one else much the same. Xavier could be as young as they want. the good thing about it is that it makes for a great contrast to Steve Rogers. Steve didn't know what to do with himself until being given a new mission. because, at his heart, he's a soldier. same with Magneto. he's mission oriented. he would see that the nazis lost/that they died; leaving him with no outlet for his aggression. so he'd inadvertently escalate the war between humanity and mutantkind; whereas Xavier would have been actively hiding mutants (maybe even using his telepathy to keep their existence quiet). just imagine Magneto visiting the United States for the first time and seeing someone talking about detention centers (or the Sokovia accords) on the television. how would he react?

    Last edited by Michael Watkins; 09-18-2019 at 11:09 AM.
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  10. #460
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    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    I think what's most interesting about this thread topic is the timing of it. Mutants as Hickman is writing them are done seeking assimilation or acceptance into the human world. They are primed to take their place as the humanity's replacement. They are done seeking acceptance from humans. They are done watching as their children are murder in the streets by the repressive apparatus. They're done asking for tokenized representation. They are done asking for humans to accept them. It's now a mutant requirement.
    I mean, I think this is likely being set up to Go Horribly Wrong in some way in the next few years, so...

  11. #461
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    he's a zealot. he exists as an example of Magneto's ability to inspire extremism. he's "lite" in the sense that he lacks the personal motive to do what he does. that's my whole point. people are talking about using Magneto while taking away/changing his formative years. you take that away and you have Exodus. that's why part of my idea was for a Magneto (old, war weary, and on his way out of the game) to personally rescue the mutant who would become Exodus from some kind of genocide.
    You could do it that way. I just can't imagine MCU going down that route. Magneto is a great foil and such an important prominent character in the X-Men mythos. If they're going to be introducing the X-Men into the Cinematic universe. I can't imagine them not using Magneto, or placing a different character as a substitute because they don't want to modernize Magneto origin story.


    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    but should they? do they need to even? the general audience knows who Professor X is now. he's been parodied in comedy shows. the first scene of the movie theoretically could be Jean addressing the students with a prominent statue of the man who brought them together in the background.
    Well, who knows? I'm just assuming the MCU is going to using Xavier, but they certainly don't have to. Like I said, I don't know what their plans are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    only because the movie linked them. "Erik" starts and loses a family prior to meeting Charles in the comics. they are both adults. thematically, both characters can be replaced. all you need are "good" mutants and "evil" mutants.
    They can certainly replace both. I just think it'll be kind of awkward if they do that. And I find it hard to imagine Marvel Studios not utilizing either character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    sure. but all of that could be alluded to or shown in flashback; to allow the other characters to get focus. it could be something that SHIELD actively tried to cover up. and they could have been monitoring the school ever since; wondering when mutantkind was going to make its collective move. Magneto could have perished in some underwater cell a long time ago. maybe Pym created something to suppress the x-gene (the guy was alluded to as being a bastard). and that would explain why there isn't much public knowledge of mutantkind. but somewhere along the ilne, Mystique (or someone else who can operate off the radar) has been sabotaging the government's goal of preventing new mutancy. and on the other side of it, Cyclops and the others have been actively looking for any new mutants and providing them sanctuary at the school; galvanized by the renewed activation of the x-gene.
    It's a good theory as any. I'm REALLY looking forward to seeing how they're going to introduce Mutants into MCU canon. I'm more leaning to the theory that there's going to be a triggering event of some sort that awakens the Mutant gene. Someone mentions the Eternals being responsible which I think is pretty cool. But I'm sure Marvel will take their time with it, tease with news reporters about the strange mutant phenomenon in the background or something. I dunno, but I'm really interested to see how they're going to do it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
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    lol. I'm not saying they're perfect. But no one can deny the MCU's batting average has been pretty darn good for the most part. Especially in terms of respecting the spirit of most of their characters, and their casting has been spot on. Their success in 2019 alone. 3 of their films have reached the billion dollar mark. In my opinion, considering what they've achieved, they've earned the benefit of the doubt. I love Michael Fassbender and I loved how he portrayed Magneto. But I also understand new universe, new studio, they'll likely recast. IF they do decide to use Magneto, I trust Marvel to respect and do right by the character.
    Last edited by Variant; 09-18-2019 at 02:28 PM.

  12. #462
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    To me the question is not about Magneto being black or white. The question is about what is the backstory that drives the man. We already have time displaced characters like Captain America and Bucky so I get why Marvel may not want to continue to do down that road. Thus, the issue is WW2 as a back story for Magneto would make him much too old. Not to mention the WW2 angle has been done to death in the X-men and other movies as well.

    So for me, the MCU needs to center his story around his survival of a genocide or a world gone mad whether that event is real (Kosovo, Rwanda, etc.) or imagined (Sokovia Accords Civil War). If the decision is ground in making his back story relevant and current then the issue of race takes care of itself IMO.
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  13. #463
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    Then don't have Magneto show up as a man

    Have him show up as a legend.

    Have people walking around with those magneto was right t-shirts.

    have the x-men fight exodus, fabian cortez, etc whom keep talking about magneto, but not actually have him show up,

    and have paintings of him in full supervillain atire in both the school of the gifted and in many super-villain mutant lairs.

    Have him exist as a myth that exists way back to ww2 and explains why many mutants keep crying "never again."

    It fixes both problems and gives the option to use Magneto at some later date when the time is right.

  14. #464
    Astonishing Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shades of eternity View Post
    Then don't have Magneto show up as a man

    Have him show up as a legend.


    But now we’re discussing introducing X-Men as over 30 superpowered agents. Secretive MiB where everyone is Agent X.

  15. #465
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    If you are going to change him to Black, then I dont see the point in keeping him Jewish. That carries weight bc of the Holocaust and his personal trauma but if he is a different race and didnt experience that, then theres no point in keeping him Jewish

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