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  1. #31
    Invincible Member MindofShadow's Avatar
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    RAMBO was a masterpiece.

    Is Last Blood on that level or not?

    Gonna see it regardless, just curious.


    So, people that liked RAMBO, was Last Blood any good? If you didn't like RAMBO, I don't really care about yoru thoughts
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  2. #32
    Extraordinary Member Jokerz79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    RAMBO was a masterpiece.

    Is Last Blood on that level or not?

    Gonna see it regardless, just curious.


    So, people that liked RAMBO, was Last Blood any good? If you didn't like RAMBO, I don't really care about yoru thoughts
    The fairest review I've seen so far no spoilers outside of stuff in trailers.


  3. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    RAMBO was a masterpiece.

    Is Last Blood on that level or not?

    Gonna see it regardless, just curious.


    So, people that liked RAMBO, was Last Blood any good? If you didn't like RAMBO, I don't really care about yoru thoughts
    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    RAMBO was a masterpiece.

    Is Last Blood on that level or not?

    Gonna see it regardless, just curious.


    So, people that liked RAMBO, was Last Blood any good? If you didn't like RAMBO, I don't really care about yoru thoughts
    I saw it on Saturday at a 4DX theater and thought it was great. At the end of Rambo 4, we see John returning to Arizona and the Rambo homestead. Last Blood picks up with Rambo working as a rancher as he raises up show horses. The intro reminded me a bit of the beginning of Rambo III--albeit the horse training in Last Blood is quite a bit tamer than stick fighting in Thailand. But where he had once found peace living a simple life in a Thai monastery, Last Blood shows that he has living the simple life at his father's homestead ranch.

    The movie has a Rotten Tomatoes critic score of 28% but a verified audience score currently at 86%. So that may tell you something. From several of the reviews I have read, it's clear that many critics just completely lack a basic understanding of the subject matter. I've read reviews decrying the Rambo series overall as displays of jingoistic patriotism or that they just "glorify killing brown people"--both of which couldn't be further from the truth. First Blood depicted a soldier returning from Vietnam facing small town prejudice resulting his shabby appearance and a nation full of leftists who spit on him and called him a baby killer. Part 2 was anything but a patriotic screed--he and the surviving POWs that he was trying to rescue were betrayed by his own government. Rambo III, set during the height of the cold war, could be seen as the most "patriotic" among the five films, as he spends his time fighting in Afghanistan against brutal soviets alongside the Mujahideen. But the driving impetus in Rambo III is not blinding patriotism, but instead his overwhelming loyalty to Colonel Trautman. As a character, John Rambo has a well established history of being 100% loyal and willing to lay his life on the line to save the people who have treated him well--whether it was Col. Trautman or the orphan Afghani boy Hamid in Rambo III or the beautiful Co-Bao in Part 2.

    I have seen other critics call Last Blood "racist right wing propaganda" and incorrectly saying that the film depicts all Mexicans as violent criminals. It seems these critics have a political ax to grind, because they're clearly ignoring the Mexican-American family that Rambo cares for, and the good people in Mexico who help him along the way. The adopted niece of Rambo, Gabrielle is college bound and has a bright future, but her downfall is her need to know why her biological father left her as a child. The grandmother, Maria, cares for Rambo and Gabrielle, and shows the compassion, smarts and attitude of many an abuela I know here in Texas. One complaint I've read, which does have some merit if you've spent time along the Southern border, is that Maria and Gabriella consistently refer to "going to Mexico" when arguing over whether it's safe for Gabriella to try to reconnect with her biological dad--I give this a pass as most moviegoers wont necessarily understand the good and bad areas, cities or neighborhoods (for example, it would probably be more accurate if they had said Nogales).

    Things go bad for Gabrielle and she is taken by an evil cartel and forced into sex trafficking. While Rambo is on his way to rescue his kidnapped niece, he rushes into harms way and is brutally assaulted by the cartel. But he is saved by a Mexican independent journalist Carmen, played by Paz Vega, and his wounds treated by a Mexican doctor. These characters show the good side of the Mexican struggle against the cartels, and also work mirror certain characters from prior Rambo movies. Much like how Co-Bao infiltrated the Vietnamese prison camp to rescue Rambo, Carmen went out of her way to rescue John. Another common theme throughout all Rambo movies has been pragmatic good people urging Rambo to be realistic and not throw his life away fighting against what appears to be overwhelming odds and evil men. Carmen pleads to John not to go against the cartel by himself. But we know our Rambo.

    All in all, I'm not sure why certain critics choose to ignore the good people and instead falsely equate all Mexicans to gang or cartel members. To be clear, there are good people and there are evil people. The cartel that takes Gabrielle and forces her and other young girls into sex trafficking reflects a real problem that we face along the Southern border. We saw that conflict the only time Marvel sent a Spider-man to my home town of Houston--where Kaine Parker fights and destroys sex traffickers. Just because Rambo goes to fight a sex trafficking Mexican cartel, that doesn't make the movie racist. That would be like someone making a misplaced argument that Tarantino was racist in portraying all white Southerners as evil slave holders in Django Unchained. If we can understand that Tarantino wasn't trying to cast all white people as evil slavers (but yes, the actual slavers were cartoonishly evil), then why is it so hard to comprehend that Rambo isn't trying to depict all Mexicans as evil violent cartel members?

    And to address the last complaint that I've seen "critics" repeatedly make--that Last Blood portrays trope of the damsel in distress. Well, sure it does--rescuing those in need is what Rambo does. In Part 2 he went back to Vietnam to rescue POWs that had been left behind (and he also required some rescuing of his own thanks to Co-Bao!). In Rambo III, he is rescuing his Colonel who is repeatedly tortured by the Soviets. The rescue story archetype is not new -- you can create a new word like "fridging" but that doesn't change the fact that it is an archetype that is seen throughout all of human history and told across all civilizations, from Andromeda to St. George and the dragon to Sita. From Mario's quest to rescue Princess Peach to Link's journey to save Zelda. Sure, it's a trope, but it's something that humans have told and enjoyed for millennia.

    All in all, I'd give Last Blood a solid B. There were certain things that I would have changed to improve pacing, but to go into it further would spoil the fun. The violence was extreme, and was directed against the legitimately bad guys. We get to see Rambo make his classic traps in a movie montage that hearkens back to those we loved from the 80s. What made me really enjoy it this weekend was seeing the film at a 4DX theater.

    About the 4DX format: It was my first time seeing a movie in this new viewing format, and at first I was quite unsure if I would care for it. I'm a taller person, and initially I was not sure if my long legs would feel comfortable in the footrest which seemed a bit short for my liking. Once the action started, I held onto my popcorn and enjoyed the ride. The seats rumble, and rock back and forth to fit the action on screen. When Rambo made use of his many knives (hammers and other instruments), I could feel the lumbar sharply adjust in my seat--it was a bit unnerving, but ultimately added to the apprehension shown on screen. Jets of air from the seatback simulated arrows flying past your ear from Rambo's trademark bow handiwork. And when John Rambo made those evil sex traffickers explode, the seats in front produced a fine mist. I certainly wouldn't want to see Downton Abby in 4DX, but for a movie like Last Blood, it was the right viewing format for me!

  4. #34
    Extraordinary Member Cyke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBlueThunder View Post
    ~snip~
    Suspicious review is suspicious.

    But the political read of it can't be ignored or swept away -- even Rambo's creator David Morreli, himself a Reagan conservative, is trying to distance himself from the movie, and he retweeted reviews that called it a gory Trumpian fantasy.

    ----

    Anyway, if you told me 20 or even 30 (!) years ago that a film with the premise of Downton Abbey would obliterate a Rambo film at the box office, I wouldn't have believed you. But here we are, and my how times have changed.
    Last edited by Cyke; 09-23-2019 at 09:55 AM.

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Suspicious review is suspicious.

    ----

    Anyway, if you told me 20 or even 30 (!) years ago that a film with the premise of Downton Abbey would obliterate a Rambo film at the box office, I wouldn't have believed you. But here we are, and my how times have changed.
    Howdy, I'm new here! I've mostly been a lurker on the collected editions forum for release dates and whatnot.

    And yeah, I had a laugh with an older lady who said she was celebrating her birthday by seeing Rambo (she chuckled when I raised an eyebrow and said "Downton abby?") I'm mostly surprised that Rambo made as much as Ad Astra (both about $19 million). I had figured another space movie, this time with Brad Pitt and Tommy Lee Jones, would rake in the box office cash. That's one that I'm debating whether I want to see in 4DX or IMAX.

  6. #36
    Extraordinary Member Jokerz79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Suspicious review is suspicious.

    But the political read of it can't be ignored or swept away -- even Rambo's creator David Morreli, himself a Reagan conservative, is trying to distance himself from the movie, and he retweeted reviews that called it a gory Trumpian fantasy.

    ----

    Anyway, if you told me 20 or even 30 (!) years ago that a film with the premise of Downton Abbey would obliterate a Rambo film at the box office, I wouldn't have believed you. But here we are, and my how times have changed.
    Thing is this script was originally written for Rambo 4 and even in 2009 Stallone was shopping this script with all elements of the girl and Mexican Sex Traffickers around. So Stallone didn't make this based on current politics.

    I get why the writer hates it his character was an indictment on war and it effects on soldiers not glorifying the brutality tought soldiers.

    As for the Box Office Downton Abbey was an incredibly popular show that only ended 4 years ago vs Rambo a franchise who heyday was at least 25 to 30 years ago I don't understand why people would think Rambo would beat it. Also Downton beat by almost the same margine Ad Astra.

  7. #37
    Northern Lights Beaubier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    RAMBO was a masterpiece.

    Is Last Blood on that level or not?

    Gonna see it regardless, just curious.


    So, people that liked RAMBO, was Last Blood any good? If you didn't like RAMBO, I don't really care about yoru thoughts
    I loved RAMBO. Last Blood sucks and is easily the worst out of the series. I was very disappointed.

  8. #38
    Astonishing Member Frobisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Suspicious review is suspicious.

    But the political read of it can't be ignored or swept away -- even Rambo's creator David Morreli, himself a Reagan conservative, is trying to distance himself from the movie, and he retweeted reviews that called it a gory Trumpian fantasy.

    ----

    Anyway, if you told me 20 or even 30 (!) years ago that a film with the premise of Downton Abbey would obliterate a Rambo film at the box office, I wouldn't have believed you. But here we are, and my how times have changed.
    Agreed that review is suspicious on the level of a-child-on-another-child’s-shoulders-in-a-long-coat-trying-to-buy-booze level suspicious.

  9. #39
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Havent seen the movie so I cant speak to the context. But I assume the Mexicans hes killing are Cartell members? I mean I get it but at the same time the idea you cant have Mexican Cartell members or Muslim Terrorists without a movie being called racist propaganda. Can black people plays crips and Bloods anymore or would that be racist. Now when you constantly have the white hero fighting the evil colored people its problematic. So depends on the context of the movie. Havent seen this so cant say. Is it that bad?

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    Havent seen the movie so I cant speak to the context. But I assume the Mexicans hes killing are Cartell members? I mean I get it but at the same time the idea you cant have Mexican Cartell members or Muslim Terrorists without a movie being called racist propaganda. Can black people plays crips and Bloods anymore or would that be racist. Now when you constantly have the white hero fighting the evil colored people its problematic. So depends on the context of the movie. Havent seen this so cant say. Is it that bad?
    Well in First Blood Rambo had a Native American father and Italian American mother (part 2 made that Native American Italian/German descent). To me, because I consider this film along with the past 4 movies, I've never considered Rambo a character driven in any way by racial animus--in part 2 we see one of the first few characters that Rambo puts his trust in with Co-Bao. Rambo III we see him living in a Buddhist monastery, and then fighting alongside the afghanis against the evil Soviets to rescue his Colonel (and he gave the boy Hamid the green pendant necklace that Co gave him in the prior movie for good luck).

    In Last Blood we see that, after returning to the old Rambo family homestead in Arizona (at the end of the 2008 Rambo), his family are his Mexican-American friend (Maria, the abuela) and his niece (Maria's granddaughter) Gabrielle. In all of the Rambo movies, we've seen just a handful of people that Rambo trusts: Colonel Trautman, Co Bau, Mousa Ghani and Hamid from Rambo III, no one in particular from the 2008 movie (I guess he trusts the missionary lady enough to return home), and in Last blood it's Maria and Gabrielle.

    The bad guys are two cartel leaders who are fairly one-dimensional except (without giving away too much of the movie) there's one who is a bit of a caricature of an "evil baddie" who displays no qualms about killing and another leader who ultimately wants to send a message (and also displayed a disturbing ambivalence toward the value of human life). There are basically three other characters in the movie, the independent journalist Mexican woman who helps/saves Rambo, and two other folks that put Gabrielle in her terrible situation (her friend and biological father). And then there are countless nameless cartel thugs.

    The first act of the movie sets things up, and we really don't see much of the typical Rambo violence (he has no chance of fighting and just gets beat down). The second act, he's nursed back to health and goes on a rescue Rampage (think the beginning of John Wick 3 with his book, but instead Rambo has a hammer) [spoiler]and one of my complaints is that the movie abruptly went from a rescue movie to a revenge movie[/spoiler]. And the third act has the typical Rambo violence we've seen in the prior movies, movie montage showing him setting up traps, tunnels, explosions, bow and arrow...what you'd expect from a Rambo film, with a pretty awesome use of The Door's song Five to One during the action.

    I don't think it's one of the best Rambo films, but in retrospect it certainly holds up better than Rambo III, and was about like the 2008 movie which I also enjoyed. I think if you liked the first four Rambo films, you'd enjoy the latest, but everyone's entitled to their opinion (that's what makes us folks each unique).

  11. #41
    Northern Lights Beaubier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    Havent seen the movie so I cant speak to the context. But I assume the Mexicans hes killing are Cartell members? I mean I get it but at the same time the idea you cant have Mexican Cartell members or Muslim Terrorists without a movie being called racist propaganda. Can black people plays crips and Bloods anymore or would that be racist. Now when you constantly have the white hero fighting the evil colored people its problematic. So depends on the context of the movie. Havent seen this so cant say. Is it that bad?
    I mean.. sex trafficking is a huge problem, and the cartel deals in that and does plenty of worse things than even seen in the movie. It’s not like the way they were portrayed in the film is inherently false. I was a little surprised to see these accusations about the movie being a conservative fantasy after I had seen it. Girl gets kidnapped by sex traffickers, Rambo tries to save her. It’s a story grounded in reality, I think people are grasping at straws to call it racist.

    I think the movie sucked. The movie had plenty of problems. But that wasn’t one of them.

  12. #42
    Put a smile on that face Immortal Weapon's Avatar
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    The reviews for this movie reek of bullshit to me. I haven't read or seen one that didn't have a political axe to grind. Kinda like how critics crapped on the first season of the Punisher because it released a few weeks after a mass shooting.

  13. #43
    Fantastic Member RickWJ324's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immortal Weapon View Post
    The reviews for this movie reek of bullshit to me. I haven't read or seen one that didn't have a political axe to grind. Kinda like how critics crapped on the first season of the Punisher because it released a few weeks after a mass shooting.
    Unfortunately, this site (and many others) are full of people with a "political axe to grind". I'm no fan of the Rambo movies (with First Blood being the exception) and would tend to believe that this probably isn't a "good" movie, but I also wouldn't hate on it because of anything politically based. I come to this site to check on comic book news but unfortunately this site seems more and more focused on political agenda then about the escapism of comics.

  14. #44
    Put a smile on that face Immortal Weapon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickWJ324 View Post
    Unfortunately, this site (and many others) are full of people with a "political axe to grind". I'm no fan of the Rambo movies (with First Blood being the exception) and would tend to believe that this probably isn't a "good" movie, but I also wouldn't hate on it because of anything politically based. I come to this site to check on comic book news but unfortunately this site seems more and more focused on political agenda then about the escapism of comics.
    I find it ridiculous that a movie about a man saving a girl from a cartel specializing in human trafficking is somehow a trump supporter power fantasy.

  15. #45
    Astonishing Member Frobisher's Avatar
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    I preferred the old Rambo films that were about apolitical themes like the treatment of veterans in America, or why it is every American’s patriotic duty to destroy every communist rope bridge and hut in the World.

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