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  1. #1
    Always Rakzo
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    Default Flash Forward #1 Discussion/Spoilers

    Heroes in Crisis hurted a lot of characters and none of them was more hurt than Wally West. Tom King and editorial did a character assassination that seems almost impossible to fix and yet Scott Lobdell is willing to give it a try.

    Yes, we all know that Scott Lobdell is a hit and miss writer but his late work on Red Hood has been pretty good, the best Batman book currently in my opinion and so I'm willing to give him a chance here and so far, it seems like a promising beginning.

    The issue opens with a conversation between Wally and Roy in Sanctuary and it makes sense that the latter makes an appearance here due to Lobdell's own work on him. The characterization is pretty solid so far because the writer is not shying away from the problems that happened with Wally in Heroes in Crisis but at the same time he doesn't dwell too much into them to the point of making Wally a total emo, is a logical development in fact and still portrays him as a competent hero.

    And I just loved the references to Wally's own history as The Flash because we see the appearances of many Wally-focused villains in this issue, particularly the ones created by Geoff Johns during his run, villains like Double Down, Murmur, Girder and Tarpit. Plus, we also see the inevitable appearance of Linda who thankfully is at least more conforting than how she appeared in Titans.

    The plot progresses at a nice pace that puts Wally into a new direction and uses a few obscure cosmic characters. Is an interesting route and hope it pays off.

    Brett Booth handles the art and I have my complaints about him but he still creates an energetic tone that is necessary for a Flash book and one has to appreciate his passion for Wally West.

    Solid beginning I would say, I just hope things continue this way.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member WallyWestFlash's Avatar
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    Ok I just read it and Im very torn.

    On one hand it has way too much of the terrible HIC in it. I mean I knew it was going to be in there a bit because it has to but they really went deep into it the whole issue and emphasized it a lot and I really despise it and would rather ignore it as much as possible and almost pretend it never happened.

    On the other hand the art is great. Brett Booth did a fantastic job. As well as the writing, putting aside the material , Lodbell did an amazing job. It really feels like Wally West which since Rebirth has been a hit or miss.

    As well as on the flip side of the major negative of it being very focused on HIC, Lodbell actually does a good job showing Wally dealing with it. I can totally see the real Wally thinking these thoughts and reacting to those events this way. Unlike King in HIC where it NEVER felt like Wally in any way through out, putting aside the weird situation and just concentrating on how Wally would actually react to it.

    If Wally would have been written like this in HIC despite the terrible editorial mandate of sticking Wally in that situation I would have been a lot more OK with it.

    P.S. A few more positives. Putting Wally aside the actual story with the dark multiverse infection, showing that Thanagaranian and the Mobius chair is very inetersting. So once again credit to Scott Lobdell.

    And lastly despite the horrible circumstances it felt really, really good to actually read a solo Wally West comic. Been way too long.
    My name is Wally West. I"m the fastest man alive. I"m the Flash.

    Favorite Heroes - 1-Flash/Wally West, 2-Superman, 3-Green Lantern/Hal Jordan, 4-Nightwing, 5-Hawkman, 6-Firestorm, 7-Supergirl/Linda Danvers, 8-Zatanna, 9-Robin/Tim Drake.

    Currently Reading: All Star Comics, Justice League of America (Satalite years era), Huntress ('89 series)

  3. #3
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Sure they just toss Wally in Blackgate. That makes sense. Overall it was just a typical overwritten Lobdell slog. Recapping HIC for most of its entirety, with story development at the very end.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 09-18-2019 at 08:41 AM.

  4. #4
    Always Rakzo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Sure they just toss Wally in Blackgate. That makes sense. Overall it was just a typical overwritten Lobdell slog. Recapping HIC for most of its entirety, with story development at the very end.
    Nah, that's what King does (Just see Batman this week).

  5. #5
    Wally West Aficionado Spider-Ham's Avatar
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    Like I said earlier :

    I have to say I’m relieved.

    Yes, it hurts to see Wally so depressed but there is so much more ... so much teasing :

    You have fragments from Darkseid War, Multiversity, Sideways, even Rebirth, teasing big stuff. And I think the RetCon is on its way. You can “see” it in the last pages.

    It’s definitely not what we wanted in the first place but I think it’s a good start and I really hope some of you will enjoy the ride.
    Oh and like Rakzo, I loved how Lobdell used Johns' characters. That scene with Murmur was so good ...
    The Flash is not about Tragedy - Wally West Appreciation Thread : 376 pages.
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  6. #6
    Astonishing Member WallyWestFlash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Ham View Post
    Like I said earlier :



    Oh and like Rakzo, I loved how Lobdell used Johns' characters. That scene with Murmur was so good ...
    Murmur's appearance was really cool to see. I feel like Lodbell is making an effort to make it a Wally stor with little things like that.

    He also used very specific Wally villains with Tarpit and Girder.
    My name is Wally West. I"m the fastest man alive. I"m the Flash.

    Favorite Heroes - 1-Flash/Wally West, 2-Superman, 3-Green Lantern/Hal Jordan, 4-Nightwing, 5-Hawkman, 6-Firestorm, 7-Supergirl/Linda Danvers, 8-Zatanna, 9-Robin/Tim Drake.

    Currently Reading: All Star Comics, Justice League of America (Satalite years era), Huntress ('89 series)

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Sure they just toss Wally in Blackgate. That makes sense. Overall it was just a typical overwritten Lobdell slog. Recapping HIC for most of its entirety, with story development at the very end.
    I wonder if writers realize how sketchy and incompetent the JL looks with HiC and how they chose to handle Wally's imprisonment.

  8. #8
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    I had the morbid curiosity factor and wanting to support Wally West books, so I was go for Issue # 1 of this.

    I gotta say, love him or leave him, Lobdell is a writer who can take a MOUNTAIN of lemons and will at least seriously, earnestly, and incorporating more fan-service and easter eggs than you can shake a stick at, try to make some damn lemonade out of it. Here's a book that demands taking a rough story beat from Tom King, and throwing a bunch of rando Geoff Johns, Grant Morrison, Dan DiDio, and Scott Snyder concepts at it. While making it actually be about Wally. Giving him an interior life and reason for being in this story that's so overtly editorially designed.

    And he actually does it.

    Will it turn into a must read monthly? Eh, who knows. But this issue was about Wally West, featured Wally West supporting characters, took his "accident" and turned it into something bigger and "more" (or, unmoored), and celebrates him as the Fastest Man in the Multiverse. And picks up dropped toys from like ... Sideways? Darkseid War? Metal? Who knows what else. And ties into Lobdell's Outlaws/Arsenal work. It's the same impressive juggling act that Steve Orlando did last week with Gotham City Monsters. Some writers just not only "Play in the Shared Universe Sandbox" but like ... really, really play in there.

    And perhaps obviously, in a "duh" moment, it's like ... hey, Dark Matters / New Age of Heroes didn't exactly pop but if you want to explore those concepts with a character like Wally who we've all been yearning for ... maybe we might pay attention to some of those beats? I also think this probably pretty overtly is prelude, or set-up, to whatever Snyder's Metal sequel or next Crisis thing might be.
    Last edited by K. Jones; 09-18-2019 at 11:09 AM.
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  9. #9
    Astonishing Member Badou's Avatar
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    What a fucking mess. Not off to a great start. Just very odd decisions made by Lobdell. Why would they dump Wally in Blackgate of all places? Then do some of the most generic "hero being attacked by villains in prison" stuff which doesn't fit at all. I can't imagine the JL doing that to someone who was suffering from crazy emotional issues and was seeking help. What does throwing him into the worst prison on the planet do for him? It is more examples of DC not understanding their own property.

    I don't think Lobdell was very good on this. His overly long dialogue and story ideas made little sense to me. It is clear he didn't really read HiC or what Wally had been doing in the DCU since he was brought back that closely. Maybe it will get better, but this was not a great start and I am surprised people are so quick to praise Lobdell here. The only hope you have is that they will completely retcon all the garbage that was HiC with going into the multiverse stuff, but I kind of doubt they will be able to do that. So I think people are going to end up disappointed.

  10. #10
    Astonishing Member HsssH's Avatar
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    I was cautiously optimistic about this title when it was announced, but if someone said that it is going to have Dark Multiverse and other stuff that we saw here... I would have been baffled and worried. And yet it worked.

    It truly would be amazing feat if Lobdell managed to create an unique setting for Wally from all these forgotten toys.

  11. #11
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Another thing I didn’t get, no one remembers Wally. That is kind of what started this whole mess for him. Yet all these villains are treated as if they do. The whole issue with Linda is that she no longer lived this life with Wally, but apparently these villains did?
    Last edited by Godlike13; 09-18-2019 at 01:44 PM.

  12. #12
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Lobdell is sure trying, bless his soul.

    But this feels wrong.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Another thing I didn’t get, no one remembers Wally. That is kind of what started this whole mess for him. Yet all these villains are treated as if they do. The whole issue with Linda is that she no longer lived this life with Wally, but apparently these villains did?
    They pick and chose which parts of history they want to use with the explanation being "Manhattan." It's the same reason Barry was The Flash for nearly a decade without ever being with Iris, despite them originally being together before he was The Flash. Wally was the Flash without Linda.

  14. #14
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    I'm not really a big fan of either Lobdell or Booth, but both of these guys are clearly doing their damnedest to try to salvage Wally from how badly Heroes in Crisis ended his arc.

    I think Lobdell has a pretty good job so far, given the situation he's got to deal with. Sometimes, my preference is to simply ignore bad stories or character directions and hand-wave them away as quickly as possible, but I think there's enough potential with Wally's current low that a good story could be told seeing him crawl back into the light, while simultaneously explaining away the worst parts of Heroes in Crisis without completely negating it, as I'm sure the story has some fans and DC still wants to sell TPBs of it. Johns was able to accomplish a similar feat with both his Identity Crisis aftermath story and, most successfully, with GL: Rebirth, that managed to not only course correct Hal Jordan, but set up the whole GL mythos to reach new heights.

    I'm highly doubtful that Lobdell will be able to pull that off, but I'm certainly intrigued enough to come back for another issue. As long as the second issue isn't a total fumble, I'll stick around for the entire miniseries.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Another thing I didnít get, no one remembers Wally. That is kind of what started this whole mess for him. Yet all these villains are treated as if they do. The whole issue with Linda is that she no longer lived this life with Wally, but apparently these villains did?
    There's two intemingled "forgottens" going on - the pre-Flashpoint stuff, and Wally's New 52/Rebirth history

    In Rebirth, Barry only remembered the latter and the Titans had the same thing in Titans Rebirth. Them forgetting Wally was attributed to Abra Kadabra mindwiping everyone of Wally and causing him to fall into the Speed Force before he ever stopped being Kid Flash (and accidentally mindwiping himself in the process, to boot). And in that history, Linda literally never met Wally until after his return, so there was nothing for her to remember. (Indeed, it was suggested that this Wally only remembered any pre-Flashpoint history at all because he got those menories from the Speed Force, not because he "was" pre-FP Wally.)

    Now, Flash War blurred this, by having Magenta (implicitly) and Iris (explicitly) remember pre-FP memories from meeting Wally. So, uh... *shrug* I'm not sure DC have a solid idea about any of this any more. Maybe these guys fought KF Wally and being around him is jogging their memories of that, maybe he fought them off-panel post-Rebirth, maybe he's still leaking pre-FP memories like Williamson had him do (but that would raise questioms about Linda, so probably not).

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