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  1. #76
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Can someone explain why the new photo of Tom and Erica in any way suggests his Superman is retired? Clark Kent is Superman's secret identity, and all we see is Welling's Clark hanging out at his family farm in Smallville. Hoechlin and Tulloch had a scene just like this in last year's crossover; his Superman was not retired.



    Welling is ten years older than Hoechlin, and it does show a little. Still, his Superman is actually younger than Hoechlin's (SV=32, DCTV=37), and as far as Smallville continuity goes, Clark was still Superman a year prior to the "Crisis." I'm not sure I understand why signs seems to point to his retirement. Help me out.

  2. #77
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    The idea of Clark being retired probably is a result of less the picture itself, but also the knowledge that Welling probably won't be in costume, as we know his feelings on that. That's just not his character in his eyes and I think its plausible to assume he's coming back with that condition still being in place. Obviously he doesn't have to be retired to conjure a reason for him to not be in costume, but it could serve as a reason if they want it to nonetheless.

    That said, maybe he's talked into wearing the full costume this time around. But he's seemed pretty adamant about his position in the past.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  3. #78
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    The idea of Clark being retired probably is a result of less the picture itself, but also the knowledge that Welling probably won't be in costume, as we know his feelings on that. That's just not his character in his eyes and I think its plausible to assume he's coming back with that condition still being in place. Obviously he doesn't have to be retired to conjure a reason for him to not be in costume, but it could serve as a reason if they want it to nonetheless.

    That said, maybe he's talked into wearing the full costume this time around. But he's seemed pretty adamant about his position in the past.
    I still have no clue why Welling not wearing the suit means his Superman is retired. If we don't see his Superman in action, there are plenty of reasons for that to happen: his Earth is threatened, he's taken prisoner, he's mind controlled, etc. There's also every reason to believe that we'll see the same smoke and mirrors we saw on the Smallville finale in which Clark did do the classic shirt rip and CGI was used to show him in action wearing the suit. Welling's only stated reason for not wanting to wear the suit was based on the premise of Smallville, but that reasoning no longer applies because that story is over. So there's literally nothing that suggests his Superman would be retired. Superman wears civilian clothes all the time, so Clark wearing flannel is not a tacit announcement of his retirement less than a decade after debuting.

  4. #79
    Mighty Member Yoda's Avatar
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    And seriously, with the way CW keeps bringing back Hoechlin's Superman year after year, expanding the role as well first with Lois, and next with a baby, for these big event appearances, that generate tons of press and excitement why are people so certain it's all some long con to kill or retire him permanently? Especially considering Supergirl probably has 2-3 more years left at most.

    I just don't get it at all.

  5. #80
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    :shrug: I'm just pointing out the mindset some might have had when they saw that picture and what might have triggered the thought process. If one doesn't get how a mind could go there, I guess that's that. Its not far-fetched to me and I can understand just fine where superduperman and JAK were coming from, but whatever I guess.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  6. #81
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misslane View Post
    Can someone explain why the new photo of Tom and Erica in any way suggests his Superman is retired? Clark Kent is Superman's secret identity, and all we see is Welling's Clark hanging out at his family farm in Smallville. Hoechlin and Tulloch had a scene just like this in last year's crossover; his Superman was not retired.



    Welling is ten years older than Hoechlin, and it does show a little. Still, his Superman is actually younger than Hoechlin's (SV=32, DCTV=37), and as far as Smallville continuity goes, Clark was still Superman a year prior to the "Crisis." I'm not sure I understand why signs seems to point to his retirement. Help me out.
    Welling never liked wearing the suit and went out of his way not to on the show. Saying he's retired means he wouldn't have to if he didn't want to. I don't know if he's retired, it's just an excuse to keep him out of the suit.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  7. #82
    Incredible Member OpaqueGiraffe17's Avatar
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    https://heroichollywood.com/brandon-...perman-crisis/
    not much to look at. But Routh's SM is going to have the hair curl. Wonder if he'll also have those weird blue eye contact things. I rewatched that movie the other day, I forgot he had those. Looked about as weird as Thor's fake eyebrows in the first movie. Not that I'd mind him wearing them again in the new movie especially since these shows don't take themselves seriously.

  8. #83
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misslane View Post
    Can someone explain why the new photo of Tom and Erica in any way suggests his Superman is retired? Clark Kent is Superman's secret identity, and all we see is Welling's Clark hanging out at his family farm in Smallville. Hoechlin and Tulloch had a scene just like this in last year's crossover; his Superman was not retired.

    Welling is ten years older than Hoechlin, and it does show a little. Still, his Superman is actually younger than Hoechlin's (SV=32, DCTV=37), and as far as Smallville continuity goes, Clark was still Superman a year prior to the "Crisis." I'm not sure I understand why signs seems to point to his retirement. Help me out.
    For me, it's partly because he's not wearing glasses (though I know he didn't always/generally, even in the end) and partly because that's an easy way to keep him out of the suit, and him being retired is a "good" (in TV runners' eyes) way to juxtapose Welling's Clark to Routh's very-alone (ala KC) Superman so their characters are easier to write distinctly. It's an easy dramatic take, and I've watched enough CW that I've gotten pretty good at guessing these things. If I'm wrong though, all good! Just my gut instinct.

    Quote Originally Posted by misslane View Post
    I still have no clue why Welling not wearing the suit means his Superman is retired. If we don't see his Superman in action, there are plenty of reasons for that to happen: his Earth is threatened, he's taken prisoner, he's mind controlled, etc. There's also every reason to believe that we'll see the same smoke and mirrors we saw on the Smallville finale in which Clark did do the classic shirt rip and CGI was used to show him in action wearing the suit. Welling's only stated reason for not wanting to wear the suit was based on the premise of Smallville, but that reasoning no longer applies because that story is over. So there's literally nothing that suggests his Superman would be retired. Superman wears civilian clothes all the time, so Clark wearing flannel is not a tacit announcement of his retirement less than a decade after debuting.
    It's just a vibe I'm getting. (Edit: that's not a Flash joke, I swear..lol) As for Welling: he's given several reasons for not putting on the suit over the years, and if he's playing the "Smallville show" Clark, he could stick with them for the same reasonings (regardless of that story being over, he could see it as a "spirit of the show" thing). They could do it with CGI again, but I'm not sure how good of a reaction that would get after last time. I hope I'm wrong, but I'd be very surprised if they got him into a super-suit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yoda View Post
    And seriously, with the way CW keeps bringing back Hoechlin's Superman year after year, expanding the role as well first with Lois, and next with a baby, for these big event appearances, that generate tons of press and excitement why are people so certain it's all some long con to kill or retire him permanently? Especially considering Supergirl probably has 2-3 more years left at most.

    I just don't get it at all.
    I don't think they'll kill him. But with the universes most likely merging (at least the main ones that there are shows of), I think the easy way to not have to worry about him narratively is to essentially take him off the board. If Hoechlin's Superman is semi-retired, they can always bring him back for special occasions when they want to.

    The Superman who'll most likely die will be Routh's, as he has the least to lose - and I'm almost betting that the Smallville Lois/Clark and Oliver/Felicity will be the ones who go to the paradise dimension ala Superboy Prime, Alexander, and Earth-2 Lois/Clark. That would be a VERY satisfying ending for a lot of people, and would be really hard for them to resist doing, imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    :shrug: I'm just pointing out the mindset some might have had when they saw that picture and what might have triggered the thought process. If one doesn't get how a mind could go there, I guess that's that. Its not far-fetched to me and I can understand just fine where superduperman and JAK were coming from, but whatever I guess.
    Maybe it's that the pic is low-res (and the full-res one would give a different impression), or the hair and lack of glasses, but I'm just getting a very relaxed feel from him that feels like "Metropolis Clark" isn't a thing. I could be dead wrong, maybe I am; but while all the evidence (from a picture perspective as well as an actor perspective) is circumstantial, it strikes me as very possible.
    Last edited by JAK; 09-26-2019 at 05:10 PM.
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  9. #84
    Astonishing Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misslane View Post
    Yay Clois!

    They know what we like.


    I'm still hoping Routh's Superman version is a continuation of Superman Returns. Hope his little story doesn't suck. I can't wait to see him in the suit!!! (really hope he trained hard..)

  10. #85
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    I think that Welling not wearing the suit in SMALLVILLE derives from how the show was sold to him and how it was sold to the audience. It was never supposed to be a show about Superman. There was never supposed to be a costume. For the show to be true to itself, it had to maintain that commitment. So Welling probably was so invested in the show's identity that he didn't feel right about dresssing up as Superman, even if it was just for one shot at the very end of the series.

    Maybe if they had offered him the role of Superman in a movie, he would have changed his mind about that. I doubt he ever got a paycheque equivalent to what a movie actor would have got for playing Superman.
    I read the news today oh boy

  11. #86
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    And now the old BOP show is joining:

    https://www.cbr.com/birds-of-prey-as...finite-earths/
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  12. #87
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I think that Welling not wearing the suit in SMALLVILLE derives from how the show was sold to him and how it was sold to the audience. It was never supposed to be a show about Superman. There was never supposed to be a costume. For the show to be true to itself, it had to maintain that commitment. So Welling probably was so invested in the show's identity that he didn't feel right about dresssing up as Superman, even if it was just for one shot at the very end of the series.

    Maybe if they had offered him the role of Superman in a movie, he would have changed his mind about that. I doubt he ever got a paycheque equivalent to what a movie actor would have got for playing Superman.
    The only problem with that, though, is that he *was* in the suit. Just not him technically, because it was CGI. It only maintained that commitment by contractual standards, and broke it in every way - save what would have been (at least for me) the most viewer-satisfying way (ymmv, of course). But the character, from a narrative standpoint, absolutely put on the costume in-episode (we just didn't see much of it). It's hard to shake that it didn't happen for "real" because he simply didn't want to do it. Which is totally his right. But the "spirit of the show" reasoning has always struck me as hollow.

    I mean, a show about how Clark Kent grew into becoming Superman ends with him "growing into becoming Superman," no matter how else you slice it. For much of the audience, at least, that expectation would be there.
    Hear my new CD "Love The World Away", available on iTunes, Google Music, Spotify, Shazam, and Amazon: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B01N5XYV..._waESybX1C0RXK via @amazon
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  13. #88
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    I wasn't in the room when the costume was being discussed with Tom Welling, so I don't know what the actual deal was. It seems like a lot to put on the actor in a show (maybe by then he was an executive producer), given that there are so many other people involved in the production; it doesn't track for me that the actor could have so much power absent of anyone else involved in the show. He was the face of the show, so he gets all the blame--but there were probably a lot of other people pulling in different directions for what should or shouldn't happen in the finale.

    The more I think about it--and when you look at what happened with other Superman actors--there were probably all kinds of negotiations going on; so Welling's management team might have been holding this as a bargaining chip for their client.
    I read the news today oh boy

  14. #89
    Astonishing Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    The only problem with that, though, is that he *was* in the suit. Just not him technically, because it was CGI. It only maintained that commitment by contractual standards, and broke it in every way - save what would have been (at least for me) the most viewer-satisfying way (ymmv, of course). But the character, from a narrative standpoint, absolutely put on the costume in-episode (we just didn't see much of it). It's hard to shake that it didn't happen for "real" because he simply didn't want to do it. Which is totally his right. But the "spirit of the show" reasoning has always struck me as hollow.

    I mean, a show about how Clark Kent grew into becoming Superman ends with him "growing into becoming Superman," no matter how else you slice it. For much of the audience, at least, that expectation would be there.
    I agree, it basically became a Superman show without Superman.. Let's face it, Welling never wanted to wear the suit because he didn't want to be typecast or whatever (it could prevent him from getting other roles..). He clearly doesn't love the character or think it's an honor to play him. He liked the $$.

    It's why I don't care if he wears it now or not. But I'm happy for those who wanted to see him in this. Hopefully he has some good scenes with Lois. I quite liked their chemistry.

  15. #90
    Ultimate Member Last Son of Krypton's Avatar
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    First look at Routh as Kingdom Come Supes:



    https://twitter.com/DCSuperman/statu...30189997744128
    Last edited by Last Son of Krypton; 09-27-2019 at 10:27 AM.

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