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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by TresDias View Post
    Sometime between "The Thanos Imperative" and "Avengers Assemble." The Annihilators are a thing here (so it has to be after "The Thanos Imperative"), but Thanos hasn't yet gone out of character and become obsessed with making trouble on Earth.
    Incorrect. The events of Avengers Assemble are referenced in the encounter with the Badoon.

  2. #32
    Fantastic Member Bolo's Avatar
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    I find this issue awesome like the Annual, that really the Jim Starlin story I used to love, more like his 70's and 90's stuff and not his poor works of 2000's (Abyss and the end.); there are no direct retcon (like clones etc...), so it was a very good surprise...and I really love the end.

    For the annihilator, I hate this group (they are just the fake GotG from DnA, after they has decided to kill half of the group); so I was happy to see them defeated; but imo it was not really "bad" for them; (Beta Ray Bill have been shown very durable); also we should don't forget that Thor in Infinity have been easily defeated by Thanos too (and before that in Avengers Annual in the 70's), for the Silver Surfer he have lost multiples times against Thanos (by Starlin and Martz, but also by David, Giffen, DnA, Hickman for the others heralds);so that pretty much in the continuity.

    That really amazing to see Warlock with his mystical touch written by Starlin, that clear that nobody understand the character like him; for me it's really a very good comicbook for the fans of Thanos/Warlock/Starlin; a real pleasure.
    Last edited by Bolo; 08-07-2014 at 12:22 PM.

  3. #33
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    Well, for the record, I loved it. But, I'm a biased fan of Starlin's pondering Thanos.

    It's not clear yet, about how the past history Thanos from Thanos Annual, fits into this story. Maybe some will speculate, should be interesting. Looking forward to the sequel.

  4. #34
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    Ah, "Avengers Aseemble" does get referenced, doesn't it? So, this is sometime between that and "Infinity." Has to be before the latter for obvious reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by ColdFury View Post
    I'm sad to hear this, but I am honor-bound to buy it, as I have sworn an oath to buy any comic in which Quasar appears. Thanos doesn't kill Quasar this time, does he? (I think Quasar is like, 0-2 on living through Thanos encounters.)
    Thanos doesn't even touch Quasar here.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    Believe me, the Annihilators look really bad and stupid in this book.

    I mean, what happens to Beta Ray Bill borders on shameful.

    I don't want to spoil it too much, I will allow you to form your opinion after you've read it.
    That was my favourite part of the book.

    Starlin writing Thanos again was a gulty pleasure for me to read.

  6. #36

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    Heh. At the end of everything, Thanos' story is always a romance story.

  7. #37
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TresDias View Post
    Ah, "Avengers Aseemble" does get referenced, doesn't it? So, this is sometime between that and "Infinity." Has to be before the latter for obvious reasons.



    Thanos doesn't even touch Quasar here.
    It's not the best showing in the world for a Wendel fan... but in the least he doesn't get killed.

  8. #38
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    Believe me, the Annihilators look really bad and stupid in this book.

    I mean, what happens to Beta Ray Bill borders on shameful.

    I don't want to spoil it too much, I will allow you to form your opinion after you've read it.
    Gladiator was given his props at least.

    I was fine with what happened to Ronan and Bill. I do think Quasar and Silver Surfer should have lasted a little longer than they actually did (which wasn't long at all). But it's not their book, so these things happen.

  9. #39
    Mighty Member L.R Johansson's Avatar
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    This sounds like it was both wonderful, and absolutely terrible. But then, that's the case with a lot of Starlin's material, isn't it?

    I am rather weary of Starlin's seeming favorizing of characters however... Every writer does it, to a certain extent, but Starlin seems to take it to new heights, whenever he writes a character again.

    And there's something I've never understood with Starlin's obsession not just with Thanos, but with all of the Thanos-LIKES - Mongul, DarkSeid, etc - it actually seems like he ADMIRES them, that he really feels that's the way it oughta' be - we should all be completely remorseless psychopaths, and play everybody else like violins, to get what we want.

    And, since this is the perfect way to be, it can never really backfire on us, there will never really be any consequences or punishments. And if there is, well, it's obviously not our own fault, someone else has of course failed in some way. Not us. We're infallible.

    Seriously... WTF. IS. THIS. SH*T?

    Starlin... you friggin' goof-ball... DARKSEID LOSES IN THE END.

    He loses.

    And he's NOT right, btw... You're not supposed to root for Darkseid.

    Please re-read the New Gods again. You didn't get it.

    Can someone please let me in on Starlin's supposed politics and life-philosophies? I know he actually did a whole essay on morality of villains etc, when he was in college, or what-have-you, but I don't recall what he actually tried to say with that. Apparently it's the basis for all of his Villain-tales. I'm starting to think he's some kind of Ultra-objectivist or something.

  10. #40
    Incredible Member Haquim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.R Johansson View Post
    This sounds like it was both wonderful, and absolutely terrible. But then, that's the case with a lot of Starlin's material, isn't it?

    I am rather weary of Starlin's seeming favorizing of characters however... Every writer does it, to a certain extent, but Starlin seems to take it to new heights, whenever he writes a character again.

    And there's something I've never understood with Starlin's obsession not just with Thanos, but with all of the Thanos-LIKES - Mongul, DarkSeid, etc - it actually seems like he ADMIRES them, that he really feels that's the way it oughta' be - we should all be completely remorseless psychopaths, and play everybody else like violins, to get what we want.

    And, since this is the perfect way to be, it can never really backfire on us, there will never really be any consequences or punishments. And if there is, well, it's obviously not our own fault, someone else has of course failed in some way. Not us. We're infallible.

    Seriously... WTF. IS. THIS. SH*T?

    Starlin... you friggin' goof-ball... DARKSEID LOSES IN THE END.

    He loses.

    And he's NOT right, btw... You're not supposed to root for Darkseid.

    Please re-read the New Gods again. You didn't get it.

    Can someone please let me in on Starlin's supposed politics and life-philosophies? I know he actually did a whole essay on morality of villains etc, when he was in college, or what-have-you, but I don't recall what he actually tried to say with that. Apparently it's the basis for all of his Villain-tales. I'm starting to think he's some kind of Ultra-objectivist or something.
    Long answer made (very) short: Thanos written by Starlin is not a villain.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    Believe me, the Annihilators look really bad and stupid in this book.

    I mean, what happens to Beta Ray Bill borders on shameful.

    I don't want to spoil it too much, I will allow you to form your opinion after you've read it.

    OK, I read this. I agree with your point - what Thanos did to Bill was shameful. This is Beta Ray Bill, the guy who beat Thor without a hammer or any Asgardian enhancements. Is it really possible to think that he would just stand there and let Thanos beat him to a pulp? And Thanos' (and Starlin's) complete disrespect for the Surfer continues. Thanos even makes it clear that he enjoys manipulating the Surfer, who is so stupid he is easily manipulated (along with Galactus, apparently) and regrets not having the chance to simply slap the Surfer around. Again, if Starlin wants to show us all what big balls Thanos has, can't he do it in a way that doesn't involve completing disrespecting and denigrating others' favorite characters, characters who have long been established to be enormously powerful on their own? The only purpose of the Annihilators in this story was to be there so Thanos could humiliate them.

    RE: Gladiator: as glad as I am that Gladiator got some respect, he is no more powerful (in most ways) than the Surfer. If Gladiator is so fearsome a character, the Surfer (and Bill, too) should have merited equal respect.

    I agree with the point that recent incarnations of Thanos have been shown to be enormously powerful. The recent Thanos appearance in the Avengers showed that Thor's worst barely bothers Thanos at all. Fine. But I still find it unbelievable that someone like Beta Ray Bill can't put up a much more considerable fight against the Titan. In Bill's case, there was the excuse of him being separated from his hammer, the supposed source of his power (I don't think it's that simple, but so be it). The other Annihilators, especially Ronan, are not that powerful. But the Surfer carries his power with him. Of course, he was rendered unconscious by Warlock, but the complete lack of respect that Thanos shows the Surfer's power really rankles.

    This issue of the complete and utter and pointless humiliation of the Annihilators aside, the story was interesting, if puzzling. It seems to serve to mostly reintroduce a more powerful Warlock to the MU and suggest that this has ramifications on a scale the likes of which we have never seen before. I like Warlock - he is the only character that Starlin won't job when it comes to Thanos. But I do feel that, over the years, Starlin's cosmic sagas have had the effect of making the MU a less interesting, less awesome place for me. I guess the fact that Thanos keeps achieving omnipotence and yet never actually seems to learn anything or get more enlightened or ever change and grow makes me feel that there is just not much going on. This issue talked about the need to accept mysteries and questions without answer and I am on board for that.

  12. #42
    Astonishing Member legion_quest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShaunN View Post
    This issue of the complete and utter and pointless humiliation of the Annihilators aside, the story was interesting, if puzzling. It seems to serve to mostly reintroduce a more powerful Warlock to the MU and suggest that this has ramifications on a scale the likes of which we have never seen before. I like Warlock - he is the only character that Starlin won't job when it comes to Thanos. But I do feel that, over the years, Starlin's cosmic sagas have had the effect of making the MU a less interesting, less awesome place for me. I guess the fact that Thanos keeps achieving omnipotence and yet never actually seems to learn anything or get more enlightened or ever change and grow makes me feel that there is just not much going on. This issue talked about the need to accept mysteries and questions without answer and I am on board for that.
    Except that he does when Starlin writes him. Starlin always writes Thanos to be a growing character who does show difference in motivation and thinking, even if not outright changing his desires or nature. He grows without having total character overhauls.

    It's when other writers use him in between Starlin's stories that Thanos tends to be reduced to cackling villain - which is why Starlin always has to explain those stories away so he can get his deeper and more developed Thanos back to where he last left him.

    It's not Starlin's fault other writers don't continue his work and prefer or are mandated to write more 1Dimensional villians.

    For me, the real issue I had with this book was the change in Warlock. Adam did not seem like Adam at all here, even when he was old Adam before the merge with this new OP Adam. As a Warlock fan, I really cant wait to see where that goes
    I will raise my throne above the Stars of God

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by legion_quest View Post
    Except that he does when Starlin writes him. Starlin always writes Thanos to be a growing character who does show difference in motivation and thinking, even if not outright changing his desires or nature. He grows without having total character overhauls.

    It's when other writers use him in between Starlin's stories that Thanos tends to be reduced to cackling villain - which is why Starlin always has to explain those stories away so he can get his deeper and more developed Thanos back to where he last left him.

    It's not Starlin's fault other writers don't continue his work and prefer or are mandated to write more 1Dimensional villians.

    For me, the real issue I had with this book was the change in Warlock. Adam did not seem like Adam at all here, even when he was old Adam before the merge with this new OP Adam. As a Warlock fan, I really cant wait to see where that goes
    You may have a point here. I have to admit that, after the first "Infinity Gem" series I don't think I bothered with any of the others, so it could be that Starlin did have Thanos grow and change in some substantial way. Other writers keep hauling him back to being a stagnant villain.

    Again, however, I am extremely annoyed at how Starlin treats characters like Beta Ray Bill and the Surfer. I hope another writer does something at some point to correct this shameful misappropriation of some great characters.

  14. #44
    Astonishing Member legion_quest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShaunN View Post
    You may have a point here. I have to admit that, after the first "Infinity Gem" series I don't think I bothered with any of the others, so it could be that Starlin did have Thanos grow and change in some substantial way. Other writers keep hauling him back to being a stagnant villain.

    Again, however, I am extremely annoyed at how Starlin treats characters like Beta Ray Bill and the Surfer. I hope another writer does something at some point to correct this shameful misappropriation of some great characters.
    I can see why Bill fans would have a problem with it. Bill got jobbed out big time. I dont like Bill at all and even I can admit that.
    I will raise my throne above the Stars of God

  15. #45
    What the d'ast?! Superkreep's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by legion_quest View Post
    I can see why Bill fans would have a problem with it. Bill got jobbed out big time. I dont like Bill at all and even I can admit that.
    Bad and danm near humiliating outings happen often in comics, ask any Wolverine or Thor fan.
    Those two can stomp most of their rogues gallery DAILY, yet some how they turn into Wiley E. Coyote in all the big events/guest appearances.

    However, in this case with the Annihilators Thanos was NOT alone and I'd think as a cohesive group they would have certainly taken down Thanos.
    The biggest problems the Annihilators dealt with in their series were not the enemies they faced, it was their lack of team work, they're all rather OP so they tend to try to solo big targets when they shouldn't. Just like in the Annihilators series Quasar (f*k-yeah, THE Quasar!!!) again seemed to hang back and be the reasonable one and trying to keep things a team effort...the others not so much. Ikon, Ronan, Gladiator, and Bill went for the 'zerg rush and that got them picked off.
    Plus even if they were some how ready for one of the worst possible uber threats like Thanos, they certainly were NOT ready for an OP Adam Warlock, ESPECIALLY not Surfer. SS was actually surprised to see Adam there, he's normally on their side and was dead last time they checked so he could and literally DID sneak up and quietly slept half of them.

    So yeah, bad showing by the Annihilators for sure but NOT completely out of character.
    If anything Starlin danm near REDEEMED Gladiator after what Bendis has been reducing him to. >_<

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