DC's "new" timeline revealed at NYCC

[bat39]

Yeah, not liking any of that 5G business at all. DC must know it's a stupid idea, you can't just replace the OG's like nothing happened, and expect everyone to just accept that, it's already been shown not to work, and I'd hope they're not dense enough to make the same mistake as Marvel, but DC has shown itself to be susceptible to bad decisions already. The only redeeming factor would be if it's a another sort of line of books, that doesn't affect the running ones. Though that might be too much to ask for.

But also a part of me will remain cynical since this is BC, they've gotten stuff right in the past, but they also haven't. I thought Duke instead of Luke that was going to be the new batman, and it would happen at the end of king's run? I'll try to keep an open mind. This could all be smoke and mirrors

I suppose a lot depends on what exactly is their purpose with this 'generations' thing. There has been a lot of speculation about the idea that each of the 'generations' will be showcased in different books. If that's the case when we could very well have a situation where, for example, we have a 'Superboy' book with Clark Kent in Smallville (potentially teaming up with the JSA and Wonder Woman), a 'Superman' book with a young, single Superman during his heyday, a 'Superman' book with an older, married Superman, and a 'Superman' book with a grown-up Jon Kent taking over the mantle.

I suppose that's one way to solve the endless arguments about who's the 'best' version of the character!

In a sense, I suppose it could work. People want to see these characters as evergreen, unchanging 'brands', but they also appreciate character development, progression and in some cases succession. Comic book time is ultimately a tug of war between these two approaches, and DC is perhaps finally ready to let the rope break and just let both sides have a win.

Let's not forget that some of the most iconic interpretations of characters are either from other media, from comic-book stories decades in the past, or from 'out-of-continuity' Elseworlds/Black Label style stories. Maybe its time to break away from the rigid idea of a 'mainstream' present-day continuity that will only have the illusion of change and allow it to change...while showcasing more classic interpretations (or reinterpretations) of the character side-by-side.

[Grayson - The Dark Heir]

I suppose a lot depends on what exactly is their purpose with this 'generations' thing. There has been a lot of speculation about the idea that each of the 'generations' will be showcased in different books. If that's the case when we could very well have a situation where, for example, we have a 'Superboy' book with Clark Kent in Smallville (potentially teaming up with the JSA and Wonder Woman), a 'Superman' book with a young, single Superman during his heyday, a 'Superman' book with an older, married Superman, and a 'Superman' book with a grown-up Jon Kent taking over the mantle.

I suppose that's one way to solve the endless arguments about who's the 'best' version of the character!

In a sense, I suppose it could work. People want to see these characters as evergreen, unchanging 'brands', but they also appreciate character development, progression and in some cases succession. Comic book time is ultimately a tug of war between these two approaches, and DC is perhaps finally ready to let the rope break and just let both sides have a win.

Let's not forget that some of the most iconic interpretations of characters are either from other media, from comic-book stories decades in the past, or from 'out-of-continuity' Elseworlds/Black Label style stories. Maybe its time to break away from the rigid idea of a 'mainstream' present-day continuity that will only have the illusion of change and allow it to change...while showcasing more classic interpretations (or reinterpretations) of the character side-by-side.

This is exactly what I imagine is going on. I don’t think we’ll get, say, 4 Superman books, but I think it’s likely that Action will become an anthology book that shifts focus between all Gens. ‘Tec could follow the same pattern. We might get a Sensation and Adventure Comics relaunch out of this, too. I’d be happy about Nightwing following a similar pattern, and they could actually relaunch a New Teen Titans book telling “untold” stories during Gen 2 and 3. There’s so much story to tell now that the DCU is opening up past New 52 (people and DC like to pretend that’s what Rebirth was, but it’s only now that old continuity matters. Random Hypertime teases and stories about reality-changing was just a whole lot of nothing).

Pushing the DCU forward also means there’s a lot of new stories to tell now.

[scary harpy]

Based on what we now know...

does anyone feel like this is going to be a garbage fire?

I do.

[Korath]

Yeah, if DC give us several "lines" with different versions of the characters, it'll be a win-win situation for them. Replacing the existing main line is suicidal, but adding to it, not necessarily in the format of floppies, but directly in hardcover and all could work. I know I'd certainly be really interested in the 5G shaking things up if it's the case.

[king81992]

5G feels like DC pushing legacy in a situation that's doomed to fail and use that as an excuse not to push them in the future.

[vasir12]

5G feels like DC pushing legacy in a situation that's doomed to fail and use that as an excuse not to push them in the future.

I don't get this conspiracy theory cause it sounds like a waste or money. No business is going to deliberately tank their entire brand to "get back at the fans." It's nonsensical no matter how much people may be bad at their jobs.

As for it being multiple lines? Maybe. Still seems like something that will make the universe lose focus when this new Timeline suggest they'd want to gain it.

I think they'll have these new 6-ish heroes lead the main continuity like how the Society made way for the League on the past. I would guess the reasoning is that they can tell stories with more room for creative freedoms. who's really gonna care for more reboots of a character when you know ten thousands things have to remain constant (Like Batman and his robins). New characters mean they can do whatever.

I can't say if it'll work, but that's what I think the rationale is. They'll probably do past gen stories through graphic novels while they see how far they can push the new guard.

Might be trying to draw a new audience who think these characters are too old and should develop past their "prime years"

[Zaresh]

Disclaimer for everyone reading, this is just me having fun with the ages. I make no claim that this is what they're doing. Personally I think they don't think this far and only prioritize certain character's ages without thinking about everyone, and the timeline itself it's a blurry work in progress so events can be reordered later.

Edit: We decided it will be called a Reboot and not an age or memory reset. I call it age reset because I was focusing on age, but what I meant was "If Tim was 15 when he's Robin the first time, after the reset, everyone remembers him Robin at age 13"
Like that

Generation 1
....
(a whole lot of stuff in the original post)

This is so workable.
I buy.
You've sold it to me entirely. Good work.

(you may want to reread the end of Gen 2 and Gen 3 age for Billy before the suspendium plot though, because you have put him at age 8 a few times, and if he was 15 when Gen 2 ended, after taking 5 years from him, he wouldn't be 8)

[j9ac9k]

5G feels like DC pushing legacy in a situation that's doomed to fail and use that as an excuse not to push them in the future.

I doubt they'd do anything without the intent to get people to buy their books. Whether or not those will be good stories or rely on anything other than "hey - buy this to see what we're doing to this character" is another thing. I expect people will be interested enough to buy stuff just to see what the hell is going on, there will be some good, some bad books, and DC will get several years' worth of stories out of this new timeline, then things will change again when the interest (and sales bump) fades.

[Nick Miller]

Stupid
Stupid
Stupid
Stupid

[MRP]

Yeah, not liking any of that 5G business at all. DC must know it's a stupid idea, you can't just replace the OG's like nothing happened, and expect everyone to just accept that, it's already been shown not to work, and I'd hope they're not dense enough to make the same mistake as Marvel, but DC has shown itself to be susceptible to bad decisions already. The only redeeming factor would be if it's a another sort of line of books, that doesn't affect the running ones. Though that might be too much to ask for.

But also a part of me will remain cynical since this is BC, they've gotten stuff right in the past, but they also haven't. I thought Duke instead of Luke that was going to be the new batman, and it would happen at the end of king's run? I'll try to keep an open mind. This could all be smoke and mirrors

Yeah that attempt in the 1950s by DC to replace the OG of Jay Garrick, Alan Scott, Cater Hall, Al Pratt and such with nobodies like Barry Allen, Hal Jordan, Katar Hol and Ray Palmer like nothing happened that they called the Silver Age really fell flat on its face. No one ever accepted those characters instead of the originals and DC reverted back pretty quickly and it didn't work...oh wait...

-M

[Tenzel Kim]

Gen 1
Thomas and Martha Wayne marry? It's about 10 years before they died, the average age for Bruce's origin
Arthur Meets The Others

Marry seems to fit the size of the block of text.

Not as sure about "meets" for Arthur. Looking at "meets" for Vulko below and Orm in the next column it looks off. I was wondering it it might be "joins" instead.

Gen 2
Wonder Woman's Powers Returns?

Fits the size, but it comes VERY late compared to the other events in the timeline. I know they are switching things around for no apparent reason (like the Death in the Family / Killing Joke switch) so this could be another case of that, it just doesn't feel right.

Gen 3
The first JL is JLI
Year 13 Teen Titans the last member is Static Shock

When Blue Beetle and Shazam (Captain Marvel) joined it was only called the Justice League, but you're probably right that they've put it down as JLI.

Static Shock seems to fit fairly well as the S's tend to get eaten a bit.

[Tzigone]

Yeah that attempt in the 1950s by DC to replace the OG of Jay Garrick, Alan Scott, Cater Hall, Al Pratt and such with nobodies like Barry Allen, Hal Jordan, Katar Hol and Ray Palmer like nothing happened that they called the Silver Age really fell flat on its face. No one ever accepted those characters instead of the originals and DC reverted back pretty quickly and it didn't work...oh wait...

-M

Not at all the same thing. There was a mostly rotating readership back then, instead of the long-term readers we have now. And all those comics had been canceled for years. The kids picking up comics in the 1950s might well not know who they were (as I recall they planned for a 5-year turnaround of 8-13 year olds and it had been about 5 years when Barry premiered). They didn't have worry about alienating long-term fans back then the way they do now. Now, it may well be worth it to them to alienate the long-term readers if they can get more money from new fans. But it's not nearly the same situation as it was back then.

Edit: Also, of course, characterization didn't have the same focus back then. And remember, they were replacing characters that were not popular to survive in the first place - it's why they were canceled - not the the biggest sellers/most popular characters (which Batman, at least, is).

[Zaresh]

Ab, btw, @Tenzel Kim. For what is worth, I think that in Gen 1 Year 3, Green row, it's "Dinah Drake joins JSA as Black Canary". At least, I think I can see a JSA written there, instead of an AS.

[bat39]

Not at all the same thing. There was a mostly rotating readership back then, instead of the long-term readers we have now. And all those comics had been canceled for years. The kids picking up comics in the 1950s might well not know who they were (as I recall they planned for a 5-year turnaround of 8-13 year olds and it had been about 5 years when Barry premiered). They didn't have worry about alienating long-term fans back then the way they do now. Now, it may well be worth it to them to alienate the long-term readers if they can get more money from new fans. But it's not nearly the same situation as it was back then.

Edit: Also, of course, characterization didn't have the same focus back then. And remember, they were replacing characters that were not popular to survive in the first place - it's why they were canceled - not the the biggest sellers/most popular characters (which Batman, at least, is).

Plus, that was a very different era for the superhero genre in terms of its pop-cultural influence. There wasn't a multi-billion dollar media franchise revolving around the DC brand. Multiple generations hadn't grown up watching JSA cartoons, or a Jay Garrick Flash TV show, or an Alan Scott Green Lantern movie. The only notable 'brands' that DC had were Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman (and even the latter two weren't nearly as big a deal as you might think - at least, in Batman's case, not until his TV show) - and those are the three that survived the original 'reboot' largely unscathed. What DC built during the Silver Age though has largely been the template for their brand in the half-century since, and its been what every subsequent era has built upon.

That said, there have been cases where post-Silver Age material has demonstrated the same lasting power and become an indelible part of the DC brand. Take for instance a character like Harley Quinn. Or for that matter, even the Kate Kane Batwoman. Or Cyborg (well, he's a Bronze Age character but him being counted as a premiere hero and a JL member is very much a recent thing). Or the various Robins after Dick Grayson.

So change is still possible, but I doubt DC would ever be able to pull off the kind of drastic overhaul they did back at the start of the Silver Age. Nor do they really have the incentive to do so...

[Pohzee]

Unless, Damian stays as Robin for another decade or two, I think think the revolving door of Robins, shows that replacement offers diminishing returns, requiring more frequent changes and less stability.