How deep does Moria's experiments go?

[Michael Watkins]

She still tampered with baby Magneto's genes in this life, right? I pray that Astra shows up at some point.

[HeartofTheStoriesWeTell]

Wasnt Proteus conceived when Joe assaulted her? Thats either being retconned or its pretty effed up.

Yes but he was her husband... she wanted a child but not that way...

[Rivka]

She still tampered with baby Magneto's genes in this life, right? I pray that Astra shows up at some point.

Yes. Yes! And this is what caused the "schism" in Moira Life 10. No matter how many Moira lives he's seen, no matter the strength of the pact with Xavier and Moira, when Magneto found out she'd experimented on him when he was baby-ized and given to her care, he was enraged at the violation of his trust. Then we see a hint in Moira's journal entry in POWERS OF X #6 -- she "imprinted" the idea of Magneto creating mutant nations and defending them?

Now, I'm always wary and anxious with any writer handling Magneto. I am always afraid of how they'll write him, I'm always afraid to start praising a writer too soon, HOWEVER, I have to say, with Jonathan Hickman, I just love so far how he gets Magneto. What a subtle shift of expectations, just from that Moira journal entry.

Magneto (in X-MEN vol.2 #2) accused Moira of "making him good" with her genetic modifications. She claimed she was only trying to strengthen his nervous system to handle his powers better so he wouldn't inevitably go insane. He didn't believe her, and ordered her to do the "same thing" to the X-Men. So Moira improvised; she made the X-Men obedient puppets (because Magneto threatened to kill her if she didn't do something) but this "fix" only worked until they first used their powers. Moira was falsely accused of genetic tampering to "make Magneto good" -- I have defended her for years! No, I said, she only tried to help him.

Now we know, she apparently did strengthen his nervous system to keep him sane, but she ALSO did other things while he was a baby in her care. And here is Hickman's amazing inversion of expectation: She actually made Magneto do bad things, she didn't "make him good." She made him go bad! He was healing, he had made that pact with her and Xavier after seeing her memories, he was actual becoming a better man on his own. Moira made him turn mutant-terrorist-dictator so she could observe the progress and pattern of establishing a mutant homeland--what happens, what can be done to offset the problems, how to ensure a more successful outcome. Wow.

So, Moira broke Xavier, turned him into a mutant extremist and hardliner more in line with Magneto.

And, Moira also programmed Magneto, returned him to mutant extremism and imprinted him with the instructions to found Avalon and Genosha. She's also taking credit for Utopia too, I gather, as it now seems Magneto had more influence on Scott Summers than we thought? (I don't like this. Scott Summers was the best mutant hero I've seen in years when he established Utopia in the face of Decimation. Magneto bent the knee to him, accepted Scott's leadership and ideas. I didn't get the impression at the time I was reading those comics that he had anything to do with Scott's decision to raise Asteroid M-1 from San Francisco Bay.)

Anyway, for a die-hard Magneto fan, these arguments used to consume us. Did Moira MacTaggert "make Magneto good" and did he become a "villain" again when he created Avalon, (setting of the Fatal Attractions story), and when he created mutant Genosha? Is Magneto basically a good man turned extremist, radical by his hate and rage and terrible experiences? Hickman is kind of answering these questions in the affirmative. (And poor Moira becomes the ultimate femme fatale of Marvel comics.)

[Michael Watkins]

Yes. Yes! And this is what caused the "schism" in Moira Life 10. No matter how many Moira lives he's seen, no matter the strength of the pact with Xavier and Moira, when Magneto found out she'd experimented on him when he was baby-ized and given to her care, he was enraged at the violation of his trust. Then we see a hint in Moira's journal entry in POWERS OF X #6 -- she "imprinted" the idea of Magneto creating mutant nations and defending them?

Now, I'm always wary and anxious with any writer handling Magneto. I am always afraid of how they'll write him, I'm always afraid to start praising a writer too soon, HOWEVER, I have to say, with Jonathan Hickman, I just love so far how he gets Magneto. What a subtle shift of expectations, just from that Moira journal entry. Him influencing Cyclops isn't that surprising. Xavier conditioned Scott to be the quarterback for someone else's playbook.

Magneto (in X-MEN vol.2 #2) accused Moira of "making him good" with her genetic modifications. She claimed she was only trying to strengthen his nervous system to handle his powers better so he wouldn't inevitably go insane. He didn't believe her, and ordered her to do the "same thing" to the X-Men. So Moira improvised; she made the X-Men obedient puppets (because Magneto threatened to kill her if she didn't do something) but this "fix" only worked until they first used their powers. Moira was falsely accused of genetic tampering to "make Magneto good" -- I have defended her for years! No, I said, she only tried to help him.

Now we know, she apparently did strengthen his nervous system to keep him sane, but she ALSO did other things while he was a baby in her care. And here is Hickman's amazing inversion of expectation: She actually made Magneto do bad things, she didn't "make him good." She made him go bad! He was healing, he had made that pact with her and Xavier after seeing her memories, he was actual becoming a better man on his own. Moira made him turn mutant-terrorist-dictator so she could observe the progress and pattern of establishing a mutant homeland--what happens, what can be done to offset the problems, how to ensure a more successful outcome. Wow.

So, Moira broke Xavier, turned him into a mutant extremist and hardliner more in line with Magneto.

And, Moira also programmed Magneto, returned him to mutant extremism and imprinted him with the instructions to found Avalon and Genosha. She's also taking credit for Utopia too, I gather, as it now seems Magneto had more influence on Scott Summers than we thought? (I don't like this. Scott Summers was the best mutant hero I've seen in years when he established Utopia in the face of Decimation. Magneto bent the knee to him, accepted Scott's leadership and ideas. I didn't get the impression at the time I was reading those comics that he had anything to do with Scott's decision to raise Asteroid M-1 from San Francisco Bay.)

Anyway, for a die-hard Magneto fan, these arguments used to consume us. Did Moira MacTaggert "make Magneto good" and did he become a "villain" again when he created Avalon, (setting of the Fatal Attractions story), and when he created mutant Genosha? Is Magneto basically a good man turned extremist, radical by his hate and rage and terrible experiences? Hickman is kind of answering these questions in the affirmative. (And poor Moira becomes the ultimate femme fatale of Marvel comics.)

I wish that I knew more about her experiment. She didn't provide many details on how she made him "good." How did she implant these ideas? And where did she go wrong with Kevin?