View Poll Results: Which of DC's Black Characters Has the Most Potential to Achieve Trinity Status?

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  • Green Lantern (John Stewart)

    49 30.06%
  • Vixen (Mari McCabe)

    18 11.04%
  • Cyborg (Victor Stone)

    13 7.98%
  • Black Lightning/Vulcan (Jefferson Pierce)

    30 18.40%
  • Static (Virgil Hawkins)

    7 4.29%
  • Naomi (Naomi McDuffie)

    9 5.52%
  • Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt)

    7 4.29%
  • Steel (John Henry Irons)

    4 2.45%
  • Bumblebee (Karen Beecher)

    0 0%
  • Icon (Augustus Freeman IV)

    1 0.61%
  • Rocket (Raquel Ervin)

    0 0%
  • Amazing-Man (Any Version)

    1 0.61%
  • Aqualad (Kaldur'ahm/Jackson Hyde)

    1 0.61%
  • Other (Specify Below)

    3 1.84%
  • None

    20 12.27%
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  1. #331
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Everyone's bitching about the original League roster but y'know what? I dont care. Yeah, they were all white dudes. I don't need DC to retcon that. Don't tell me Cyborg was there when I have the comics and memories to prove that wrong.

    I don't care about the past nearly as much as I do the now. Yeah, the League founders are white dudes (and one badass woman). Fine, whatever, let's move on. Instead of trying to paint over a past (which won't work) how about we just put PoC in the League now and focus on telling good, inclusive stories today rather than fretting endlessly over a history that we can't change. And no matter what DC does or says, they can't change it either. They can say Vic or Vixen or Dr. Light (hero) or who the hell ever were League founders. It's a lie, and all of us will never forget that it's a lie. So just put some good PoC on the roster now, use them correctly, and focus on making tomorrow better than yesterday was.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

    ~ Black Panther.

  2. #332
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    You can not gain traction when NO ONE IS WILLING TO DO THE WORK.
    You can not gain traction when NO ONE IS WILLING TO GIVE YOU SHOTS OR EDITORIAL IS A JOKE.
    You can not gain traction without CONSISTENT USAGE.

    CONSISTENT USAGE is NOT being in one book as Batman's internet or background fodder or being beating up by Black Panther's cousin. It is development and growth in that one book. A book that should be selling everyone not the PETS of the writer.

    Where are these writers who are NOT named Priest or Hill at? Funny DC seems to keep chasing off the writers who can do that.

    General fandom do not get to decide ANYTHING.
    If Dan's boss ORDERS him to invest in Black Lighting or John Stewart to counter Panther.
    Dan is NOT going to listen to fans. No matter the death threats or complaints.
    Because that is business. Black Lighting fails 11 times guess what number 12 is on the way. His boss does not CARE about yall. All they see is the money Panther and friends bring in.
    They want their cut. They want to know why is that not one of our guys. They don't want to HEAR about fans.
    Just saying, Priest was the one who had Cyborg get beat up by Red Lion.

  3. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Just saying, Priest was the one who had Cyborg get beat up by Red Lion.
    I put that in on purpose.

    And how many times did we see Cyborg get beat up? Not just in Justice league but his own book?

    In fact how many times did he get HACKED? If Riri Williams was in DC-she would have a FIELD day hacking Cyborg.

  4. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    You can not gain traction when NO ONE IS WILLING TO DO THE WORK.
    You can not gain traction when NO ONE IS WILLING TO GIVE YOU SHOTS OR EDITORIAL IS A JOKE.
    You can not gain traction without CONSISTENT USAGE.

    CONSISTENT USAGE is NOT being in one book as Batman's internet or background fodder or being beating up by Black Panther's cousin. It is development and growth in that one book. A book that should be selling everyone not the PETS of the writer.

    Where are these writers who are NOT named Priest or Hill at? Funny DC seems to keep chasing off the writers who can do that.

    General fandom do not get to decide ANYTHING.
    If Dan's boss ORDERS him to invest in Black Lighting or John Stewart to counter Panther.
    Dan is NOT going to listen to fans. No matter the death threats or complaints.
    Because that is business. Black Lighting fails 11 times guess what number 12 is on the way. His boss does not CARE about yall. All they see is the money Panther and friends bring in.
    They want their cut. They want to know why is that not one of our guys. They don't want to HEAR about fans.
    And you of course bought deathstroke, michael cray, and hill's vertigo book... oh wait.. you didnt...

  5. #335
    duke's casettetape lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron chimp View Post
    And you of course bought deathstroke, michael cray, and hill's vertigo book... oh wait.. you didnt...
    I did tho....
    THE SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist so I made him a fandom wiki

    also, check out "The Signal Tape" a Duke Thomas fan project.

    currently following:
    • DC: Red Hood: The Hill
    • Marvel: TBD
    • Manga (Shonen/Seinen): One Piece, My Hero, Dandadan, Jujutsu Kaisen, Kaiju No. 8, Reincarnation of The Veteran Soldier, Oblivion Rouge, ORDEAL, The Breaker: Eternal Force

    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  6. #336
    Ultimate Member Johnny's Avatar
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    This thread is the gift that keeps on giving. We got to a point where comic book fans think that multi-million dollar corporations should have "moral obligation" to do what portions of the fanbase wants them to do. That's just not how the corporate world works. While we sit here and bicker with each other about how our favorite characters are or should be treated, those corporate executives are laughing on their way to the bank...
    Last edited by Johnny; 10-27-2019 at 11:24 AM.

  7. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    So just put some good PoC on the roster now, use them correctly, and focus on making tomorrow better than yesterday was.
    I'd agree. If we can move past the nostalgia that causes all the (white) founders to constantly be recycled back onto the team, and pushing out the later POC / minority characters, like Vixen or Black Lightning or John Stewart, it would be great. Who cares if, fifty years ago, the team was all white.

    It could be more diverse *now* if DC quit dragging all the white founding members back (even, in Barry and Hal's cases, from the grave).

  8. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron chimp View Post
    And you of course bought deathstroke, michael cray, and hill's vertigo book... oh wait.. you didnt...
    What part of Consistent USAGE do you not get?

    It's not here is Wallace in Deathstroke being well written while being CRAPPED on in Flash & Titans.
    You can not sell a character that is getting inconsistent writing.

    I am telling you the same thing I tell Storm fans. Who are giddy that she's done decent in Coates abortion of a book claiming to be Black Panther.
    That does no good when her franchise books treat her like a third class citizen that gets told off by Jean or Kitty.

    Because the X-Men is her franchise. Not Black Panther. Same goes for John Stewart, Wallace, Duke & Aqualad. Because unlike Miles Morales-they are not starring in 4-5 books a month.
    You crap on them in books like Green Lantern, Batman, Aquaman & Flash-don't wonder why they fail. At least in comics.
    Outside of comics that mess does not happen. At least for John, Aqualad & Cyborg.

    As for your other comment-have YOU read them?

    Because I actually OWN Michael Cray-floppies and TRADES.
    I did not care for Hill's Vertigo book.
    Oh I see you didn't include Priest's Justice League run. Own that too.
    Along with....(And I will stick to New 52- Rebirth era)
    Batman & Signal-trade & floppies
    All Star Batman-trade & some floppies
    Cyborg volume 1-2 -floppies
    Black Lighting-DCU Present run, both solo series (floppies), trade (signed by Tony Isabella) & recently got rid of that last mini.
    Batman & Outsiders (thank you dollar bins)
    Huckleberry & Green Lantern book, Hong Kong Phooey & Black Lighting book
    Teen Titans-return of Aqualad run to parts of the recent trade
    Future Quest trades and Mightor issue
    We Are Robin-floppies & trades
    American Way 2 by John Ridley
    Doom Patrol & Shade Changling Girl (who is now a black boy)

    So tell me what I don't buy again?

    Oh I forgot to add these books from that time frame-
    -Erika Alexander's Concrete Park, Reyn, Excellence, Bitter Root, Farmhands, Vercell, Millar's Kick Azz & Prodigy, Wicked & Divine, Savage Dragon, Quincrible and PREORDER his upcoming book at Image, Freeze, Relay, Rivers of London, Lion Forge's Noble, Virgil, Oni Press's The Mage & Mind craft, Ray Anthony Height's Midnight Tiger, Scout Comics' Jazz Legend & Source & The Mall, The Vault's Mall, Resonant, Bankshot, Shadow Man, Livewire, Divinity 1 & 2, Gasolina, Quantum & Woody, Backstagers, Abbot, Fuse, Shaft, Black, Black AF, Black Orphans, Motor Crush, Goldie Vance, Cash & Carrie, Watson & Holmes, Bone Parish, Assassin's Creed Templars, Bingo Love, Cellies, Outer Darkness & MASK. Honorable mentions to Planet of the Nerds, Wrong Earth, Aliens Ice & Fire, Long Con, Rom, Boom's Fence, Outpost Zero, Lumberjanes, Burnouts, Image's Sex, The H1 books, Princeless, Mystery Girl, Rat Queens, The Woods, Spawn & Stronghold.

    Books where black folks are leads, co-leads and showcased better (your mileage will vary) than the ones at DC.

    Here is the KICKER-some of these books are written by DC employees (past & current) like David Walker, Brandon Thomas, Brian Cunn, Brian Hill, Shawn Martinburgh, Jamal Ingl, ChrisCross, Khary Randolph, James Tynion IV, MARC BERNARDIN & Rodney Barnes.


    These are the trades that DC has to content with at libraries and stores. Because this is what Vampire Savior has preached-why beg Dc when others are doing it.
    DC doesn't want to do it-fine. They can accept the consequences and that is COMPETITION. Remember what Ascended said-kids don't want to read Batman-they want variety.

  9. #339
    duke's casettetape lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    What part of Consistent USAGE do you not get?

    It's not here is Wallace in Deathstroke being well written while being CRAPPED on in Flash & Titans.
    You can not sell a character that is getting inconsistent writing.

    I am telling you the same thing I tell Storm fans. Who are giddy that she's done decent in Coates abortion of a book claiming to be Black Panther.
    That does no good when her franchise books treat her like a third class citizen that gets told off by Jean or Kitty.

    Because the X-Men is her franchise. Not Black Panther. Same goes for John Stewart, Wallace, Duke & Aqualad. Because unlike Miles Morales-they are not starring in 4-5 books a month.
    You crap on them in books like Green Lantern, Batman, Aquaman & Flash-don't wonder why they fail. At least in comics.
    Outside of comics that mess does not happen. At least for John, Aqualad & Cyborg.

    As for your other comment-have YOU read them?

    Because I actually OWN Michael Cray-floppies and TRADES.
    I did not care for Hill's Vertigo book.
    Oh I see you didn't include Priest's Justice League run. Own that too.
    Along with....(And I will stick to New 52- Rebirth era)
    Batman & Signal-trade & floppies
    All Star Batman-trade & some floppies
    Cyborg volume 1-2 -floppies
    Black Lighting-DCU Present run, both solo series (floppies), trade (signed by Tony Isabella) & recently got rid of that last mini.
    Batman & Outsiders (thank you dollar bins)
    Huckleberry & Green Lantern book, Hong Kong Phooey & Black Lighting book
    Teen Titans-return of Aqualad run to parts of the recent trade
    Future Quest trades and Mightor issue
    We Are Robin-floppies & trades
    American Way 2 by John Ridley
    Doom Patrol & Shade Changling Girl (who is now a black boy)

    So tell me what I don't buy again?

    Oh I forgot to add these books from that time frame-
    -Erika Alexander's Concrete Park, Reyn, Excellence, Bitter Root, Farmhands, Vercell, Millar's Kick Azz & Prodigy, Wicked & Divine, Savage Dragon, Quincrible and PREORDER his upcoming book at Image, Freeze, Relay, Rivers of London, Lion Forge's Noble, Virgil, Oni Press's The Mage & Mind craft, Ray Anthony Height's Midnight Tiger, Scout Comics' Jazz Legend & Source & The Mall, The Vault's Mall, Resonant, Bankshot, Shadow Man, Livewire, Divinity 1 & 2, Gasolina, Quantum & Woody, Backstagers, Abbot, Fuse, Shaft, Black, Black AF, Black Orphans, Motor Crush, Goldie Vance, Cash & Carrie, Watson & Holmes, Bone Parish, Assassin's Creed Templars, Bingo Love, Cellies, Outer Darkness & MASK. Honorable mentions to Planet of the Nerds, Wrong Earth, Aliens Ice & Fire, Long Con, Rom, Boom's Fence, Outpost Zero, Lumberjanes, Burnouts, Image's Sex, The H1 books, Princeless, Mystery Girl, Rat Queens, The Woods, Spawn & Stronghold.

    Books where black folks are leads, co-leads and showcased better (your mileage will vary) than the ones at DC.

    Here is the KICKER-some of these books are written by DC employees (past & current) like David Walker, Brandon Thomas, Brian Cunn, Brian Hill, Shawn Martinburgh, Jamal Ingl, ChrisCross, Khary Randolph, James Tynion IV, MARC BERNARDIN & Rodney Barnes.


    These are the trades that DC has to content with at libraries and stores. Because this is what Vampire Savior has preached-why beg Dc when others are doing it.
    DC doesn't want to do it-fine. They can accept the consequences and that is COMPETITION. Remember what Ascended said-kids don't want to read Batman-they want variety.
    yikes!

    THE SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist so I made him a fandom wiki

    also, check out "The Signal Tape" a Duke Thomas fan project.

    currently following:
    • DC: Red Hood: The Hill
    • Marvel: TBD
    • Manga (Shonen/Seinen): One Piece, My Hero, Dandadan, Jujutsu Kaisen, Kaiju No. 8, Reincarnation of The Veteran Soldier, Oblivion Rouge, ORDEAL, The Breaker: Eternal Force

    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  10. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    What part of Consistent USAGE do you not get?

    It's not here is Wallace in Deathstroke being well written while being CRAPPED on in Flash & Titans.
    You can not sell a character that is getting inconsistent writing.

    I am telling you the same thing I tell Storm fans. Who are giddy that she's done decent in Coates abortion of a book claiming to be Black Panther.
    That does no good when her franchise books treat her like a third class citizen that gets told off by Jean or Kitty.

    Because the X-Men is her franchise. Not Black Panther. Same goes for John Stewart, Wallace, Duke & Aqualad. Because unlike Miles Morales-they are not starring in 4-5 books a month.
    You crap on them in books like Green Lantern, Batman, Aquaman & Flash-don't wonder why they fail. At least in comics.
    Outside of comics that mess does not happen. At least for John, Aqualad & Cyborg.

    As for your other comment-have YOU read them?

    Because I actually OWN Michael Cray-floppies and TRADES.
    I did not care for Hill's Vertigo book.
    Oh I see you didn't include Priest's Justice League run. Own that too.
    Along with....(And I will stick to New 52- Rebirth era)
    Batman & Signal-trade & floppies
    All Star Batman-trade & some floppies
    Cyborg volume 1-2 -floppies
    Black Lighting-DCU Present run, both solo series (floppies), trade (signed by Tony Isabella) & recently got rid of that last mini.
    Batman & Outsiders (thank you dollar bins)
    Huckleberry & Green Lantern book, Hong Kong Phooey & Black Lighting book
    Teen Titans-return of Aqualad run to parts of the recent trade
    Future Quest trades and Mightor issue
    We Are Robin-floppies & trades
    American Way 2 by John Ridley
    Doom Patrol & Shade Changling Girl (who is now a black boy)

    So tell me what I don't buy again?

    Oh I forgot to add these books from that time frame-
    -Erika Alexander's Concrete Park, Reyn, Excellence, Bitter Root, Farmhands, Vercell, Millar's Kick Azz & Prodigy, Wicked & Divine, Savage Dragon, Quincrible and PREORDER his upcoming book at Image, Freeze, Relay, Rivers of London, Lion Forge's Noble, Virgil, Oni Press's The Mage & Mind craft, Ray Anthony Height's Midnight Tiger, Scout Comics' Jazz Legend & Source & The Mall, The Vault's Mall, Resonant, Bankshot, Shadow Man, Livewire, Divinity 1 & 2, Gasolina, Quantum & Woody, Backstagers, Abbot, Fuse, Shaft, Black, Black AF, Black Orphans, Motor Crush, Goldie Vance, Cash & Carrie, Watson & Holmes, Bone Parish, Assassin's Creed Templars, Bingo Love, Cellies, Outer Darkness & MASK. Honorable mentions to Planet of the Nerds, Wrong Earth, Aliens Ice & Fire, Long Con, Rom, Boom's Fence, Outpost Zero, Lumberjanes, Burnouts, Image's Sex, The H1 books, Princeless, Mystery Girl, Rat Queens, The Woods, Spawn & Stronghold.

    Books where black folks are leads, co-leads and showcased better (your mileage will vary) than the ones at DC.

    Here is the KICKER-some of these books are written by DC employees (past & current) like David Walker, Brandon Thomas, Brian Cunn, Brian Hill, Shawn Martinburgh, Jamal Ingl, ChrisCross, Khary Randolph, James Tynion IV, MARC BERNARDIN & Rodney Barnes.


    These are the trades that DC has to content with at libraries and stores. Because this is what Vampire Savior has preached-why beg Dc when others are doing it.
    DC doesn't want to do it-fine. They can accept the consequences and that is COMPETITION. Remember what Ascended said-kids don't want to read Batman-they want variety.
    Thats odd. Because last time this thread came up a couple of months ago you said you werent reading DC . I guess you must have just forgotten you were reading dc then

  11. #341
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    I did tho....
    Yeah i know you did! I see you talking about them!

    Wakeneuron's thread on the same topic a couple of months ago is one im referring to. Compare and contrast if youre ever terminally bored.

  12. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    These are the trades that DC has to content with at libraries and stores. Because this is what Vampire Savior has preached-why beg Dc when others are doing it.
    DC doesn't want to do it-fine. They can accept the consequences and that is COMPETITION. Remember what Ascended said-kids don't want to read Batman-they want variety.
    Actually, yes! There are plenty of people out there willing to give you black characters worth a darn and willing to take your black dollars to support them. Furthermore. if you see some kind of need you feel is not being met, you can meet it yourself. It's a big task, yeah, but I generally feel black people should spend less energy complaining to Mr. White Man and more energy building their own businesses so they don't HAVE to complain to Mr. White Man. In the long run, that is way more productive.

    Going to DC and constantly whining to them with these demands is like continually begging a girl who is just not interested to go out with you (kind of...). DC is interested in what DC is interested in. If they don't cater to black people as well as some may like...well, that's unfortunate, but that's just not their bread and butter. Their bread and butter is essentially nostalgia porn--and there is nothing wrong with that--and unfortunately, its fans are nostalgic for comics, characters, and status quos that were established during times when people like Carmine Infantino would literally not allow black heroes to be made because he felt it would harm DC's distribution in the south eastern United States (maybe he was right).

    This whole thought of..."No! No! I can't have any of that. I MUST have my prestigious black founding Justice League member!" Okay, these people are just doing that to themselves. First, you won't get that in a satisfactory capacity that will stick, and second, DC's just not that interested in that, clearly. Go find people who are more interested in giving you what you're looking for.
    Last edited by Vampire Savior; 10-27-2019 at 03:58 PM.

  13. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Everyone's bitching about the original League roster but y'know what? I dont care. Yeah, they were all white dudes. I don't need DC to retcon that. Don't tell me Cyborg was there when I have the comics and memories to prove that wrong.

    I don't care about the past nearly as much as I do the now. Yeah, the League founders are white dudes (and one badass woman). Fine, whatever, let's move on. Instead of trying to paint over a past (which won't work) how about we just put PoC in the League now and focus on telling good, inclusive stories today rather than fretting endlessly over a history that we can't change. And no matter what DC does or says, they can't change it either. They can say Vic or Vixen or Dr. Light (hero) or who the hell ever were League founders. It's a lie, and all of us will never forget that it's a lie. So just put some good PoC on the roster now, use them correctly, and focus on making tomorrow better than yesterday was.
    All of these stories are lies. It's fiction. No one's changing your headcanon, fine. But keeping Founding status, which is a higher tier status, all white is a problem. Not evolving with the times is how brands die. Treating minorities as second hand isn't going to work out for DC.

  14. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Just saying, Priest was the one who had Cyborg get beat up by Red Lion.
    Cyborg, by design, is a character who is meant to get beat up, since there are no mortal consequences to tearing him apart like there are with characters like Batman or Flash.

  15. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    What's crazy is you think DC has a moral obligation to do anything. It doesn't. And actually I DO blame (some) fans for the mentality of "WAH WAH WAH! You are OBLIGATED to do what I want. WAAAAAAH! RAAAACISM!!!!!" And then sticking around to repeat the process over and over again.
    If it's that bad, get your fix someplace else.

    But, what is it you specifically want DC to do? You want "more black characters"? I'm using the line in your post.
    Making more black characters isn't going to solve the problem at hand. At least not by itself.
    You do realize that the public doesn't support discriminatory business practices, especially in the media, right? There is in fact a financial dimension to this for the company.

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