X-Men Monday #32 10-14

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

These sweeping blanket statements about "humanity" (juxtaposed with mutants) are divisive and inaccurate.

Not ALL humans are "trash".
Not ALL humans hate mutants.
Not ALL humans reject their mutant kids.
Not ALL humans are on board with murder bots.

Folks constantly shred and rearrange the narrative of the X-Men and mutants and forget the very important message about the importance of NOT applying labels to entire communities.

Stevie Hunter is not having it.

Agree with this and am especially worried about how often the sentiment seems to be popping up around here...

If X-Men has taught us anything before this it's that we can't give in to the same hateful mentalities that fuels the absolute arseholes about us.

The Orchis humans, racist humans and hate groups: Yeah they can **** right off, X-Men should go to town defending themselves and kicking their teeth in for sure,

But everyone doesn't fall under that blanket and so we shouldn't be looking down our noses at each other based on what someone from one group might be thinking.

[RachelGrey]

Agree with this and am especially worried about how often the sentiment seems to be popping up around here...

If X-Men has taught us anything before this it's that we can't give in to the same hateful mentalities that fuels the absolute arseholes about us.

The Orchis humans, racist humans and hate groups: Yeah they can **** right off, X-Men should go to town defending themselves and kicking their teeth in for sure,

But everyone doesn't fall under that blanket and so we shouldn't be looking down our noses at each other based on what someone from one group might be thinking.

The thing is no one has said that the X-Men see all humans this way. They were super pissed off at the Orchis agents because THEY WERE EXPERIMENTING AND TORTURING MUTANT CHILDREN! We even find out in this issue that the whole X-Men #1 mission was to recover the children that they found out Orchis had imprisoned for experimentation.

I don't know how would anyone react walking into a nazi base where they have a bunch of children hooked up to medical equipment so they can perform illegal experiments. I think personally I would throw up in the face of how evil the Orchis agents are, it's a step of evil that is unforgivable.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

The thing is no one has said that the X-Men see all humans this way. They were super pissed off at the Orchis agents because THEY WERE EXPERIMENTING AND TORTURING MUTANT CHILDREN! We even find out in this issue that the whole X-Men #1 mission was to recover the children that they found out Orchis had imprisoned for experimentation.

I don't know how would anyone react walking into a nazi base where they have a bunch of children hooked up to medical equipment so they can perform illegal experiments. I think personally I would throw up in the face of how evil the Orchis agents are, it's a step of evil that is unforgivable.

But no-one's said they don't, either. As in, Magneto's happily running around declaring himself a god amongst all and...nobody's batting an eyelid. That's where people are getting confused.

Nobody is arguing that Orchis is, was, or shall ever be in the right. Not them or anyone LIKE them. All the Graydon Creeds? Friends of Humanity? Yeah, they can **** the hell off. Everyone was justified there.

But those specific groups, just like the Nazi bastards you mention, do not speak for the planet. Those nazis don't represent all white people, they're arseholes who need to be shut-down.

Hence my point: you can't tar everyone with the same brush. Blanket statements only lead to people falling into the exact same ideology; not those made in self-defence, as in "You're all exactly the same."

[spirit2011]

But no-one's said they don't, either. As in, Magneto's happily running around declaring himself a god amongst all and...nobody's batting an eyelid. That's where people are getting confused.

I can't even be happy for Magento with kids, when he act and think himself as a God.

Nobody is arguing that Orchis is, was, or shall ever be in the right. Not them or anyone LIKE them. All the Graydon Creeds? Friends of Humanity? Yeah, they can **** the hell off. Everyone was justified there.

But those specific groups, just like the Nazi bastards you mention, do not speak for the planet. Those nazis don't represent all white people, they're arseholes who need to be shut-down.

Hence my point: you can't tar everyone with the same brush.

Yes, they are minority. A very violent and voval minority

[zinderel]

These sweeping blanket statements about "humanity" (juxtaposed with mutants) are divisive and inaccurate.

Not ALL humans are "trash".
Not ALL humans hate mutants.
Not ALL humans reject their mutant kids.
Not ALL humans are on board with murder bots.

Folks constantly shred and rearrange the narrative of the X-Men and mutants and forget the very important message about the importance of NOT applying labels to entire communities.

Stevie Hunter is not having it.

I won’t change my mind, personally, until the writers present us a world where the average human doesn’t leap at the opportunity to inject strange drugs into their child in the hopes of preventing evolution.

A world where the vast majority of humanity at large (including its greatest heroes) DOESN'T shrug and change the channel while murderbots eradicate 16 million mutants - men, women, and children - in the blink of an eye.

A world where a virulent, hypocritical hatemonger like Greydon Creed doesn’t get enough support to almost become president (Marvel was doing some serious future-seeing there, considering the hypocritical, hatemongering ignoramus who actually BECAME president in the real world, lemme tell you...)

A world where a religious ‘crusade’ founded on genocide CAN’T find an unlimited number of recruits to lynch children on a swing set or murder bus loads of children without a single response from ANY other hero or human aid organization (well, except for the ONE, who respond by sending Sentinels that eventually - SHOCKINGLY - try to murder the very beings they were supposed to protect and whose pilots are shown to be largely racist *+^%bags, except for Rhodes who should ABSOLUTELY have known better, AND who eventually go on to kidnap, torture, experiment on and kill what is believed to be the last mutants on earth...)

A world where the majority of humanity (more often than not INCLUDING the child’s parents) ISN'T shown happily taking part in anti-mutant riots and hysteria wherever a mutant child is discovered.

A world where the vast majority of humanity DIDN'T hypocritically take part in city-wide parties welcoming a toxic cloud of alien chemicals that forced Inhumanity on those it didn’t kill in the process (since unless that changed, last I remember people CAN and DO die during Terrigenesis).

A world where organizations like Orchis CAN’T easily repopulate themselves with supposedly brilliant minds clouded by abject hatred and fear and ignorance...

Until then, I’m not sorry that to me, 616 humanity is trash the way All Cops Are Bastards as long as the Police keep murdering unarmed black people in their homes, harassing people of color in ways they never do to white people, protecting corporate interests over public interests, or generally being class traitors who keep their own people ‘in line’ to benefit the 1%. The way all Republicans are unethical as long as the party and its media arms keep supporting the obviously corrupt and criminal squatter in the Oval Office.

That doesn’t mean there aren’t ‘good ones’ like Stevie, or any of Angel’s or Iceman’s ex’s, or Yukio, or Mariko, or Shogo, or Kyle, or whatever rare, individual example we can think of. It simply means that, by and large, on a systemic level, corruption and abuse of power are too inherent in their status quo, and something needs to change at the core of the problem before anyone changes their minds on the matter. But so far, the latest hate group that is deluding itself into thinking it’s the hero of the story hasn’t done anything to change my mind on the matter.

And I have ABSOLUTE faith that Hickman will do something to change this in some way before he leaves. But until he does, all I see is what I’ve seen for 30+ years of comic reading as a member of a minority: the majority of 616 humanity being fearful, hypocritical, hateful, ignorant, complacent, and generally awful. Just like how we are in the real world towards real minorities and each other, but dialed up to Eleven.

[nandes]

Edit: Wrong thread.

[H-E-D]

These sweeping blanket statements about "humanity" (juxtaposed with mutants) are divisive and inaccurate.

Not ALL humans are "trash".
Not ALL humans hate mutants.
Not ALL humans reject their mutant kids.
Not ALL humans are on board with murder bots.

Folks constantly shred and rearrange the narrative of the X-Men and mutants and forget the very important message about the importance of NOT applying labels to entire communities.

Stevie Hunter is not having it.

“Not all humans”.

[tuck frump]

“Not all humans”.

Literally. Ppl really need to start making the distinction between fiction and real life.

[JKtheMac]

These sweeping blanket statements about "humanity" (juxtaposed with mutants) are divisive and inaccurate.

Not ALL humans are "trash".
Not ALL humans hate mutants.
Not ALL humans reject their mutant kids.
Not ALL humans are on board with murder bots.

Folks constantly shred and rearrange the narrative of the X-Men and mutants and forget the very important message about the importance of NOT applying labels to entire communities.

Stevie Hunter is not having it.

Absolutely. It is blindingly obvious that this narrative is being manipulated by a few posters. Even Hickman’s story which perpetuates the conflict with those who would attack and destroy mutants is making it clear that they are a well funded extremist minority run by a leader with cybernetic implants and views that do not represent the majority of humans.

It is easy to list every atrocity and bad deed heaped upon mutants and then use that as a manifesto of reactionary mutant extremism but it is not a mainstream perspective. When we do see ordinary humans railing against mutants it is usually based on badly written and poorly implemented stories which never really ring true.

This only goes to highlight that this is fictional. The metaphors are not literal. Many stories use the mutant metaphor to highlight very real imbalances and intolerances in our society, but to take up the cause of mutants in real life makes as much sense as joining a religion based on a science fantasy franchise.

That being said, I want someone to write about the Krakoan football team being abused by organised extremist fans. The metaphor is important, but it’s still not real.

[H-E-D]

Literally. Ppl really need to start making the distinction between fiction and real life.

Nowadays I’d think claims of “Not all ___” wouldn’t go over well.

[JKtheMac]

Nowadays I’d think claims of “Not all ___” wouldn’t go over well.

Claims of ‘not all...’ are almost always used to dismiss inequality. I wouldn’t tolerate then in real life. But this is fiction and open to the whims of whichever writer wants to tackle the subject.

The way to address the problematic nature of ‘not all...’ in this case would be to write a comic about it, or failing that a balanced essay on a media website. Arguing about it here or on a social media platform, however driven by personal perspectives, passions or outlooks, will not address the behaviour of fictional humans in a fictional universe.

[zinderel]

Claims of ‘not all...’ are almost always used to dismiss inequality. I wouldn’t tolerate then in real life. But this is fiction and open to the whims of whichever writer wants to tackle the subject.

The way to address the problematic nature of ‘not all...’ in this case would be to write a comic about it, or failing that a balanced essay on a media website. Arguing about it here or on a social media platform, however driven by personal perspectives, passions or outlooks, will not address the behaviour of fictional humans in a fictional universe.

Agreed. And that’s what I want to see. I want humanity to stop being portrayed in such a negative light. Until that time, though, I only have what I’m shown to go by. And a handful of not-terrible humans against a backdrop of nearly uniformly, cartoonishly ignorant and hypocritically bad humanity isn’t enough to change my opinion.

I mean, look no further than how EVERYONE turned on Carol over in Captain Marvel. Turned on her at the drop of a HAT after a mini-skirted new ‘hero’ showed up and spread propaganda that made everyone hate and fear Carol, who has consistently stood in defense of them. Look at the decades of anti-Spider-Man hate. Look at how easily 616 humans turn on EVERY hero for one perceived mistake. And then look at how most of 616 humanity that we are shown treats its own children when the kids manifest as mutants.

Frankly, it amazes me that 616 humanity has ANY champions, considering how fickle and hypocritical they are. And obviously, that’s the fault of the writers for leaning so hard, so often, on that crutch. That said, I mean...OBVIOUSLY #NotAllHumans are trash. Some are amazing and awesome and heroes in their own right, but enough ARE blatant trash that the distinction is as good as moot.

I want to see a story where the heroes all just finally have had enough and throw their hands up in disgust and leave Earth entirely to the humans that hate/worship them and let humanity fend for itself entirely against the terrors of Thanos, Galactus, the Kree, the Skrulls, the Shi’ar, the Badoon, The Brood, the Dire Wraiths, Mephisto, the N’garai, Belasco, the Celestials, and so on.

[Londo Bellian]

Kill them all and let the Old and Obsolete Gods sort them out. The New Gods can't be bothered to.

[Glio]

The problem with "Not all humans" is that we have almost never seen an active effort by superheroes or human authorities to end their "rotten apples."

All those groups of Purifiers, Friends of Humanity, The Right and others have never had to worry about whether one day Captain America enters their secret base or if the police stop them.

[Mutant X]

Humans never embrace the mutants for the same reason Batman never saves Gotham, because they are sequential stories and if you remove their core element they are over.