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  1. #346
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    The problem with "not all humans" discourse is it comes from the exact same people who would say not all men/white people/straight people and theyre all only engaging in that bc they feel their real life views are being called out which is a reach.
    All humans are rotten speciesists because its easier to write. No one cares to read abt human parents of mutant children school council. Claremont took the time to depict pro human mutants but now comics pacing and storytelling is different. It dont have to stick to real life and readers should be able to put enough distance between their experience and the things theyre reading to realize its a fictional story, not a callout post aimed at them.

  2. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuck frump View Post
    The problem with "not all humans" discourse is it comes from the exact same people who would say not all men/white people/straight people and theyre all only engaging in that bc they feel their real life views are being called out which is a reach.
    All humans are rotten speciesists because its easier to write. No one cares to read abt human parents of mutant children school council. Claremont took the time to depict pro human mutants but now comics pacing and storytelling is different. It dont have to stick to real life and readers should be able to put enough distance between their experience and the things theyre reading to realize its a fictional story, not a callout post aimed at them.
    It might just be me but that sounds like contrived writing. I don’t see how the X-Men can be an accurate social commentary if there aren’t allies somewhere in the fray. If writers are so poor nowadays that they lack the ability to demonstrate the complexity of mutantdom’s evolutionary rivals then they probably shouldn’t be writing the X-Men. Not saying that’s what Hickman has done (indeed I think he’ll do the opposite as time goes on), but this idea that people shouldn’t expect some level of depth to “humanity” reads as very lazy. I’d even say that’s part of the reason the X-Men fell so low to begin with.

  3. #348
    BANNED spirit2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    It might just be me but that sounds like contrived writing. I don’t see how the X-Men can be an accurate social commentary if there aren’t allies somewhere in the fray. If writers are so poor nowadays that they lack the ability to demonstrate the complexity of mutantdom’s evolutionary rivals then they probably shouldn’t be writing the X-Men. Not saying that’s what Hickman has done (indeed I think he’ll do the opposite as time goes on), but this idea that people shouldn’t expect some level of depth to “humanity” reads as very lazy. I’d even say that’s part of the reason the X-Men fell so low to begin with.
    Bendis there was human allies.

    Writers since then just wanted to show one side

  4. #349
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuck frump View Post
    The problem with "not all humans" discourse is it comes from the exact same people who would say not all men/white people/straight people and theyre all only engaging in that bc they feel their real life views are being called out which is a reach.
    All humans are rotten speciesists because its easier to write. No one cares to read abt human parents of mutant children school council. Claremont took the time to depict pro human mutants but now comics pacing and storytelling is different. It dont have to stick to real life and readers should be able to put enough distance between their experience and the things theyre reading to realize its a fictional story, not a callout post aimed at them.
    Very much in agreement.

    Going in...We should always assume that "not all humans" hate and fear mutants. Because, as you astutely pointed out...Claremont showed pro-mutant humans do exist.
    What might be an issue for discourse is whether or not he should have written about them more, and whether or not current writers of today's X-Men/Mutants should do so as well...to give a more 'balanced' representation to humanity.

    Personally, I know they exist but I don't really feel they are an integral part of this Krokoa Era, at least not at this beginning juncture. Later on, once the books and stories have
    settled, then sure...but for now, it's not about them.
    Lord Ewing *Praise His name! Uplift Him in song!* Your divine works will be missed but they will be remembered and glorified in worship for all eternity. Amen!

  5. #350
    Extraordinary Member CGAR's Avatar
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    Wrong thread. My bad.

  6. #351
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutant X View Post
    Humans never embrace the mutants for the same reason Batman never saves Gotham, because they are sequential stories and if you remove their core element they are over.
    It is strange it is even necessary to say that, isn’t it?
    “And I urge you to please notice when you are happy, and exclaim or murmur or think at some point, 'If this isn't nice, I don't know what is.” ― Kurt Vonnegut Jr.

  7. #352
    Braddock Isle JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Personally, I know they exist but I don't really feel they are an integral part of this Krokoa Era, at least not at this beginning juncture. Later on, once the books and stories have
    settled, then sure...but for now, it's not about them.
    Agreed. We'll get there.

    Bobby and his parents had some good showings in "Iceman". Difficult relationship but they were able to come together. I'd be happy to see relationships like this explored as related to Krakoa.
    "Danielle... I intend to do something rash and violent." - Betsy Braddock
    Krakoa, Arakko, and Otherworld forever!

  8. #353
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuck frump View Post
    The problem with "not all humans" discourse is it comes from the exact same people who would say not all men/white people/straight people and theyre all only engaging in that bc they feel their real life views are being called out which is a reach.
    Yes that is a problem with ‘not all...’ it isn’t necessarily the main one. Which I would suggest is a means of not listening to the points being made by a person expressing their personal experiences.

    On the other hand it is perfectly valid to object when someone says “all men are...” “all women are...” “all gay men are...” etc. etc.

    We could be more careful with the defence of the latter to at least acknowledge that someone may be trying to explain something about their own situation. Sometimes it isn’t appropriate to jump to anyone’s defence, which is basically the same as your point.
    “And I urge you to please notice when you are happy, and exclaim or murmur or think at some point, 'If this isn't nice, I don't know what is.” ― Kurt Vonnegut Jr.

  9. #354
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKtheMac View Post
    On the other hand it is perfectly valid to object when someone says “all men are...” “all women are...” “all gay men are...” etc. etc
    Its really not necessary and only distract from the original topic.

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