X-Men #1 Discussion Thread [Spoilers]

[MutantHipster]

Hope's relationship with Cable was broken years ago. She kicked Old man Cable out of her life and stole his X-force squad. Did she even care when Wi-Fi retired him?


LoL right? I think Hickman wants to make Hope's new idenrity with the Five even more Clear by distinguishing her from Clan Summers.

[Tycon]

Y’all didn’t read Cable (2017) and it shows.

[TheDeadSpace]

Y’all didn’t read Cable (2017) and it shows.

I think The Exterminated #1 is quite relevant as well.

[Handsome men don't lose fights]

Y’all didn’t read Cable (2017) and it shows.

Wait, there was follow through on an old character beat? Hell, that's not the X-office I know.

(Slinks off to ComiXology to look up Cable 2017.)

[MutantHipster]

Y’all didn’t read Cable (2017) and it shows.

You're right, honestly HoxPox got me back into X-men fter the burial Marvel ws giving them. I should check out the series you menioned. Thanks.

[Tycon]

I think The Exterminated #1 is quite relevant as well.

True, I can see all of that as a neat reintroduction to Hope (even though like right after she went on to accidentally shoot her grandpa and show no remorse for it)

Wait, there was follow through on an old character beat? Hell, that's not the X-office I know.

(Slinks off to ComiXology to look up Cable 2017.)

You're right, honestly HoxPox got me back into X-men fter the burial Marvel ws giving them. I should check out the series you menioned. Thanks.

Waitwaitwaitwaitwait before you do, I recommend really just reading the ‘Past Fears’ arc (#155-159). It flows really well into Extermination and The Exterminated, plus it’s a really great look at Cable’s history as well as a cool character analysis. The other parts of the series are alright at best.

[Killerbee911]

Giving humans and different countries drugs in exchange for recognition/safety isn't inherently unfair/evil. I think the issue is that these are the X-men however, and they are supposed to be heroes with morals better than most. So, while the deal isn't evil, it isn't an action outright intended for the betterment of all. It takes some of the heroism out of the X-men.

Well that is one of the bigger problem with comics, Superhero for some fans means an unrealistic standard of perfection that at times make characters look like caricatures. I get the wish-fulfillment and fantasy aspect of heroes who never do anything wrong and are these higher standards but that is Justice League or Avengers not X-men It doesn't work for the X-men imo. The X-men imo have always been more of the great good type of guys than the no-compromise guys.

Being a superhero in Marvel means you put humanity first which is why Avengers end up looking super unintentionally hypocritical in books because mutants are part of people who need protecting and due X-men stuff being X-men stuff those high moral heroes just look bad because they can't interact with the world effectively. X-men have settled into being mutants first and superheroes second. Not all fans appreciate that mutants are heroes to their people first and when X-men catering to saving mutants first some people say they look less heroic. The X-men haven't done anything yet to less heroic to me because they aren't forgetting who they are first. The disconnect in what is heroic comes from who should the X-men priority be to save or if the X-men should have higher priority as heroes to look out for the best interest of everyone on earth. To me X-men no look no less heroic for taking care of their people first AND in the process helping the world but people have different perspectives on heroism.

[zinderel]

Well that is one of the bigger problem with comics, Superhero for some fans means an unrealistic standard of perfection that at times make characters look like caricatures. I get the wish-fulfillment and fantasy aspect of heroes who never do anything wrong and are these higher standards but that is Justice League or Avengers not X-men It doesn't work for the X-men imo. The X-men imo have always been more of the great good type of guys than the no-compromise guys.

Being a superhero in Marvel means you put humanity first which is why Avengers end up looking super unintentionally hypocritical in books because mutants are part of people who need protecting and due X-men stuff being X-men stuff those high moral heroes just look bad because they can't interact with the world effectively. X-men have settled into being mutants first and superheroes second. Not all fans appreciate that mutants are heroes to their people first and when X-men catering to saving mutants first some people say they look less heroic. The X-men haven't done anything yet to less heroic to me because they aren't forgetting who they are first. The disconnect in what is heroic comes from who should the X-men priority be to save or if the X-men should have higher priority as heroes to look out for the best interest of everyone on earth. To me X-men no look no less heroic for taking care of their people first AND in the process helping the world but people have different perspectives on heroism.

Agreed. This is how I see it too. And really, considering how rarely any other heroes show up to help mutant causes, it AMAZES me how often the X-Men go out of their way to help the other heroes who can’t be bothered to help them. And yet, people still say they aren’t as heroic for not putting humanity’s desires before mutankind’s needs...

They keep on doing emotional and heroic labor for others, even when those others don’t reciprocate. If anything, that makes them MORE heroic than most other heroes. Their primary focus is on their own people, but when the world is threatened by Carnage or Norman Osborne, or Thanos, or whatever, they step up to help, because even though they focus on their own, they live on the Earth too.

It’s like...

Whenever there's a Spider-Man event, there’s Wolverine to help out, and sometimes others as well.
When the Avengers have an event, the non-Wolverine X-Men show up to help out, either in main story or in a tie-in.

Meanwhile, whenever the mutant race is on the latest verge of extinction...where are the tie-ins titles and non-mutant cameos (to offer aid or help, not to kidnap a minor in their care, I mean...)? Why is the excuse always, ‘oh well, the X-Men are in their own corner of the universe and it wouldn’t be logical to have other heroes show up all the time...’, when it’s mutant event and tragedies, but ‘The X-Men are part of the larger universe and have to step up as heroes!’ whenever it’s a Spider event or Avengers event?

[TheDeadSpace]

Well that is one of the bigger problem with comics, Superhero for some fans means an unrealistic standard of perfection that at times make characters look like caricatures. I get the wish-fulfillment and fantasy aspect of heroes who never do anything wrong and are these higher standards but that is Justice League or Avengers not X-men It doesn't work for the X-men imo. The X-men imo have always been more of the great good type of guys than the no-compromise guys.

Being a superhero in Marvel means you put humanity first which is why Avengers end up looking super unintentionally hypocritical in books because mutants are part of people who need protecting and due X-men stuff being X-men stuff those high moral heroes just look bad because they can't interact with the world effectively. X-men have settled into being mutants first and superheroes second. Not all fans appreciate that mutants are heroes to their people first and when X-men catering to saving mutants first some people say they look less heroic. The X-men haven't done anything yet to less heroic to me because they aren't forgetting who they are first. The disconnect in what is heroic comes from who should the X-men priority be to save or if the X-men should have higher priority as heroes to look out for the best interest of everyone on earth. To me X-men no look no less heroic for taking care of their people first AND in the process helping the world but people have different perspectives on heroism.

Is it problematic? I'm not too sure on that. It probably comes down to individual preferences. Are they less relatable? By all means, however, I think certain characters can be relatable and demonstrate higher morals while still falling short with human tendencies. Spider-man and Batman come to mind in that aspect. There are X-men that demonstrate this as well. Also, the X-men have the slogan: Saving a world that fears and hates them. I feel that's a pretty good representation of their heroics and a reminder that they are superheroes.

I'm not trying to say the setup of Krakoa is bad by any means, but where are the mutants with differing opinions and conflicting morals? The X-men being in complete agreement with this setup feels off and by all means, I can completely see why some are turned off by it.

[zinderel]

Is it problematic? I'm not too sure on that. It probably comes down to individual preferences. Are they less relatable? By all means, however, I think certain characters can be relatable and demonstrate higher morals while still falling short with human tendencies. Spider-man and Batman come to mind in that aspect. There are X-men that demonstrate this as well. Also, the X-men have the slogan: Saving a world that fears and hates them. I feel that's a pretty good representation of their heroics and a reminder that they are superheroes.

I'm not trying to say the setup of Krakoa is bad by any means, but where are the mutants with differing opinions and conflicting morals? The X-men being in complete agreement with this setup feels off and by all means, I can completely see why some are turned off by it.

I think Fallen Angels is going to touch on those left cold by Krakoa and it’s goings-on.

[TheDeadSpace]

I think Fallen Angels is going to touch on those left cold by Krakoa and it’s goings-on.

While Fallen Angels seems to be the book that's going to do that, it's definitely odd that some characters aren't doing the same. Although I'm pretty sure that's the intention. At least I hope. It's a bit hard to tell for now.

[CoCoBandz]

While Fallen Angels seems to be the book that's going to do that, it's definitely odd that some characters aren't doing the same. Although I'm pretty sure that's the intention. At least I hope.

Just give it time.

We're literally one issue into the dawn books and Krakoa is new for most...

Dissention at this point in time would be a joke. There will eventually be falling outs down the line.

[TheDeadSpace]

Just give it time.

We're literally one issue into the dawn books and Krakoa is new for most...

Dissention at this point in time would be a joke. There will eventually be falling outs down the line.

Honestly, I am enjoying the series so far. Some things I may not like, but it is interesting and I can see where it's going.

At the same time, I can see why some are put off by the whole thing. I'm not sure their concerns should be shrugged off as needless hate. Some criticisms are valid and offer discussion.

Even so, I think enjoyment can still be made.

The one thing I don't want to do is mess with other's enjoyment of the series. Hopefully that's not what I'm coming off as.

[Killerbee911]

Is it problematic? I'm not too sure on that. It probably comes down to individual preferences. Are they less relatable? By all means, however, I think certain characters can be relatable and demonstrate higher morals while still falling short with human tendencies. Spider-man and Batman come to mind in that aspect. There are X-men that demonstrate this as well. Also, the X-men have the slogan: Saving a world that fears and hates them. I feel that's a pretty good representation of their heroics and a reminder that they are superheroes.

I'm not trying to say the setup of Krakoa is bad by any means, but where are the mutants with differing opinions and conflicting morals? The X-men being in complete agreement with this setup feels off and by all means, I can completely see why some are turned off by it.

Yes when people won't accept growth, It is a little problematic the X-men began as only "Xavier dream" but over the years what I am going to call "Magneto's dream" has become a near equal part of the X-men. The X-men is when it is done right it is TWO conflicting reasonable views. Both dreams have flaws Xavier's dream is too reactive at times, Magento's dream is too proactive at times. But when Magneto method isn't too proactive that creates a dilemma because explain to me why he is wrong. The writers and editors have at times parroted that Xavier and Magneto are stand-ins for MLK and Malcolm X. Well, the X-men comics are fulfilling that potential now but people went confront with the other another ideology people are quick to call it evil. Yes Hickman is purposely stirring the pot but X-men is now two ideals. Anybody come away with is happening is completely wrong feels like they are missing the point of series. I haven't had to confront anybody feeling that X-men are completely right because I haven't seen as it but I would tell them the same thing.

Anyways the X-men slogan: Saving a world that fears and hates them. Nowhere does saving mutants first contradict that and the "them" has to be around to in order to save the world.

Also Magneto points for clarity

1. Humans attack you fight back and even kill them
2. Mutants are what is next and if left to nature mutants would be the common species on earth. Mutants are an "improvement" over humans
3. We don't have to get along to survive together. Xavier's way has always been coexisting and get along with humans. But there is a legit argument that we are seeing right now for no mutants don't have to get along with humans to coexist.

[powerpax]

The fact is the X-Men's worldview and ethos have shifted because the real world has shifted. They have always been an allegory for minority rights. What we have seen over the last two decades is a shift in state power and recognition of many minorities, at times for the better, and at other times for the far worse. Brown and black people are caged or shot down in the streets. Laws are enacted to attempt to roll back rights to marry or adopt. Other nations around the world actively persecute and attempt to exterminate queer people or a slew of ethnic minorities, indigenous peoples or political dissidents.

The fact is the old ways of peaceful protest and open dialogue only get us so far. The X-Men have become radicalized because real people like them began to have to adopt more aggressive methods to fight for their own rights and survival. There is no going back to how it was in the '80s and '90s. They are different because we are different.