X-Men Can't Have Nice Things

[Veitha]

Cerebra can be rebuilt. They have backup servers. Jean, Emma or Rachel could substitute Charles.

[Londo Bellian]

I honestly don’t think this is about cracks. This is about exploring and making stories out of these potential weaknesses. The weaknesses are now part of the new stakes, with the overall stakes being about building the nation and then getting back to some form of peace with humans.

Building the nation, yes. Peace with humans? While Hickman may have guaranteed no other shoe will drop on Krakoa with regards to its OWN destruction and death of the citizens, the same might not apply to the rest of the Marvel Universe. HoxPoxDox could well be THE official "X-Men Revenge" fic, proving their brand and their subspecies' promotional boast as the most powerful beings in all of Marvel by destroying all other franchises aside from its own. Kind of like Onslaught, but with little chance that certain title lines like Spider-Man will be spared the purge. The Avengers' time as the heart of the MCU has ended after all; no star power synergy will save the original comic-book versions from being raped by mutantkind anymore. Who's to say that the New Mutants will take offense at the Starjammers for ditching them in Shi'ar space on their first issue and kill them off later in retribution, with Cyclops' blessing? They're not mutants anyway, they don't matter outside of obsolete sapien blood-ties on Corsair's part. The TPs alone can kill all non-mutant life in the MU if they really want to.

[Ambaryerno]

This is going to end in AvX II. The premise is setting up FAR to many conflicts with other parts of the Marvel Universe for it not to (X-Men taking over the Blue Area of the Moon, Krakoa leeching into Avalon, debate over the disposition of Franklin Richards, etc.)

[Starfish]

This is going to end in AvX II. The premise is setting up FAR to many conflicts with other parts of the Marvel Universe for it not to (X-Men taking over the Blue Area of the Moon, Krakoa leeching into Avalon, debate over the disposition of Franklin Richards, etc.)

I can see mutants coming out on top for the first time, only for a precog to foresee they'll still end up getting eaten by the Phalanx, because only a union of mutants, humans, and machines will be able to overcome it. That's the great cosmic filter put in place by the powers that be to ensure that only civilisations who get their act together responsibly will ascend beyond it, while any civilisations who succumb to tribalism and infighting will be purged by it.

[JKtheMac]

This is going to end in AvX II. The premise is setting up FAR to many conflicts with other parts of the Marvel Universe for it not to (X-Men taking over the Blue Area of the Moon, Krakoa leeching into Avalon, debate over the disposition of Franklin Richards, etc.)

People keep saying this but I just don’t see it. That would be an example of ‘the other foot’ that Hickman keeps saying isn’t coming. This isn’t a status quo designed to build and then fall. This is designed to put the mutants in a better and more coherent place in the Marvel Universe long term. Now we haven’t seen what that long term status quo will actually be yet, but it will not be about having to continually fight to even exist. That just doesn’t work in the long term.

I can see mutants coming out on top for the first time, only for a precog to foresee they'll still end up getting eaten by the Phalanx, because only a union of mutants, humans, and machines will be able to overcome it. That's the great cosmic filter put in place by the powers that be to ensure that only civilisations who get their act together responsibly will ascend beyond it, while any civilisations who succumb to tribalism and infighting will be purged by it.

Precognition is being banned for a reason. Too much focus on specific dark futures is not good for the ongoing story. I fully expect Destiny to pop up at some point and throw a spanner in the works but not for at least a year maybe longer. Because part of the point is to not keep telling ‘oh woe is us, our future is bleak’ stories that never seem to resolve anything.

[Londo Bellian]

The thing is, from the mutant/Krakoa POV there may be no bleakness; dark futures now possibly falls on the non-X sections of the Marvel franchise in a fair-is-fair situation at the hands of mutantkind. And certain fans will lap up any story that will see the X-Men-led mutants eviscerating the Avengers, Champions, Guardians, Eternals, Spider-people, everybody who is not a mutant, because by never helping out significantly during the decade (in-universe) of darkness they deserve to burn with the mass of flatscans. Like Loki in "Ragnarok" they crow, "THAT'S HOW IT FEELS! And we'll make it feel A DECI-CENTILLION GOOGLEPLEXES TIMES WORSE! Blame this on the misfortune of your lack of an X-Gene!"

[JKtheMac]

The thing is, from the mutant/Krakoa POV there may be no bleakness; dark futures now possibly falls on the non-X sections of the Marvel franchise in a fair-is-fair situation at the hands of mutantkind. And certain fans will lap up any story that will see the X-Men-led mutants eviscerating the Avengers, Champions, Guardians, Eternals, Spider-people, everybody who is not a mutant, because by never helping out significantly during the decade (in-universe) of darkness they deserve to burn with the mass of flatscans. Like Loki in "Ragnarok" they crow, "THAT'S HOW IT FEELS! And we'll make it feel A DECI-CENTILLION GOOGLEPLEXES TIMES WORSE! Blame this on the misfortune of your lack of an X-Gene!"

And how does that help with Xavier’s ‘only hope for peace’. Unless for some strange reason The Avengers actually try and take down Krakoa, which would clearly breach international law, which is something they usually are careful not to totally ignore even when doing it, there is no way Krakoa will go to war with The Avengers. Krakoa would immediately be labelled a rogue state and all of the good work they have done would collapse.

[djoki96]

Building the nation, yes. Peace with humans? While Hickman may have guaranteed no other shoe will drop on Krakoa with regards to its OWN destruction and death of the citizens, the same might not apply to the rest of the Marvel Universe. HoxPoxDox could well be THE official "X-Men Revenge" fic, proving their brand and their subspecies' promotional boast as the most powerful beings in all of Marvel by destroying all other franchises aside from its own. Kind of like Onslaught, but with little chance that certain title lines like Spider-Man will be spared the purge. The Avengers' time as the heart of the MCU has ended after all; no star power synergy will save the original comic-book versions from being raped by mutantkind anymore. Who's to say that the New Mutants will take offense at the Starjammers for ditching them in Shi'ar space on their first issue and kill them off later in retribution, with Cyclops' blessing? They're not mutants anyway, they don't matter outside of obsolete sapien blood-ties on Corsair's part. The TPs alone can kill all non-mutant life in the MU if they really want to.

I hope you're kidding. Besides maybe Franklin, no mutant, even with Phoenix Force, could come even close to things like Dormammu.

And let's not even start with Celestials or the Living Tribunal.

[Londo Bellian]

Perhaps. But try telling the likes of Punch Dimension that.

And in the start of X-Force there is the possibility that the allowing of human suicide infiltrators to breach Krakoa using skin grafts from Domino, plus the apparent assassination of X in Sokovia, may have all been deliberate orchestrations to galvanize the mission statement of the latest iteration of X-Force: half-intel agency and half wetworks with zero restriction regarding the Second Krakoan Law, and with Krakoa as a whole potentially being in the know of all these. Who's to say Krakoa can't bait non-Marvel heroes into crossing them so they'd have an excuse to eliminate the same, while demonstrating to the UN that they are justified in their self-defense actions? They pretty much already suckered the Captain Britain powers from Brian to Betsy, a mutant and therefore citizen of Krakoa alone with un-guaranteed loyalty to Queen and (her flatscan) Country.

[Maestroneto]

I hope you're kidding. Besides maybe Franklin, no mutant, even with Phoenix Force, could come even close to things like Dormammu.

And let's not even start with Celestials or the Living Tribunal.

Didn't they defeat Dormammu in Uncanny X-Men (2013)?

[Londo Bellian]

See. There? Proof that the X-Men and mutants are the most powerful entities in Marvel, stronger than even the Ones-Above/Below-All even.

[Veitha]

Didn't they defeat Dormammu in Uncanny X-Men (2013)?

They where in Limbo. Illyana can defeat almost anyone there, especially magical beings.

[powerpax]

Perhaps. But try telling the likes of Punch Dimension that.

Pretty sure he was having a laugh in response to anguished hyperbole about the new status quo.

[Tunasammiches]

People keep saying this but I just don’t see it. That would be an example of ‘the other foot’ that Hickman keeps saying isn’t coming. This isn’t a status quo designed to build and then fall. This is designed to put the mutants in a better and more coherent place in the Marvel Universe long term. Now we haven’t seen what that long term status quo will actually be yet, but it will not be about having to continually fight to even exist. That just doesn’t work in the long term.

Maybe. As long as Hickman is around... no guarantee how long that will last. Plans and designs tend to change with the guard. But I don't see this as a long term thing or even a design for longevity. In POX Hickman's already set up the fall of the mutants in the future, and peppered in hints of Sinister betraying them at some point. In HoX, he's written the humans even scarier and more radicalized. Plus evil mutants living on the same island as good ones? I just don't see this period of mutant revolution being a long-term situation. They should all just move off of earth and colonize another planet.

[tuck frump]

Didn't they defeat Dormammu in Uncanny X-Men (2013)?

They did. Legion also eradicted the Elder Gods in New Mutants vol.3. And rewrote ALL of reality a couple of times.
Hickman also stated in PoX #5 that Phoenix, along with Galactus was the only threat to dominions.