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  1. #46
    Spectacular Member Superbat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Most of the people who didn't want Superman to be married with a child weren't interested in queering his life or felt that him not being married was defying patriarchy. They either hated Lois, thought married characters were boring, wanted Superman to be some superpowered cassanova or like Frank Miller wanted him to hook up with Wonder Woman. Nelliebly's comment was directed at those people and they even mention Frank Miller who certainly cannot be argued was interested in keeping Superman single or defying patriarchal norms.
    Saying there is absolutely no reason for opposing specific story choices unless we are operating under patriarchal storytelling standards does not leave room for interpretation. It is erasure, plain and simple.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Most of the people who didn't want Superman to be married with a child weren't interested in queering his life or felt that him not being married was defying patriarchy. They either hated Lois, thought married characters were boring, wanted Superman to be some superpowered cassanova or like Frank Miller wanted him to hook up with Wonder Woman. Nelliebly's comment was directed at those people and they even mention Frank Miller who certainly cannot be argued was interested in keeping Superman single or defying patriarchal norms.
    Thank you. Exactly this. I refuse to be accused of something I absolutely did not say.

    An argument for Superman being allowed to be canonically portrayed as queer or an entirely different convo, and btw? A queer Superman could absolutely still be married to a woman and have a child because bisexual men exist. You can make a valid argument for Superman being bisexual that doesn’t need to crap on Lois at all or remove their relationship. No one should assume to know anyone’s sexuality on here. The fact that I’m married to a man does not mean that I identify as heterosexual and I don’t appreciate the accusation that it does.

    We are allowed to talk openly about the misogyny that surrounds the way DC and fandom has treated both Lois and the marriage without being accused of something that no one said to start with.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superbat View Post
    Saying there is absolutely no reason for opposing specific story choices unless we are operating under patriarchal storytelling standards does not leave room for interpretation. It is erasure, plain and simple.
    And denying the misogyny that exists towards Lois and the marriage coupled with the reality that Clark being queer doesn’t automatically mean that he’s not married to her is also erasure


    My comment about Frank Miller was fairly indicative of the kind of POV I was talking about.

    A good portion of the Lois and Clark fandom are bisexual women, many of whom have chosen to marry men but that doesn’t make them any less queer.

    So while I appreciate where you are coming from, I think we are at a standstill. And I would appreciate you not assuming you know my sexuality given we don’t know each other and you aren’t in a position to assume anything about how I identify.
    Last edited by Nelliebly; 10-18-2019 at 12:40 PM.

  4. #49
    Spectacular Member Superbat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    Thank you. Exactly this. I refuse to be accused of something I absolutely did not say.
    It is exactly what you said.

    You specified that there was only one reason to oppose Superman being a father, and you gave it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    And there is absolutely nothing wrong with Superman being a father either unless you are operating under patriarchal storytelling standards
    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    An argument for Superman being allowed to be canonically portrayed as queer or an entirely different convo,
    It isn't when you say there's only one reason to oppose him being a father. Choose your words more carefully if that isn't what you meant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    and btw? A queer Superman could absolutely still be married to a woman and have a child because bisexual men exist.
    Do you even know what queering means?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    No one should assume to know anyone’s sexuality on here. The fact that I’m married to a man does not mean that I identify as heterosexual and I don’t appreciate the accusation that it does.
    I didn't assume your sexuality before, but seeing you are being.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    We are allowed to talk openly about the misogyny that surrounds the way DC and fandom has treated both Lois and the marriage without being accused of something that no one said to start with.
    You can do it without the erasure of queer fans like me.
    Last edited by Superbat; 10-18-2019 at 02:48 PM.

  5. #50
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    https://www.cbr.com/dc-comics-solici...-january-2020/

    The tribute to Whatever Happened To The Man of Tomorrow is fire. Leviathan working with Lex has me kind of buggin'. Looks like Conner's gonna meet Clark. Shout outs to the president Superman confirm. So hype.

    Superman: Heroes #1 is next level "exactly what I need from this sort of thing." I LOVE that we can just get these one-shots when big sh!t goes down. I love the idea of doing another one of these jam session issues focused on Superman's world. Loving that we're gonna get reactions from all around. And I love that issue 19 is the aftermath.
    "Superman: Heroes" sounds like a weird title for a book exploring the impact on Clark Kent. It sounds more like a one-shot setting up stories for the Superfamily or the everyday heroes of Metropolis. I'm guessing Rucka is doing Lois, Fraction Jimmy, and Houser will be doing either Supergirl or the other heroes.

    Also kind of weird that everyone looks so happy on that cover. At least people seem more unsure on the Reis cover. Is Barry happy because he wishes he could just be open about his identity?

    Kinda feel like this is downplaying the President of Earth aspect but it looks like they're exploring that too. Hmm.

    Maybe it's just me but Romita's depictions of DC characters feels much looser then it used to. His Leviathan is very chunky.

  6. #51
    Spectacular Member Superbat's Avatar
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    Removed for reasons
    Last edited by Superbat; 10-18-2019 at 12:53 PM.

  7. #52
    Fantastic Member MeGrimlock420's Avatar
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    Where is Jon in all this? How does he feel about his dad revealing his identity? It pretty much shows everyone else in the books but him.

  8. #53
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeGrimlock420 View Post
    Where is Jon in all this? How does he feel about his dad revealing his identity? It pretty much shows everyone else in the books but him.
    The 31st century.

  9. #54
    Fantastic Member MeGrimlock420's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The 31st century.
    Clark can communicate with him with the legion ring. Or Bendis is going something dumb like Clark breaking the Legion ring and Jon comes back 20 something in 3 weeks.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeGrimlock420 View Post
    Where is Jon in all this? How does he feel about his dad revealing his identity? It pretty much shows everyone else in the books but him.
    I’m guessing he’s not really around which ....is unfortunate.

  11. #56
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeGrimlock420 View Post
    Where is Jon in all this? How does he feel about his dad revealing his identity? It pretty much shows everyone else in the books but him.
    Probably "uh...cool?"

    I mean, it's not like he cares about being Jon Kent anymore.

  12. #57
    Incredible Member Jman27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeGrimlock420 View Post
    Where is Jon in all this? How does he feel about his dad revealing his identity? It pretty much shows everyone else in the books but him.
    him revealing his identity will help explain what happens to his kid that aged
    "He's pure power and doesn't even know it. He's the best of us."-Matt Murdock

  13. #58
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    DC just needs to reset. Bendis and King have killed their two biggest characters. Everything that has happened since Rebirth with Batman and since Bendis came on to Superman just needs to be erased. None of this has been good storytelling. It's just been big name writers who want to tell their own stories but know they won't sell as well so they are forcing characters to fit their story instead of writing stories that fit the characters. Bruce being broken because he was dumped and the ENTIRE Jon storyline since Bendis took over are just bad. Then there Bendis pretty much coming in and wrecking Lois and Clark's marriage after they had been so strong prior to his showing up. Why can't writers take time to research their characters and create stories that make sense to who they are anymore? The identity reveal is a dumb idea that has been done and will eventually be retconned out. I'm about done with DC.

  14. #59
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Edit: They’re still together, they still love one another, they’re not cheating on one another. The marriage is fine. You want to say he ruined Jon that’s a different argument, but Lois and Clark are fine.
    Last edited by Vordan; 10-18-2019 at 01:44 PM.

  15. #60
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Eh, its my opinion that the marriage hasn't been strong since the very earliest days of it in the late 90s. But that aside, he didn't do anything to wreck it. He's wrecking the lore, but their relationship is fine. He never broke them up or anything and he's not going to.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

    "Now why don't we step up here and everybody get stepped up, and let's get some stepped up personal space up in this place." - Phillip Jacobs

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