What if Wallace West/new 52 Kid Flash/ Black Wally West was from another earth ?

[Tzigone]

Wally had an ACTUAL FAMILY that made him different than Barry. Yet DC don’t want non Batman heroes to have their own families.

Yeah. I liked his good family from the pre-COIE days, actually. And then, of course, Linda and the twins (though I'd have preferred no speed-aging) later. But no happiness allowed, only angst.

The character is just not worth even trying to salvage to me. Similar to Cyborg, I don't know why DC tried for so long to make him a thing instead of just admitting they messed up and move on. If you have something really awesome that needs some time to find its audience, I get that and it's normal. But when you crap the bed right from the get-go, I just don't see the point in holding on and trying to make that work.

There was nothing at all wrong with Cyborg as a character in the early days and NTT sold like gangbusters. The problem began in the mid-80s when Perez left and Wolfman had writer's block and just recycled the same stories over and over and over again (man v. machine for Vic). And no one else has come up with anything else since, alas.

[Vampire Savior]

There was nothing at all wrong with Cyborg as a character in the early days and NTT sold like gangbusters. The problem began in the mid-80s when Perez left and Wolfman had writer's block and just recycled the same stories over and over and over again (man v. machine for Vic). And no one else has come up with anything else since, alas.

Maybe I didn't clarify, but I was talking specifically about Cyborg in and after the New 52.

[Dred]

changing Wallace's name is still the dumbest solution to a non-problem. let's be real, DC is never going to go back to change his name to anything other than Wallace because, again, it's a non-problem. the only people who have an issue with the name are Wally fans who can't get over themselves, editorial, Wallace fans, and the general comic audience do not. care that one is Wallace and one is Wally. if we change his name then they need to either leave Wally's kids gone or change BOTH of their names; you know, to avoid confusion with Jay Garrick and Iris West. oh we also need to change Bart's name too, wouldn't want people confusing Barry and Bart since they both have the name Bartholomew. obvious sarcasm is obvious, that would be just as stupid as changing Wallace's name.

Agreed. Wallace's problems have more to do with him having the exact same premise as Wally, due to him originally intended to be Wally. Having to retcon him into everyone's lives and have him experience the exact same turnaround causes more confusion than the names. No one's called Wally by Wallace besides...Starfire that I can remember.

[Tzigone]

Maybe I didn't clarify, but I was talking specifically about Cyborg in and after the New 52.

Well, that's not "right from the get-go" to me, and it doesn't really fit with abandoning the character altogether (as you were suggesting with Wallace) or with "character is just not even worth salvage". The situations don't seem to have much in common.

I'd like to see a go of Wallace, but he'd need significant modification in the reboot. Yes, his origin sucked. Replacing an old character is always difficult. Race bending would have been one thing. Deaging another. Changing background another. Put them all together and he's basically a new character with an old moniker anyway. And there can be a new kid speedster easily enough - Wally's outgrown the role, and at this point Bart should be grown (I really hate DC de-aging the older crew and not letting Tim's gen grow up while aging up Damian). New name (or middle name) for him to go by. It could work. As I said, though, would need modification.

And changing Wallace into a somewhat delinquent while also changing him to black was at best a poor decision and worst racist (see making Dick's crooked uncle a gypsy - and I believe that was the word used, though I've intentionally skipped reading most of Grayson's run).

Anyway, I'd love to work Wallace in, if a good way to make it happen could happen. But not sure how to work it (wouldn't be surprised if next iteration had Joe, and I still miss Ira - heck I still miss Wally's good parents).

Wallace's problems have more to do with him having the exact same premise as Wally, due to him originally intended to be Wally.

I'd argue his initial setup was significantly different. Wally never disliked the Flash (that I know of). And dynamics are different especially because Wally was never a sidekick. That's a post-COIE retcon I disliked. Wally was independent hero - different from Roy or Dick as a minor in that regard. He had a great family. He did not depend emotionally on Iris or Barry and certainly never lived with Iris. I know I'm in the minority, but I just like the original way better. I don't like being told that everything I read didn't happen that way. That the interpersonal character dynamics were completely different than the ones I actually saw. Feel similarly about retconned romantic relationships, retconned hostility between Clark and Bruce, retconned Alfred as Bruce's parental figure...you may have realized by now that comics can frustrate me. But I love admirable heroes overcoming villains and good triumphing over evil, so I like superhero comics. Though sometimes it seems they've done their best to makes heroes less admirable and lose way more often these days (heck, for a long while now). But it's not constant, so there's still some good stuff.

[Vampire Savior]

Well, that's not "right from the get-go" to me, and it doesn't really fit with abandoning the character altogether (as you were suggesting with Wallace) or with "character is just not even worth salvage". The situations don't seem to have much in common.

I admit I didn't express myself as clearly as I could have.

What I meant is that I would have abandoned the initiative to push Cyborg as a major leading character in the DCU and as a Justice League founder. I wouldn't abandon Cyborg altogether. I'd probably just put him back with some version of the Titans. The correlation is that I would not continue with an initiative or character that isn't working out, and didn't work out from the get-go. At least not in these instances.

[Lee]

I like this choice of Rudy West for him.

My other pick is Daniel "Danny" West Jr.

The solution to having two characters called Wallace West isn't to have two characters called Rudy West, or to have two characters called Daniel West. That is the exact same problem.

The current solution - Wally and Wallace - is fine. The longer DC sticks to this solution, the more ingrained it will become. Consistency is key.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

Honestly having Wallace be from alternate earth feels like a messy solution to a simple problem. Wallace's problem is a bad first impression and debuting during the new 52 so there is a lot of baggage. I don't think Rebirth gives him less baggage but the only thing that heals is time and good storytelling.

Granted whether or not people are gonna give him another chance is something you can't worry about.

[HunterX]

The solution to having two characters called Wallace West isn't to have two characters called Rudy West, or to have two characters called Daniel West. That is the exact same problem.

Well there is a difference, OG Wally West as been mentioned numerous times in this thread, is a very popular and prominent character so much he will overshadow anyone with the same name. Thats not the case if he was to be called Rudy or Danny. And the senior West members with the same name can use the full name Ruldoph and Daniel, while new Wally uses the shorted version. Problem solved. And besides they are too many similarities with new Wally and OG Wally, which isnt the case with anyone else. So thats the differences.

changing Wallace's name is still the dumbest solution to a non-problem. let's be real, DC is never going to go back to change his name to anything other than Wallace because, again, it's a non-problem. the only people who have an issue with the name are Wally fans who can't get over themselves, editorial, Wallace fans, and the general comic audience do not.

Untrue, at least in my case, I do care and like new Wally/Wallace, that is why I want him out of OG Wally's shadow. How I feel about this is all about Wallace/new Wally and first and foremost. Fine, DC may not feel the need to change his name, but its not like they cant or that it would even be a big deal. Stranger rewrites/changes have happened in comics than this.

[Lee]

Well there is a difference, OG Wally West as been mentioned numerous times in this thread, is a very popular character so much he will overshadow anyone with the same name. Thats not the case if he was to be called Rudy or Danny. And the senior West members with the same name can use the full name Ruldoph and Daniel, while new Wally uses the shorted version. Problem solved.

There are millions of names in the world. What is the advantage of reusing Rudy or Danny, rather than something entirely new?

[HunterX]

There are millions of names in the world. What is the advantage of reusing Rudy or Danny, rather than something entirely new?

I just like the names, I feel like they suit him, also being family names.

But if you or anyone got your own choices, lets hear them. I will take any new name at this point.

[LP22]

I think Wallace is a fine character and got and gets developed really well so much that at this point I don't see and necessity to have Bart back same as Kon and Jon.

[HunterX]

Anyway Wallace doesnt have a thread anymore, so this will have to do. ^above one of my favourites arts of him.

[Dred]

I think Wallace is a fine character and got and gets developed really well so much that at this point I don't see and necessity to have Bart back same as Kon and Jon.

This is part of why a lot of people dislike him. Not the arguable development, but him rekindling his role as combination Wally and Bart usurper. And for an even smaller crew, Iris and Jai as well. Who never got a chance despite never being even 1/10th as terrible as Wallace was.

[Frostbite883]

This isn't quite true as there are more than a few Wallace fans who think it's an issue for the character. The difference is their solution is DC should just get rid of Wally rather than changing names.

Yeeaah. I can tell you missed the part where he brought up the Wallace fans too....either that or you're just trying to 'correct' someone or whatever because the dude mentioned Wally fans and you assumed that he meant all Wally fans (just because he didn't become a turistic that time to be a little more clear on what he meant as it should be obvious to anyone to who exactly the type of Wal fans lemonpeace had mentioned).

[Rend20]

Yeeaah. I can tell you missed the part where he brought up the Wallace fans too...

I didn't?

editorial, Wallace fans, and the general comic audience do not. care that one is Wallace and one is Wally.

I was simply mentioning that there are fans who prefer Wallace that do care and think it's a problem for the character.

And given the current discussion is whether or not Wallace should change his name, which I said he shouldn't, acknowledging there are at least some on both sides who think it's a problem is relevant. That not everyone who is in the 'Wallace should change his name" is in the Wally camp even if a lot of them are.