Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 39
  1. #1
    Spectacular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    217

    Default Iron Man pre 2008

    I was reading an article about the MCU and how Iron Man was a really big gamble for Marvel Studios at the time because he wasn't a really well known character. I say how? The character had been around for almost 50 years by that point comics publishing wise, had numerous storylines, Armor Wars, Armor Wars II, Demon in a Bottle, anyone? James Rhodes had by that point been War Machine since the 80s. What am I missing? So, he was supposed to be more of a cult favorite? It wasn't that much of a stretch. Tony was a founding member of the Avengers after all.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    3,068

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CTTT View Post
    What am I missing? So, he was supposed to be more of a cult favorite? It wasn't that much of a stretch. Tony was a founding member of the Avengers after all.
    Iron Man was a character who never had a great deal of prestige. He was the lesser star of the Avengers. His rogues gallery was pretty terrible and his supporting cast generally weak. Likewise, the Avengers were also not a very prestigious title and group. The Avengers for most of its history was a dumping ground for rejects and notorious for its very high turnover rate and rapid defections. Iron Man was never a top-selling title either even during Michelinie's famous run.

    So all said and done, Iron Man was a big gamble....

  3. #3
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Iron Man was a character who never had a great deal of prestige. He was the lesser star of the Avengers. His rogues gallery was pretty terrible and his supporting cast generally weak. Likewise, the Avengers were also not a very prestigious title and group. The Avengers for most of its history was a dumping ground for rejects and notorious for its very high turnover rate and rapid defections. Iron Man was never a top-selling title either even during Michelinie's famous run.

    So all said and done, Iron Man was a big gamble....
    Anyone can have any opinion they want, though that said, that seems quite a bit of harsh flack considering two titles that managed to last as long as they did into the hundreds, as well as receive cartoons and all that. I know that's not the same as theatrical movies, though by that measure, I suppose it can warrant a little more respect considering the many comic series that never had the same track records even before 2008.

  4. #4
    Tyrant Sun User leokearon's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Waterford, Ireland
    Posts
    2,261

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CTTT View Post
    I was reading an article about the MCU and how Iron Man was a really big gamble for Marvel Studios at the time because he wasn't a really well known character. I say how? The character had been around for almost 50 years by that point comics publishing wise, had numerous storylines, Armor Wars, Armor Wars II, Demon in a Bottle, anyone? James Rhodes had by that point been War Machine since the 80s. What am I missing? So, he was supposed to be more of a cult favorite? It wasn't that much of a stretch. Tony was a founding member of the Avengers after all.
    It was a big of a gamble, comic fans knew of Tony (and at the time, opinion on him was divisive due to Civil War), but to the general public he wasn't well known, he had only two cartoons and that was it. Before the movie Iron man was a B-List hero
    Check out my Deviantart Page: http://leokearon.deviantart.com/

    Vote for your favourite Marvel Supporting Characters: http://community.comicbookresources....ing-characters

  5. #5
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by leokearon View Post
    It was a big of a gamble, comic fans knew of Tony (and at the time, opinion on him was divisive due to Civil War), but to the general public he wasn't well known, he had only two cartoons and that was it. Before the movie Iron man was a B-List hero
    Well I think if you ask people like Martin Scorsese, those would probably talk of Iron Man like he's below B-list in 2019. lol

  6. #6
    iMan 42s
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    3,107

    Default

    Iron man was a big gamble for several reasons, not just due to the character itself.

    Iron man within the comics was fairly well known, let's not pretend otherwise as the character enjoyed a lot of popularity which only teetered off in the 90's due to the excess of the era. He was in a few cartoons, made some guest appearances in others, he had a few games, and toys. It was as marketed as any other property. It did not by any means begin with the MCU but it certainly took advantage of its success. However when it came to the character itself and the aforementioned excess of the X-men and Spider properties of the time, the Ultimate reboot being a dud, and the incompetency of most of what went into the then Civil War, it's hard to generate hype. You can't really bank on comic fans to support a film but when your built in audience is being told that your newest project is being led by a character you've spent the last decade + telling us is a piece of crap, you've made your own problem. Iron man was and is still not a hard sell to the General Audience, but he would've been for the comic readers of the time.

    Robert Downey Jr was also a known drug abuser who a lot of people hadn't known that much about. He'd done work but he wasn't that well known. That's not all that big a problem but a potential relapse is a huge risk.

    The FX for Iron man had also been in its infancy where they honestly felt the need to build full suits and that is going to be costly on top of CGI (that's also something they never did again). Superhero CGI wasn't particularly good of the time and Iron man is FX heavy. It turning out as well as it did was a miracle.

    You also have to realize that the money going into this was going to make or break them. If they failed that's it. No Marvel Studios or at least as we know it today. Iron man isn't nearly as safe as Spider-man (at least at the time).
    -----------------------------------
    For anyone that needs to know why OMD is awful please search the internet for Linkara' s video's specifically his One more day review or his One more day Analysis.

  7. #7
    Incredible Member your_name_here's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    793

    Default

    Bendis/Ellis and Fraction raised Iron-Mans profile before the film.
    Civil War made him and Cap the “leaders of the MU” everyone sees them as today (I use the loosely, I mean from MCU standpoint)
    So before 2008, there was a lot of Iron Man there. Was still a gamble though, seeing as many disliked Iron Man after civil war

  8. #8
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    3,068

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    Well I think if you ask people like Martin Scorsese, those would probably talk of Iron Man like he's below B-list in 2019. lol
    The movies haven't exactly brought in a truckload of new readers to Iron Man comics. The fact that comics' Iron Man remains unrecognizable from the character in the movies likewise makes it hard to get people involved since at the end of the day you can't put Robert Downey Jr into panels.

    So one can argue that Iron Man comics is B-List. Not below b-List, but now in the actual B-List.

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperiorIronman View Post
    Iron man within the comics was fairly well known, let's not pretend otherwise as the character enjoyed a lot of popularity which only teetered off in the 90's due to the excess of the era.
    I think you need to amend that to Iron Man within Marvel comics was fairly well known. As far as comics overall goes, Iron Man back then wasn't as big as Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Teen Titans and so on. IF we compare him to Image, Iron Man wasn't even as big as Spawn. And he wasn't as big as Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles who were all the rage at the time. Among Marvel characters, Iron Man wasn't as big as the Hulk. Leave alone Spider-Man and the X-Men. Iron Man appeared in cartoons in the 90s sure...but the Fox Spider-Man and X-Men cartoons had more eyeballs to it. And even then it pales in comparison to the DCAU stuff with Bruce Timm's cartoons of that decade. Iron Man got a lot of exposure because Marvel invested in him by giving him countless second chances to crossover. They tried to give him heat and exposure but the public never warmed up to him until RDJ.

    There's a message there about why Iron Man got so many chances while female characters get less than three strikes (being out at strike 1). It just goes to show that there are some ideas (i.e. male power fantasy which Tony embodies more than any Marvel character) the business will always believe and throw money at no matter how people vote with the wallet.

  9. #9
    Lazy Struggler BitParallel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Cloud 9
    Posts
    677

    Default

    I’ve always thought Iron Man was an A-list character even before the movies. Most of ironman enjoyable good comics were pre-08. He had so many great storylines, he was the founder of Avenger and Civil War established that Iron man and Cap were leading the heroes in Marvel.

    Even though Iron Man popularity increased with mainstream audience after the movies, I think ironman comics are not doing well. This past decade did not treat Iron Man comics well, You’d think Marvel will be put more effort and focus but naah.

  10. #10
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    All Along The Watchtower
    Posts
    9,734

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CTTT View Post
    I was reading an article about the MCU and how Iron Man was a really big gamble for Marvel Studios at the time because he wasn't a really well known character. I say how? The character had been around for almost 50 years by that point comics publishing wise, had numerous storylines, Armor Wars, Armor Wars II, Demon in a Bottle, anyone? James Rhodes had by that point been War Machine since the 80s. What am I missing? So, he was supposed to be more of a cult favorite? It wasn't that much of a stretch. Tony was a founding member of the Avengers after all.
    It was more that Tony wasn't well know outside of comic circles. He wasn't a property like Spidey or even the Hulk(who had a TV show).

    So yeah, despite his status as a founding Avenger and a long history, they took a chance.

  11. #11
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    The movies haven't exactly brought in a truckload of new readers to Iron Man comics. The fact that comics' Iron Man remains unrecognizable from the character in the movies likewise makes it hard to get people involved since at the end of the day you can't put Robert Downey Jr into panels.

    So one can argue that Iron Man comics is B-List. Not below b-List, but now in the actual B-List.
    Yeah, I think that has more to do with a general failure of Marvel successfully encouraging more people to buy more of their comics. I think it’s fair enough to say that the success of comic industry is quite different from the 1940s years of Superman, in which I recall Captain Marvel outsold him at one point too.

  12. #12
    Lazy Struggler BitParallel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Cloud 9
    Posts
    677

    Default

    Marvel is trash for thinking Iron Man was a gamble.

    I always knew he was the dopest superhero.

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    3,068

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    Yeah, I think that has more to do with a general failure of Marvel successfully encouraging more people to buy more of their comics.
    Well Spider-Man and X-Men still do well, as does Batman, as does Immortal Hulk.

    I think it’s fair enough to say that the success of comic industry is quite different from the 1940s years of Superman, in which I recall Captain Marvel outsold him at one point too.
    Not sure what that has to do with the discussion here. Captain Marvel in the Binder-Beck era were genuinely great comics for their time and sold well on word-of-mouth and popularity as well as its innovations such as a multi-part serial story (Monster Society of Evil), new concepts and ideas (the Marvel superfamily) and iconic villains like Mister Mind and so on. This wasn't the case with Superman at the time. Fawcett Cap Marv wasn't a fluke success but an earned one. It was qualitatively a better comic than Superman, and deserved its success.

    Fawcett Captain Marvel had a great concept/hook, great rogues gallery, decent supporting cast and included innovative storytelling. When has that ever been true of Iron Man comics? Sure, Tony Stark being an alcoholic during Demon in the Bottle was bold for its time...but that was in the tail end of the 70s, a decade where Speedy was a drug addict in that famous Green Arrow/Green Lantern series, as well as the Drug Trilogy in the pages of ASM. Iron Man being a protagonist of a superhero comic and an active boozehound was definitely new and radical yes but in terms of content not so much. In terms of comics with innovative storytelling, Iron Man was behind stuff like Spider-man (with Night Gwen Stacy Died, and before that the Drug Trilogy), stuff like Captain America (Englehart's run where Nixon was the bad guy, also Kirby's Madbomb) and all the crazy stuff that was happening in X-Men and what Frank Miller was getting up to in Daredevil. Likewise it cannot be denied that Iron Man has a terrible rogues gallery.

  14. #14
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    6,180

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by your_name_here View Post
    Bendis/Ellis and Fraction raised Iron-Mans profile before the film.
    Civil War made him and Cap the “leaders of the MU” everyone sees them as today (I use the loosely, I mean from MCU standpoint)
    So before 2008, there was a lot of Iron Man there. Was still a gamble though, seeing as many disliked Iron Man after civil war
    Um...Bendis didn't write Iron Man till 2016, and Fraction in 2011/2012.

  15. #15
    Mighty Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Not sure what that has to do with the discussion here..
    I was going off on how you said, "The movies haven't exactly brought in a truckload of new readers to Iron Man comics."

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •