All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[Tami]

Doubts over Trump's dramatic account of Baghdadi raid

Footage of the US special forces raid on Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi’s Syrian compound reportedly consisted of overhead surveillance footage and no audio, prompting questions over the extent of the dramatic licence taken by Donald Trump in describing the final moments of one of the most wanted terrorists in the world.

US officials who also watched the feed have declined to echo details of Trump’s macabre account of the Isis’s leader death on Saturday, including that Baghdadi was “whimpering, crying and screaming all the way”.

Cornered, Baghdadi detonated his suicide vest, killing himself, his children and injuring the “beautiful” and “talented” dog, Trump said.

The White House monitored the Syria operation through video feeds that Trump said was “as though you were watching a movie”.

The footage piped into the situation room would have consisted of overhead surveillance shots of the dark compound with heat signatures differentiating between US fighters and others, intelligence and military officials told the New York Times.

Those cameras would not have been able to peer into the tunnel where Baghdadi died, nor provide audio proof of his conduct during the last minutes of his life.

[KOSLOX]

In Iowa, Tulsi Gabbard’s supporters don’t just see a sign — they see many, plastered across the state



In my part of the country, I have heard from Campaign Pros that Yard signs don't work and are often a waste of money. Billboards? Who knows.

There are surprisingly A LOT of her signs all over the town I live in (Davenport, IA). On my way to work there is about a one mile stretch down one of the major roadways (Harrison St/Highway 61) that seems like every other house has a huge "Tulsi" sign. I'm interested to see how that plays out come Caucus. I want to see if it's real support or just a clever amplification campaign.

I'm actually hard pressed to think of any signs I've seen for other candidates aside from Sanders, but that might be just due to the fact that Gabbards are so much bigger than any others.

[Coin Biter]

And like it or not, the Soviets needed a strong leader like Stalin to win the war, if the tsars had continued ruling they would have easily been steamrolled by the Nazis which would have led to hundreds of millions of deaths.

There are a whole host of factors that lay behind the poor Soviet performance during the early part of the War. One factor was the purge of the Red Army officer class that took place during the Great Purge; which was followed up by another purge that largely took place, astonishingly, during the German attack. Stalin was also initially reluctant to believe reports of Germany’s hostile intentions, which I suppose was understandable given the secret protocol to the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact in which they divided up spheres of influence between them, and which led, among others, to the Soviet invasion of Poland and the massacre at Katyn Wood.

He was, I guess, at least ultimately a more effective supreme military commander than Hitler, which is not setting the bar particularly high.

So far as murder being used just to gain and retain power, I have some doubts about the idea of Stalin being a wholly rational actor. Think about the brutality and murder of Collectivisation, which led to famine and massively reduced agricultural production. Think of the anti Semitic fantasies of the “Doctor’s Plot”, which was halted only by Stalin’s death. I don’t think we can wholly deny the irrationalism present in Stalin’s thinking and that of the regime. Such irrationalism led, among other things, to Lysenkoism, which greatly damaged Soviet science and didn’t end until years after Stalin’s death.

[jetengine]

Stalins paranoia overtook his rationalism within a few years of him taking control

[Coin Biter]

Say what you will about Trump and Pence, we probably don't have to worry about mass graves popping up on their property, as was the case with Beria.

Comparisons between Stalin and Trump are equally grotesque; Stalin was a well read and highly intelligent individual who came to power from a position of complete obscurity and who committed acts of terror as head of a one party state after a horrible Civil War, a Revolution, a brief experiment of representative government, and an ancient history of autocracy. Other dictators of the period include a decorated Austrian war veteran and a competent and devout Spanish General. Italy was headed by a talented multi-lingual intellectual who not only “wrote” books... but also read them.

Even, it appears, the ones he had written.

[babyblob]

I am a republican I am proud to be a republican. I am not proud of Trump. It bothers me that when people hear what party I belong to they assume that I am a Trump booster. Trump is a bad president who is doing the party a lot of harm that it may not be able to recover from. He is a bad person. That being said it bugs me when people compare Trump to people like Hitler or Stalin. Trump does not commit mass murder. Its true he does not like Mexicans but he is not leading them to gas chambers. He is not doing a purge of military leaders by having them killed or thrown is prison. Yes he is a bad leader and a bad person but he is no Hitler or Stalin. Not even close.

I dont like Trump. I just wish the party would stop following the we have to support him because he is a Republican and would run someone better. Sadly a lot of the party seems to have either fallen under his spell or are too scared to speak out.

Sadly our political system has broken down. It is no longer about how can we help the people who voted for us, but rather how bad can we hurt the other party. Republicans will not listen to good ideas by democrats simple because they are not part of their party. The same with democrats they will not listen to good ideas by Republicans (yes there are a few). No one wants to come together. This country is more divided then ever. Not all of that is Trumps fault. The parties were coming to a large split long before Trump. He just made it worse.

[Tami]

I am a republican I am proud to be a republican. I am not proud of Trump. It bothers me that when people hear what party I belong to they assume that I am a Trump booster. Trump is a bad president who is doing the party a lot of harm that it may not be able to recover from. He is a bad person. That being said it bugs me when people compare Trump to people like Hitler or Stalin. Trump does not commit mass murder. Its true he does not like Mexicans but he is not leading them to gas chambers. He is not doing a purge of military leaders by having them killed or thrown is prison. Yes he is a bad leader and a bad person but he is no Hitler or Stalin. Not even close.

I dont like Trump. I just wish the party would stop following the we have to support him because he is a Republican and would run someone better. Sadly a lot of the party seems to have either fallen under his spell or are too scared to speak out.

From Wikipedia:

Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987 and since that time has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to "no party affiliation" (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party.[3]

This is another thing that makes me scratch my head, the fact that Trump has been bouncing from one party to another for years. It's not like he has been a loyal Republican from the get-go.

People do switch political parties, but rarely as often as Trump has. Out of high school I registered as a Republican. Sometime while I was in college, I switched to being a Democrat and have stayed one ever since.

Trump has done it at least 5 times.

[kidfresh512]

I am a republican I am proud to be a republican. I am not proud of Trump. It bothers me that when people hear what party I belong to they assume that I am a Trump booster. Trump is a bad president who is doing the party a lot of harm that it may not be able to recover from. He is a bad person. That being said it bugs me when people compare Trump to people like Hitler or Stalin. Trump does not commit mass murder. Its true he does not like Mexicans but he is not leading them to gas chambers. He is not doing a purge of military leaders by having them killed or thrown is prison. Yes he is a bad leader and a bad person but he is no Hitler or Stalin. Not even close.

I dont like Trump. I just wish the party would stop following the we have to support him because he is a Republican and would run someone better. Sadly a lot of the party seems to have either fallen under his spell or are too scared to speak out.

Sadly our political system has broken down. It is no longer about how can we help the people who voted for us, but rather how bad can we hurt the other party. Republicans will not listen to good ideas by democrats simple because they are not part of their party. The same with democrats they will not listen to good ideas by Republicans (yes there are a few). No one wants to come together. This country is more divided then ever. Not all of that is Trumps fault. The parties were coming to a large split long before Trump. He just made it worse.

This is the part that frustrates people the most. We know that if the GOP actually stand up to him he DOES respond sometimes. Syria pullout most recently he will adapt a little from his worst instincts. But, take the Impeachment inquiry for example. He tells them to stand up for him and go make a scene and they order dominoes and run into the secure room with cell phones.

Even though they KNOW what the process is. They know they did the exact same thing and followed the exact same rules in Benghazi hearings. This type of "bowing down" we have seen through his entire presidency. They act like they work for him its insane. I don't think Mitch McConnell does anything to help either when he refuses to allow House passed bills to even be voted on unless trump tells him he will sign them, which he obviously wont.

So all of that just adds to the lumping the entire spectrum of the GOP in together. Because the only time people criticism him is if they were fired already/quit, or retiring.

[babyblob]

From Wikipedia:



This is another thing that makes me scratch my head, the fact that Trump has been bouncing from one party to another for years. It's not like he has been a loyal Republican from the get-go.

People do switch political parties, but rarely as often as Trump has. Out of high school I registered as a Republican. Sometime while I was in college, I switched to being a Democrat and have stayed one ever since.

Trump has done it at least 5 times.

That is what angers me so much about Trump. He is not loyal to the party. He is only loyal to people that agree with him and does what he says. He knew he could not gain power as a Democrat so he switched to a party that was starved for a new voice and leadership. Trump has charisma he knows how to pander to the crowd and tell people what they want to hear whether he believes in it or not.

Being a common sense moderate conservative is hard in the Trump era.

[Iron Maiden]

Trump's only loyalty is to himself. I think he would even throw his own kids under the bus if it became necessary

[zinderel]

...a common sense moderate conservative ...

I appreciate that it must be difficult to watch. The party you identify with has gone completely off the rails fawning over a would-be dictator whose every move throughout his entire history spits on everything the Republican Party claimed it stood for.

I’m genuinely curious about this though. What does this mean to you? I’ve heard the term, but due to my own personal experiences as a gay man in America, and of course, the meaningless nonsense that was ‘compassionate conservatism’ from Bush as he sought to delegitimize my relationships, strip me of what rights the LGBT+ community had fought and died for, and dehumanize us in every possible way in order to appease the same religious zealots Trump appeals to today, up to and including attempting to enshrine bigotry into the Constitution in the form of DOMA, I have a difficult time parsing the thought. But, at the same time, I HATE making assumptions about people, and since I have a chance to ask someone directly...I thought maybe I’d try listening.

[Coin Biter]

I’m not from the US but as an outsider I think the most dangerous aspect of Trump is his colossal stupidity.

Let’s take the Ukraine crisis. Trump deciding to pressure another country to open an investigation into a domestic political opponent is not surprising for a would be autocrat who has contempt for (and it seems sheer failure to comprehend) constitutional norms. Doing it in the most cretinous way imaginable, getting directly personally involved, and somehow believing the transcript exonerated him... well that would be surprising, in anyone but Trump.

However, that sheer stupidity may lead to a political party’s representatives en masse defending this conduct as somehow acceptable.

In the world’s most powerful country with over 200 years of representative democracy? That is frightening.

I used to think Trump would be more dangerous if he is smarter, but I no longer believe that to be true.

[zinderel]

Trump's only loyalty is to himself. I think he would even throw his own kids under the bus if it became necessary

Tiffany who?

[Coin Biter]

That said, God knows in the UK we have our own charlatan who believes he is not accountable to anyone in charge, and at the moment he’s way ahead in the polls.

[Malvolio]

Donald Trump only cares about one person: Donald Trump. He registered as a Democrat in the early 2000s because he finally realized that they hold most of the power in NYC and if he wanted to get any new real estate built, he would have to be friends with the Democratic Party. But once he decided to run for President, he figured that he would have an easier time if he was a Republican. And he was right about that. But make no mistake; Trump feels no loyalty to anyone but himself.