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  1. #15091
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    That's exactly the problem though, normalcy SOUNDS good, but a normal America is still a deeply racist, highly unequal society and there has never been a time when it has not been like that. Is there any reason to believe that a President Biden would have handled this virus any better than Trump has? He doesn't seem to be offering many helpful suggestions right now.
    By the basic fact that he's a professional politician and not a gibbering idiot, yes Biden would be better

  2. #15092
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    That's exactly the problem though, normalcy SOUNDS good, but a normal America is still a deeply racist, highly unequal society and there has never been a time when it has not been like that. Is there any reason to believe that a President Biden would have handled this virus any better than Trump has? He doesn't seem to be offering many helpful suggestions right now.
    What a silly statement. Since Biden would have still had the Pandemic team and handled it similar to the Ebola threat under Obama. To think almost anybody would not have handled this better than Trump is to disregard what has happened the last 4 months.

    Here you go: https://joebiden.com/covid19/

    The point about normalcy is not that America needs to change, but to run on America is a bad place in need of a radical upheaval will not win an election.
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  3. #15093
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    What a silly statement. Since Biden would have still had the Pandemic team and handled it similar to the Ebola threat under Obama. To think almost anybody would not have handled this better than Trump is to disregard what has happened the last 4 months.

    The point about normalcy is not that America needs to change, but to run on America is a bad place in need of a radical upheaval will not win an election.
    Honestly, it's not about just hating America out of spite, it's about having some serious self-examination about WHY it is that a country that has so much wealth and power continues to have so many problems that other countries with far fewer resources don't seem to have. We would of course all like to believe that we are good people and that our society is fundamentally good, but Trump opened everyone's eyes to just how toxic and dysfunctional it has been under the surface all along, and sweeping that all under the rug again isn't going to actually fix anything.

  4. #15094
    Invincible Jersey Ninja Tami's Avatar
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    I guess many see Normalcy differently.

    I see normalcy as stability and progress forward, even if that progress is, at times, slow and occasionally trips on the road.

    I don't want radical change. Those who voted Trump into office were looking for radical change and this is what we ended up with. A president who would be thrilled to bankrupt the country and spend all his time playing golf while people died.

    I want logic, reason, sanity, common sense, compassion, generosity, & intelligent and thoughtful action.
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  5. #15095
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    Honestly, it's not about just hating America out of spite, it's about having some serious self-examination about WHY it is that a country that has so much wealth and power continues to have so many problems that other countries with far fewer resources don't seem to have. We would of course all like to believe that we are good people and that our society is fundamentally good, but Trump opened everyone's eyes to just how toxic and dysfunctional it has been under the surface all along, and sweeping that all under the rug again isn't going to actually fix anything.
    If you want to change things you have to win, to win you actually have to reach out and not spit in peoples faces. You also need to go out and vote.

    The progressive wing do neither.

  6. #15096
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    Honestly, it's not about just hating America out of spite, it's about having some serious self-examination about WHY it is that a country that has so much wealth and power continues to have so many problems that other countries with far fewer resources don't seem to have. We would of course all like to believe that we are good people and that our society is fundamentally good, but Trump opened everyone's eyes to just how toxic and dysfunctional it has been under the surface all along, and sweeping that all under the rug again isn't going to actually fix anything.
    Good job normalizing Trump, bro.
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  7. #15097
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    Honestly, it's not about just hating America out of spite, it's about having some serious self-examination about WHY it is that a country that has so much wealth and power continues to have so many problems that other countries with far fewer resources don't seem to have. We would of course all like to believe that we are good people and that our society is fundamentally good, but Trump opened everyone's eyes to just how toxic and dysfunctional it has been under the surface all along, and sweeping that all under the rug again isn't going to actually fix anything.
    I don't disagree with the country needing some serious change. I supported Warren and my politics more closely align with Sanders than Biden. My point was about the real politics of this. Just like acknowledging that Biden will be the nominee, it is not realistic to run on America being a bad place. You have to sell it as building on what we have. To suggest that Biden is not really different from Trump, which I see from Sanders supporters a lot, is one) objectively a lie and two) only helping Trump.

    And today "normalcy" means Obama to a lot of people. That is why a return sounds so good. Using it as a criticism of Biden is an absurd tactic.
    Last edited by Kirby101; 04-02-2020 at 09:00 AM.
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  8. #15098
    Mighty Member TheDarman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    That's exactly the problem though, normalcy SOUNDS good, but a normal America is still a deeply racist, highly unequal society and there has never been a time when it has not been like that. Is there any reason to believe that a President Biden would have handled this virus any better than Trump has? He doesn't seem to be offering many helpful suggestions right now.
    Even a simple, “I would’ve listened to the experts back in January and February” would have been a better response. This seems to be an even more “pathetic” way to normalize and equivocate on Trump’s response than pointing out China was wrong to hide so much information about this virus from the world.
    With Great Power, Comes Great Responsibility

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  9. #15099
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    If you want to change things you have to win, to win you actually have to reach out and not spit in peoples faces. You also need to go out and vote.

    The progressive wing do neither.
    Precisely. Ideals are wonderful but, to implement them, you have to win the election. I support Sanders' ideals. I think they are 100% best for the country. But I don't think he can win. Biden has the potential to win and it's largely because he doesn't lay his most radical plans on the table from the start. Sad but true.
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  10. #15100
    Mighty Member TheDarman's Avatar
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    Don’t think this got covered, but for all the Stacey Abrams haters and “Democrats and Republicans are the same” folks out there:

    Brian Kemp admits he didn’t know asymptomatic people could transmit COVID-19 to other people.
    With Great Power, Comes Great Responsibility

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  11. #15101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    I don't disagree with the country needing some serious change. I supported Warren and my politics more closely align with Sanders than Biden. My point was about the real politics of this. Just like acknowledging that Biden will be the nominee, it is not realistic to run on America being a bad place. You have to sell it as building on what we have. To suggest that Biden is not really different from Trump, which I see from Sanders supporters a lot, is one) objectively a lie and two) only helping Trump.
    To me, America is kind of like Windows - a buggy, bloated mess of a system that came to be that way because of the constant need to accommodate existing users, and which beneath a shiny veneer that gets refreshed every years is built on extremely antiquated code that cannot simply be replaced without upsetting millions of people who were satisfied with how they thought things were working before. And in both cases there are plenty of alternatives out there that manage to do a lot better with far more limited resources, just imagine what could be accomplished if more resources were funneled into developing those rather than being wasted keeping the obese zombie trudging along.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarman View Post
    Even a simple, “I would’ve listened to the experts back in January and February” would have been a better response. This seems to be an even more “pathetic” way to normalize and equivocate on Trump’s response than pointing out China was wrong to hide so much information about this virus from the world.
    How can both parts of your statements be true at the same time? If China had been hiding all this critical information about the virus in January and February, then a hypothetical Biden administration would not be aware that there was a crisis that we needed to prepare for, and the experts would not have had any evidence on which to base their advice.
    Last edited by PwrdOn; 04-02-2020 at 09:17 AM.

  12. #15102
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    Republicans will suggest more tax cuts as a solution.

  13. #15103
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    To me, America is kind of like Windows - a buggy, bloated mess of a system that came to be that way because of the constant need to accommodate existing users, and which beneath a shiny veneer that gets refreshed every years is built on extremely antiquated code that cannot simply be replaced without upsetting millions of people who were satisfied with how they thought things were working before. And in both cases there are plenty of alternatives out there that manage to do a lot better with far more limited resources, just imagine what could be accomplished if more resources were funneled into developing those rather than being wasted keeping the obese zombie trudging along.
    I don't disagree, again. There is much wrong with this country. I am not even patriotic. I don't think it is the best country on Earth. I would truthfully be happy living in another country. But it is where i live and the logistics of living elsewhere would be very difficult.
    And it certainly doesn't treat it's average citizens better than others. It needs a lot of progress to catch up with other countries. It has had 50 years of a corrupt, at times criminal and other times evil Republican Party stymieing real change and handing over much of the country to an oligarchy. But the question is, how do we get there? How do we get Americans to vote for that direction? It is a question of politics, and Bernie's way is not a winning one.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  14. #15104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    I don't disagree, again. There is much wrong with this country. I am not even patriotic. I don't think it is the best country on Earth. I would truthfully be happy living in another country. But it is where i live and the logistics of living elsewhere would be very difficult.
    And it certainly doesn't treat it's average citizens better than others. It needs a lot of progress to catch up with other countries. It has had 50 years of a corrupt, at times criminal and other times evil Republican Party stymieing real change and handing over much of the country to an oligarchy. But the question is, how do we get there? How do we get Americans to vote for that direction? It is a question of politics, and Bernie's way is not a winning one.
    Frankly, the virus may be the wake up call that the country needed. It's pretty obvious that a lot of the problems that we've had are not directly related to the disease itself but as a result of our system prioritizing profits over people, and as Biden has said repeatedly, if he were in charge nothing would fundamentally change. If this is not the time to call for stronger safety nets, better worker protections, and universal health care, then I don't know when would be the right time. Moderates are like a football team that keeps trying to run it in at the 1 yard line, when the entire stadium is collapsing around them DKR style.

  15. #15105
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Engineer Arrested For Derailing Train Near USNS Mercy, Claimed Ship Part Of ‘Government Takeover’

    A train engineer at the Port of Los Angeles was arrested Wednesday for allegedly derailing a locomotive at full speed near the USNS Mercy hospital ship being used to ease hospital beds during the coronavirus pandemic.

    Eduardo Moreno, 44, of San Pedro, was charged in a criminal complaint with one federal count of train wrecking, which carries a potential sentence of up to 20 years in federal prison, according to the U.S. Attorney’s Office.

    The complaint filed in Los Angeles federal court states Moreno admitted to authorities in two separate interviews that he intentionally derailed and crashed the PHL train near the Mercy on Tuesday afternoon.
    According to court documents, Moreno allegedly told the CHP officer, “You only get this chance once. The whole world is watching. I had to. People don’t know what’s going on here. Now they will.”


    During an initial interview with port police, prosecutors say Moreno admitted crashing the train, saying he was suspicious of the Mercy and believed it had an alternate purpose related to COVID-19, such as a “government takeover.”

    Moreno later stated in a second interview with FBI agents that “he did it out of the desire to ‘wake people up,”’ according to the affidavit. “Moreno stated that he thought that the U.S.N.S. Mercy was suspicious and did not believe ‘the ship is what they say it’s for'”.
    Sounds like the sort of crazy **** some deranged right winger who watches Faux News 24/7 might say. Talk about disturbing.
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