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  1. #9946
    The Superior One Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Falcon View Post
    Nothing is inherently wrong, because morality is a social construct....
    I'm glad I don't share such a bleak view of the world. If nothing is wrong pedophilia is okay, rape is okay, genocide is okay, slavery is okay, exploitation of every type is okay, racism is okay, heck every action is okay if you have the ability and desire to do it.
    Last edited by Celgress; 02-26-2020 at 02:13 PM.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  2. #9947
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    I'm glad I don't share such a bleak view of the world. If nothing is wrong pedophilia is okay, rape is okay, genocide is okay, slavery is okay, exploitation of every type is okay, racism is okay, heck every action is okay if you have the ability and desire to do it.
    My god, NFL Superpro would be ok. Mullet Superman. Rob Liefeld's 4 inch Shaft!
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

  3. #9948
    Astonishing Member Lord Falcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    I'm glad I don't share such a bleak view of the world. If nothing is wrong pedophilia is okay, rape is okay, genocide is okay, slavery is okay, exploitation of every type is okay, racism is okay, heck every action is okay if you have the ability and desire to do it.
    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Pretty sure needless murder has always been inherently wrong. Like I cant think of an era where just stabbing someone for the fun of it was seen as ok
    They're not okay. They're not okay because we have made them not okay. And I'm happy we did for reasons that should be obvious to all. There's just nothing inherent about it.

    Rights exist because we create and enforce them. They don't exist as magical words in the sky that have been there since time immemorial.

  4. #9949
    The Superior One Celgress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Falcon View Post
    They're not okay. They're not okay because we have made them not okay. And I'm happy we did for reasons that should be obvious to all. There's just nothing inherent about it.

    Rights exist because we create and enforce them. They don't exist as magical words in the sky that have been there since time immemorial.
    I disagree with you. Every human has rights they are born with by virtue of being human, because of natural law. If we believe otherwise core human rights can be taken away any time a law is passed, such a situation is a very dangerous situation to live under. I'm very glad the vast majority of scholars and lawmakers disagree with you as do I.

    Natural Law (the cornerstone of Western Law) -

    "Natural law is the philosophy that certain rights, moral values, and responsibilities are inherent in human nature, and that those rights can be understood through simple reasoning. ... The law of nature is universal, meaning that it applies to everyone in the same way."
    Last edited by Celgress; 02-26-2020 at 02:44 PM.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  5. #9950
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Falcon View Post
    They're not okay. They're not okay because we have made them not okay. And I'm happy we did for reasons that should be obvious to all. There's just nothing inherent about it.

    Rights exist because we create and enforce them. They don't exist as magical words in the sky that have been there since time immemorial.
    I can't argue that. It would be nice if morality were magically enforced by beings above us. But as long as it's provided by humans it can be taken away by them. The rise of the right wing across the world in formally liberal places is proof to that.

  6. #9951
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Why wouldn't they have a political advisor with a track record of success on as one of multiple commentators?
    Success... bahahahahaha, Carville still thinks we should run like we did in the era of Tip Oneal, who like two people remember.


  7. #9952
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Batson View Post
    Now they're passing a 4 year old thing as news
    You gotta remember Billy, Centrists, and Republicans think Open Democracy is a bad thing. Your PARTY is more important than your policies. It's one of the reasons they DESPISE Progressives.

  8. #9953
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    I've never seen someone be so oblivious to how uninformed they sound about a topic they insist on continually bringing up.
    Paul only cares to troll. I don't think they truly understand how Politics works.

  9. #9954
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Falcon View Post
    They're not okay. They're not okay because we have made them not okay. And I'm happy we did for reasons that should be obvious to all. There's just nothing inherent about it.

    Rights exist because we create and enforce them. They don't exist as magical words in the sky that have been there since time immemorial.
    But this would suggest that we could choose to make the most terrible things okay at some point in the future.

    A different perspective to the idea that there is no morality is that there is right and wrong, but it takes us a long time as a species to figure it all out.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  10. #9955
    Astonishing Member Lord Falcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    I disagree with you. Every human has rights they are born with by virtue of being human, because of natural law. If we believe otherwise core human rights can be taken away any time a law is passed, such a situation is a very dangerous situation to live under. I'm very glad the vast majority of scholars and lawmakers disagree with you as do I.

    Natural Law (the cornerstone of Western Law) -

    "Natural law is the philosophy that certain rights, moral values, and responsibilities are inherent in human nature, and that those rights can be understood through simple reasoning. ... The law of nature is universal, meaning that it applies to everyone in the same way."
    I would argue that the concept of natural rights, which replaced rule by divine rights, is more dangerous because who on Earth gets to decide what is natural? We've already seen how the notion of what's natural and what's not has been used as justification to keep in place policies that were racist, sexist and anti-LGBT.

    The idea that rights are man made and need to be fought for, maintained and at times expanded will keep people far safer than a fairytale we tell ourselves of their unchanging nature.

    Quote Originally Posted by Farealmer View Post
    I can't argue that. It would be nice if morality were magically enforced by beings above us. But as long as it's provided by humans it can be taken away by them. The rise of the right wing across the world in formally liberal places is proof to that.
    The rise of right wing groups pushing notions of nativism, racism and the dehumanization of people who aren't like them shows just how important fighting for a better world is, and how it can slip away if we're not careful. If they win, two hundred years from now society might look back at us and think how naive and backwards we were for thinking ethnicities and races were equal and should be allowed to mix.

    All rights can change. To me, this perception of rights a source of great danger, and of great hope. Because civilization can also become better in the notions it holds of basic human rights than it does now.

  11. #9956
    Astonishing Member Lord Falcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    But this would suggest that we could choose to make anything terrible okay at some point in the future.

    A different perspective to the idea that there is no morality is that there is right and wrong, but it takes us a long time as a species to figure it all out.
    We could well choose that. We as a species in our various civilizations have chosen to make terrible things (as we today would perceive terrible) okay many a time before. Or we may work out that something we've traditionally thought of as just fine or justified is actually really harmful, as again we have figured out many times before.
    Last edited by Lord Falcon; 02-26-2020 at 03:08 PM.

  12. #9957
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazirai View Post
    Paul only cares to troll. I don't think they truly understand how Politics works.
    I do fine with politics, I don't truly understand how your face works, though.

    I kid! I kid! I know that's not your face.
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

  13. #9958
    Invincible Jersey Ninja Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Falcon View Post
    We could well choose that. We as a species in our various civilizations have chosen to make terrible things (as we today would perceive terrible) okay many a time before. Or we may work out that something we've traditionally thought of as just fine or justified is actually really harmful, as again we have figured out many times before.
    Humans are, by nature, social animals. Morality is an survival response to that Social Nature. Without it, society would break down as would survival. Societies that abandon all expressions of morality, that no longer manifest compassion, empathy, or even self sacrifice tend to eat themselves up from within. Eventually losing population due to violence, mistreatment, low reproduction rates, widespread illness and starvation, suicides, and abandonment.

    Populations that grow and thrive are those that foster balanced morality. The kind that attempts to provide the same considerations to as many individuals as possible. Doing so decreases stress, aggression, hostility, and ignorance.

    Laws and religion are means by which morality can be systematized, if done correctly and not abused or overused.

    Scientist Finds the Beginnings of Morality in Primate Behavior
    Last edited by Tami; 02-26-2020 at 03:32 PM.
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  14. #9959
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Humans are, by nature, social animals. Morality is an survival response to that Social Nature. Without it, society would break down as would survival. Societies that abandon all expressions of morality, that no longer manifest compassion, empathy, or even self sacrifice tend to eat themselves up from within. Eventually losing population due to violence, mistreatment, low reproduction rates, widespread illness and starvation, suicides, and abandonment.
    That only holds true when one part of the population doesn't have another part to inflict those evils on. Humans are very good at finding and maintaining populations to look down on. In fact so good it's been done by basically every large scale nation that I can think of throughout history.

  15. #9960
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    YES YES YES! Smash those myths.
    Turn Bernie Bros into Bernie BRUH!

    We blacks are not a monolith, and Sanders wins the majority of our support. Love it.


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