All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[Malvolio]

Here's an idea for Bernie Sanders that he didn't seem too keen on in 2016. (BTW, it also applies to whoever the nominee turns out to be, if it isn't Bernie) When you campaign in Wisconsin, and Ohio, and Michigan, support Democratic candidates down-ballot, even if they're moderate, or even if they're *gasp* "blue-dogs."

People on these message boards often talk about how the US two party system is flawed and we should have a multi-party system like they have in many European nations. Well, you know how those multi-party systems get things done? They form coalitions. They work together, often with people they disagree with. But how are we going to form coalitions here when we can't even work with people in our own party?

So yes, I know Bernie has supported AOC and a few others, but if he wants to get anything done, he's going to have to work with people he might find a little distasteful. I know that for some of us, compromise is a dirty word. But compromise is how you get things done. Those who demand all or nothing, usually get nothing.

[Malvolio]

I am interested, I even agreed with you when you were right like with Joy Reid, Chuck and Matthews. I listen to what they have to say when they have something objective, not being propaganda for Sanders.

Ideologues are bad, being a leftist is fine.



You didn't post those clips in context you posted them in segments from propaganda networks. Which I agree was bad for those networks to do, I just don't think that's enough to write off MSNBC. Show me clips from the Hill, TYT and other leftist channels you think are making propaganda to criticise.



I respond to your, and others, evidence repeatedly. I didn't ignore your last post I just thought too much time had moved on to respond properly. I did note that one of your critiques of progressive vs liberal was strictly about economics, when that's not solely what being progressive is about. It includes social issues.



You say that like leftist media isn't hasn't got its own problems with bias against liberals or Democrats.



Sure it is, Sanders is showing all the signs of being ok taking Bloomberg's money in the general he just won't say it. Avoiding uncomfortable questions isn't a confirmation that he'll say no to that question, which was asked directly and more than once.

I think what Sanders might say to Bloomberg is: "I can't take your money, but if you want to run your own commercials telling the public why you endorse my candidacy, I can't stop you. And if you want to run commercials simply describing what a horrible President Donald Trump is, I certainly can't stop you from doing that."

[Theleviathan]

Here's an idea for Bernie Sanders that he didn't seem too keen on in 2016. (BTW, it also applies to whoever the nominee turns out to be, if it isn't Bernie) When you campaign in Wisconsin, and Ohio, and Michigan, support Democratic candidates down-ballot, even if they're moderate, or even if they're *gasp* "blue-dogs."

People on these message boards often talk about how the US two party system is flawed and we should have a multi-party system like they have in many European nations. Well, you know how those multi-party systems get things done? They form coalitions. They work together, often with people they disagree with. But how are we going to form coalitions here when we can't even work with people in our own party?

So yes, I know Bernie has supported AOC and a few others, but if he wants to get anything done, he's going to have to work with people he might find a little distasteful. I know that for some of us, compromise is a dirty word. But compromise is how you get things done. Those who demand all or nothing, usually get nothing.

Agreed, too often the left puts all their eggs in the President basket and forgets how important it is to have allies in Congress. Or the critical role state and local governance plays. Whoever the nominee is, needs to make sure we're electing as many Democrats across all levels of government as well. U.S. Senate and House are great, but governors and state legislators too.

In 2018 even "progressives" got on board with the messaging centrists used to force their way into power across the country. We can all talk the same language, even if we have different ideas about it. A unified message on a ballot has power, much like 2018 showed. (Like: We're not the fucks trying to screw up your healthcare. Or take your social security. Or feed the rich with tax cuts.)

[numberthirty]

Man, Mayor Pete knows how to get booed.

If this dude could turn that into votes, he'd be onto something.

[kidfresh512]

Bernie is way madder here than he should be given his front runner status

[numberthirty]

Bernie is way madder here than he should be given his front runner status

Look at how he has to school Chuck Todd.

If you ain't getting mad at that, you ain't thinking.

[InformationGeek]

Lots of fighting tonight but damn, Warren is going for the throats. I think she got the best burn on Bloomberg off of the group. Though I'm glad they all open by cutting him down.

[numberthirty]

If Warren is going out(hopefully not...), she is going out in a blaze of glory.

[numberthirty]

Ok...

Credit where it's due, did Joe Biden drink a V-8 today or something?

This is the sharpest the guy has looked in months. Don't agree with him, but at least he is there and "Game Face".

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Warren coming with fire!!!

[Steel Inquisitor]

Every person in the top 5 is over 70 and they will be challenging someone over 70.

Sanders stayed late against Hillary Clinton, Hillary Clinton threatened to use super delegates to take the nom from Obama and they had to use emergency meetings. So forgive me if I don't feel any sympathy for that. Especially when it's a demonstrably proven fact that she did more damage to Obama's campaign than Sanders did to her. That's just a well established fact.

Obama and Hillary had a tighter race, Hillary's campaign hasn't over by Super Tuesday. She certainly didn't go to the convention or hold her endorsement hostage while Trump was in the wings consolidating his hold over the GOP. It's debatable about that, the tensions between Obama and Hillary ceased years ago while Sanders wing and Hillary and the the party establishment is going strong. It didn't get so bad a Democratic president had to put their two cents in, unlike in '16.

Let's look at some of the people you listed. Sanders had Cenk retract his endorsement, Tulsi Gabbard is running against him and has critcized him in the past. Cardi B is musician who does whatever she wants. So your own examples don't hold up and like I said you used Rogan for weeks and he does not have the same political leanings as Sanders.... so again this is nothing argument. And honestly if you don't understand how that makes you hypocritical and want to resort to calling people a Nazi (which is offensive when it's a Jew who you are talking about and offensive to people who actually had their families impacted by Nazi's, words mean things) then you either don't want to be smart enough to understand it or you don't see it.

Sanders had to be talked out of the Cenk endorsement, he didn't do it by himself and he did it anyway despite Cenk's past not being vetted by his campaign.

AOC has no skin in the game on that fight. Again why would any candidate who compromise before it's even brought to the table? It's foolish. He didn't even win yet. Obama compromised with a super majority and now his bill is falling apart and his party lost congress as a result. That's what starting from compromise gets you. [/quote]

Cardi B has been heavily pushing Sanders, they did interviews together. He likes her so much so he wants her to run for political office.

https://thehill.com/blogs/in-the-kno...would-be-great

Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) backed the notion of rapper Cardi B entering politics, telling TMZ “it would be great” if the star, a high-profile supporter, made good on her stated ambition.

Rogan has been platforming the Alt-Right AKA Nazis for a long while. It's my fault Sanders wants his endorsement, in fact I'm against it for that exact reason. Sanders is ok trying to get his audience in the party.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/5...edia-ecosystem

But for the viewers, these collaborations could lead viewers down where, for example, they begin as fans of Rogan and later end up becoming consumers of radicalized, far-right hate speech.

“The main point of entry I focus on in the report is conservative and libertarian influencers with mainstream appeal—like Joe Rogan like [Dave] Rubin,” Lewis told Motherboard in a phone call. “When they host other members of the Intellectual Dark Web, it’s easy to get drawn into that world.”

I'm not calling Sanders a Nazi, he isn't, they're in Rogan's audience. That's the Alt-Right.

Tulsi Gabbard was a fellow of his Institute and a long time friend and colleague of Nina Turner. When it came down choosing between Hillary Clinton and Tulsi he chose Tulsi.

https://www.sandersinstitute.com/about/gabbard

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/21/polit...eet/index.html

Washington (CNN)Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Bernie Sanders on Monday defended his fellow 2020 hopeful Rep. Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii against the claim that she is a "Russian asset," saying the suggestion is "outrageous."

"Tulsi Gabbard has put her life on the line to defend this country," the Vermont independent tweeted. "People can disagree on issues, but it is outrageous for anyone to suggest that Tulsi is a foreign asset."

AOC is a high profile leftist that is a main factor in the Green Bill and Sanders surrogate. She has skin in Sanders campaign, she's not neutral. He's disagreeing wth her on compromising, period, her stance as to do it as a last resort. He rejected it in the link I gave.

Obama had a very small window of power like that, the majority of it he was against record level obstruction from the GOP. Something President Sanders is going to get deja vu on.

He bought Killer Mike back, too.

Quantify what you said about that then. In this thread the number of anti Sanders people are far more, they are more vitriolic, got caught lying more, got caught smearing more, get caught calling people cultists and name callinga and have caused people to not feel like this thread was a safe environment and left. So just in your own little world, you guys are worse.

I have before, and this isn't a potent defence when you're doing in our recent exchanges. I heavily disagree with that statement.

The Young Turks, the Hill, and Michael Brooks have all existed and had the same ideology before Bernie made a run for President in 2016 and he spends more time on mainstream media outlets. So again..... not reflective of reality.

Bernie Sanders was a mayor from 1981-89, and has been in congress since 1991. Of course they have the same ideology of Sander's they support him. This is bizarre reasoning of what propaganda networks are. They're not tied to how much time a candidate is on it, otherwise Fox News isn't one since Republican presidents don't go on their very often.

It's funny I see alot of people who support his opponents saying he's bad for minorities and women when minorities and women support him at the greatest frequency. Yet weirdly mostly white men think they know better. Strange.

Blatantly erasing the attempts Bernie Bros has been caught harassing women and minorities. Some of which involve death threats in the past, and sexist attacks against Warren this year.

[quote]Yes there were multiple incidents and since he has taken more steps than any other campaign to make it safe for women. Something you didn't address.

If you think AOC knows more in a year or so you are kidding yourself and basing it off nothing more than bias.

I'm basing it on a link you're pretending doesn't exist. The Amendment King, make way for the Legislation Queen.

"You're either with Sanders or you're an enemy to be destroyed". It's funny how it's always anti Sanders people that perpetuate this garbage talking point. I support Sanders, but I supported Warren first and donated to her. This is tripe and more unquantifiable bias so you can have attack lines.

This was the second most embarassing post I've seen on this site.

This sentiment has been expressed repeatedly on this thread by Bernie supporters. We use them so often since we keep running into them. All this talk about Warren I'm skeptical about since you're going overboard defending Sanders from reality. I don't see you transferring that devotion to Warren if she wins.

[Robotman]

Damn this is brutal. Absolutely no kid gloves here. Warren is going for the throat.

[Gray Lensman]

I am DEFINITELY NOT voting for Bloomberg. That fascist can go kick rocks. If Liberals want him, have at it, and great job on suppressing the vote.

I can say that Bloomberg wouldn't us unlikely to continue Trump's "Anger our allies and cozy up to enemies manipulating him through flattery" model of foreign policy, and on the home front he won't have a Senate run by eager lackeys no matter who is running it. He's far less dangerous than Trump, even if I'd only vote for him against such an opponent.

He's still a **** sandwich, but Trump is a **** sandwich sourced from Cholera victims.

[numberthirty]

Damn this is brutal. Absolutely no kid gloves here. Warren is going for the throat.

That said, no one has mentioned all of the coin Bloomberg put into keeping the Senate in Republican hands in 2016.

[kidfresh512]

Warren is getting some good shots in for real.