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  1. #10546
    Astonishing Member Darkspellmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As for the whole "Promise Of A Better Life..." bribe that John/Jane Public are supposed to be paying some kind of a bribe for?

    - Look at the cost of Insulin in The United States for the last twenty years.


    The idea is just kind of laughable if you try to stack it up against what corporations have got for their political spending.
    President can do Jack if we dont have the Senate and house. We want both of them if we want to fix medical problems. And I point my finger squarely at Reagan and his ilk for starting this bullshit.

  2. #10547
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    Buttigieg is out

  3. #10548
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Buttigieg is out
    Wow, seriously? I wasn't expecting that so soon.
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  4. #10549
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Wow, seriously? I wasn't expecting that so soon.
    I thought it would be two days from now but he was done

  5. #10550
    CBR's Good Fairy Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    Put in the simplest terms...
    The fifty million coming from a bunch of regular "Janes"/"Joes" is fair because it gives those people a potential say that far less people making up the twenty-five million can buy every single time.
    If you object to people having a say, you have an objection to people having a say, the number shouldn't really effect that stance. I mean what's the cut off point? Is 100 people too few, but 500 people acceptable? What number of say is within your acceptable margin of error? On top of that it still doesn't stop billionaires running (in fact it makes it more likely the candidates who can afford to are the mega rich; going back to the 'good ol' days' where parliament was only the mega rich, as it didn't pay, and only rich people could afford to do a job that didn't give them money (flip side is... by and large you also only got people who actually cared about politics, rather than see it as a good career). But that's another debate for another day.

    For me the people vote, and if what is presented fuels the people, that's what they get. I am a little cynical and very much believe people get the politicians they deserve. Doesn't mean I don't get excited by someone who I think has good traits, and I'll root for them, but if the people don't pick them, it's on the people. I just don't see why it matters if 50 people give the money to present the politicians case or 500; ultimately it's the people who decide. That's what matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkspellmaster View Post
    Long answer, what do you think?
    Misogyny is real. Homophobia is real. Racism is real. And even if it's not conscious, it's still a bias people have; they set a higher expectation. They want things explained that much better, they want the candidate to be that much purer, and find any fault that much worse. They dislike what they say that much more. If a str8, white man had done as good as Warren at the debate, he'd have got a bigger boost. That doesn't mean it's a zero/everything. Would Warren be the front runner due to that debate if she was a man, no. But it would have helped more. And I think because of Obama everyone fooled themselves into thinking people finally didn't care. Obama was an anomaly, not the rule. And even then... had a white guy presented Obamacare it wouldn't be AS hated by Republicans. Hilary had many reasons to not like her due to her past, but had she been a man people would have hated her that bit less.

    If Sanders was gay, if he was female, if he was black, he'd not have as many fans. That's the reality of our world, sadly. The UK has had two female leaders (something not many countries can say) BUT we don't vote for a leader, we vote for a party (or more technically your local MP). And the party picks the leader, not the people. Had the people had a say, no, I don't think we'd have had two female leaders. The same way if the people picked, I don't think we'd have had three female Home Secretaries, two non-Caucasian Chancellors; same with America and the Secretary of State. Far more diverse in position due to the president picking them, than allowing the people to pick.

    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As for the whole "Promise Of A Better Life..." bribe that John/Jane Public are supposed to be paying some kind of a bribe for?
    - Look at the cost of Insulin in The United States for the last twenty years.
    The idea is just kind of laughable if you try to stack it up against what corporations have got for their political spending.
    Again, either you're against the 'deal' or you're not. To be against it for corporations but okay when it's voters... I don't see why one is better than the other. People should vote on who they think will make a good leader, not just on what "treats" they get.

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Batson View Post
    Confusing Sun Tzu with Mao
    Oh, whoops. My knowledge of Asian history is LITERALLY non-existent.
    "We are Shakespeare. We are Michelangelo. We are Tchaikovsky. We are Turing. We are Mercury. We are Wilde. We are Lincoln, Lorca, Leonardo da Vinci. We are Alexander the Great. We are Fredrick the Great. We are Rustin. We are Addams. We are Marsha! Marsha Marsha Marsha! We so generous, we DeGeneres. We are Ziggy Stardust hooked to the silver screen. Controversially we are Malcolm X. We are Plato. We are Aristotle. We are RuPaul, god dammit! And yes, we are Woolf."

  6. #10551
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Buttigieg is out
    Good riddance. At least Pete's voters’ second choice is Sanders.

    https://morningconsult.com/2020-democratic-primary/
    Last edited by Vegan Daddy; 03-01-2020 at 04:49 PM.

  7. #10552
    CBR's Good Fairy Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegan Daddy View Post
    Good riddance. At least Pete's voters second choice is Sanders.

    https://morningconsult.com/2020-democratic-primary/
    Shocker, the poster who happily mis-labels LGBT+ people is happy the most successful gay candidate in primary history has dropped out. Quelle surprisé.
    "We are Shakespeare. We are Michelangelo. We are Tchaikovsky. We are Turing. We are Mercury. We are Wilde. We are Lincoln, Lorca, Leonardo da Vinci. We are Alexander the Great. We are Fredrick the Great. We are Rustin. We are Addams. We are Marsha! Marsha Marsha Marsha! We so generous, we DeGeneres. We are Ziggy Stardust hooked to the silver screen. Controversially we are Malcolm X. We are Plato. We are Aristotle. We are RuPaul, god dammit! And yes, we are Woolf."

  8. #10553
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Buttigieg is out
    He's doing the right thing.

    He doesn't have much of a path forward, and at this point, would mainly split the centrist vote. It's better for him to drop out now than after all the states go on Super Tuesday.

    I think he might have been the strongest general election opponent for Trump, as an intelligent young midwesterner who served his country, but he definitely elevated his profile honorably. He has first choice of the nomination for any statewide office in Indiana, and would be a worthy addition to any Democratic presidential cabinet.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  9. #10554
    CBR's Good Fairy Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    He's doing the right thing.

    He doesn't have much of a path forward, and at this point, would mainly split the centrist vote. It's better for him to drop out now than after all the states go on Super Tuesday.

    I think he might have been the strongest general election opponent for Trump, as an intelligent young midwesterner who served his country, but he definitely elevated his profile honorably. He has first choice of the nomination for any statewide office in Indiana, and would be a worthy addition to any Democratic presidential cabinet.
    Agreed. And hey... maybe he can be Biden's VP It certainly won't hurt his career going out still doing well; and he's young, he'll have another shot. But agreed about an opponent to Trump. His military background would have helped a lot, and siphoned of a little Republican support who are military inclined. And the fact he's not a millionaire could have appealed to the working class more (again, Republican base). Either way, he did good. Made history. No matter what, he was a trailblazer. Got firther than any openly gay candidate before him. Only(?) openly gay candidate to win a state in the primaries. Only openly gay candidate to make it to Top 2 in New Hampshire. It was a very noble effort.
    Last edited by Kieran_Frost; 03-01-2020 at 05:02 PM.
    "We are Shakespeare. We are Michelangelo. We are Tchaikovsky. We are Turing. We are Mercury. We are Wilde. We are Lincoln, Lorca, Leonardo da Vinci. We are Alexander the Great. We are Fredrick the Great. We are Rustin. We are Addams. We are Marsha! Marsha Marsha Marsha! We so generous, we DeGeneres. We are Ziggy Stardust hooked to the silver screen. Controversially we are Malcolm X. We are Plato. We are Aristotle. We are RuPaul, god dammit! And yes, we are Woolf."

  10. #10555
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    It'll be interesting to see how those "second choice" polls bear out now that people are starting to be forced to make that choice. I'm just curious if they hold up or not.

    Make no mistake, this is a "We have to stop Bernie" decision by Buttigieg.

  11. #10556
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    It'll be interesting to see how those "second choice" polls bear out now that people are starting to be forced to make that choice. I'm just curious if they hold up or not.

    Make no mistake, this is a "We have to stop Bernie" decision by Buttigieg.
    Buttigieg is going to make a statement tonight, possibly endorse someone.
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  12. #10557
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Buttigieg is going to make a statement tonight, possibly endorse someone.
    I guarantee it will basically boil down to "We can't let the socialist win" And I would bet Biden had a conversation with him about a place in his cabinet if he wins. No other reason to do this today and not Wednesday.

  13. #10558
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theleviathan View Post
    It'll be interesting to see how those "second choice" polls bear out now that people are starting to be forced to make that choice. I'm just curious if they hold up or not.

    Make no mistake, this is a "We have to stop Bernie" decision by Buttigieg.
    Probably. But it’s also a “he’s the youngest guy in the race, tremendously booster his profile for a run as governor or Senator, and he’s beholden for big donors who are probably telling him that he can’t win and it’s smarter to get out now before he pisses people off” decision.

    Here’s thing, he was on life support anyways.

  14. #10559
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Buttigieg is out
    Bummer. If Warren drops out, I'll just be voting against trump.

  15. #10560
    Incredible Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    I'm glad Buttigeig is dropping out. He and Klobuchar are my favorites amongst the dems but right now all the sane moderate dems are doing is guaranteeing a Sanders nomination which means 4 more years of Trump. The moderates need to coalesce around one candidate and Biden or Bloomberg seem to be the only realistic candidates. Both have their warts but they are better than Sanders.

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