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  1. #15256
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Because in order to win a presidential election you need to be able to persuade people who would consider voting for the other guy.
    The way this country has been polarized (especially by the Murdock media etc), that no longer works. It all comes down to voter turnout in each camp, and voter suppression.
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

  2. #15257
    Astonishing Member PwrdOn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    I doubt working class white voters are like Rogan. He is a libertarian atheist. Biden can peal away some white males and more white females from Trump. Do you think Bernie appeals to working class male voters?
    Then you haven't met many working class white people, like Rogan most of them have no discernible political philosophy, they just tend to parrot whatever ideas sound good, and Bernie's ideas certainly sound much better than Biden's. At this point I don't see any discernible demographic among Trump voters that Biden has any real chance of swaying, he's just going to have to bank on turning out the base, and well, good luck with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    Unpopular opinion: Universal healthcare in Italy, Spain and the UK did nothing to slow down the spread of the virus.

    In a situation like this, government strategy and the quality of hospital care is essential. South Korea showed the world how effective early, wide spread testing can be. Germany has the lowest death rate because they have a lot of ICUs and have done a relatively good job of "firewalling" the elderly population.

    So basically, it looks like politicizing a crisis when Bernie and his Bros are using the epidemic as an argument to bring M4A now. Whether you are for the concept or not, it is a non-sequitur as far as a global pandemic is concerned.
    Germany and South Korea have universal health care also. And it's not politicizing the crisis to point out that many of the problems we're dealing with now are directly a product of a health system that prioritizes profits over people. We're so short on critical supplies that states are in a bidding war over masks and ventilators, and we've even had to resort to outright piracy to steal shipments from other countries. Nevermind the fact that we are just about the only country where government officials tried to push people to go back to work to ensure that businesses stay profitable, rather than figuring out how to leverage the resources at our disposal to tide us over until we can go outside again.
    Last edited by PwrdOn; 04-04-2020 at 10:51 AM.

  3. #15258
    Extraordinary Member Malvolio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Masks do shit, they literally dont stop you GETTING Covid 19 and slightly slow you GIVING Covid 19 but lose effectiveness quickly when you make it damp.
    Oh yes. If you're wearing a mask and you sneeze into it, throw that mask away. Whether your sneeze is just from seasonal allergies or actually from Covid 19 or anything in between, you've contaminated it. It's worthless now, so throw it away.
    Watching television is not an activity.

  4. #15259
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    Then you haven't met many working class white people, like Rogan most of them have no discernible political philosophy, they just tend to parrot whatever ideas sound good, and Bernie's ideas certainly sound much better than Biden's. At this point I don't see any discernible demographic among Trump voters that Biden has any real chance of swaying, he's just going to have to bank on turning out the base, and well, good luck with that.
    Actually, it's the other way around. There is no discernible demographic among non Trump voters that Trump has any chance of swaying. With his 42% he will have to pull another inside straight while losing by more votes than last time. You don't think any of those non Hillary voters will vote for Biden? I can't see that being the case. And with Biden Trump will not win Pennsylvania, and probably Michigan.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  5. #15260
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malvolio View Post
    Oh yes. If you're wearing a mask and you sneeze into it, throw that mask away. Whether your sneeze is just from seasonal allergies or actually from Covid 19 or anything in between, you've contaminated it. It's worthless now, so throw it away.
    There is a thing called soap.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  6. #15261
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    The way this country has been polarized (especially by the Murdock media etc), that no longer works. It all comes down to voter turnout in each camp, and voter suppression.
    There aren't a lot of swing voters, but they matter a lot.

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...ers-are-there/

    Part of the reason Democrats won so many house seats in 2018 is that they were able to persuade people who voted for Trump.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  7. #15262
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    There aren't a lot of swing voters, but they matter a lot.

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...ers-are-there/

    Part of the reason Democrats won so many house seats in 2018 is that they were able to persuade people who voted for Trump.
    Pretty much. There’s a group in the middle that leans one way and probably identifies more with one party, but they are malleable. It’s a game of inducing urgency in your base so they come out and give you a floor and then appealing to those wishy washy people (aka people who voted for Obama and then Trump).

    And that’s not an ideological thing either necessarily. It’s a compelling argument thing or appealing to sensibilities thing). Aka the person who you don’t think is racist or sexist but bought that Hillary was some evil mastermind and/or said things like “well Trump at least says what he means”. It’s more of a connecting with people who aren’t paying attention

  8. #15263
    Astonishing Member PwrdOn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    Actually, it's the other way around. There is no discernible demographic among non Trump voters that Trump has any chance of swaying. With his 42% he will have to pull another inside straight while losing by more votes than last time. You don't think any of those non Hillary voters will vote for Biden? I can't see that being the case. And with Biden Trump will not win Pennsylvania, and probably Michigan.
    Trump doesn't have to sway anyone, he will win as long as his base holds firm, and we have yet to see any evidence that it won't. And what makes you think that Biden will be able to swing Pennsylvania and Michigan? He hasn't given them a single reason to vote for him.

  9. #15264
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    Actually, it's the other way around. There is no discernible demographic among non Trump voters that Trump has any chance of swaying. With his 42% he will have to pull another inside straight while losing by more votes than last time. You don't think any of those non Hillary voters will vote for Biden? I can't see that being the case. And with Biden Trump will not win Pennsylvania, and probably Michigan.
    Problem with this is that the Democratic Party relies on the less likely and more malleable than Trump’s

  10. #15265
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PwrdOn View Post
    Trump doesn't have to sway anyone, he will win as long as his base holds firm, and we have yet to see any evidence that it won't. And what makes you think that Biden will be able to swing Pennsylvania and Michigan? He hasn't given them a single reason to vote for him.
    None of the polling says that is true. More than half the voters polled say they will not vote for Trump. His base is 43% at best. His base only voters lost the GOP the biggest Congressional swing in 50 years in 2018. Not sure why you think his base can win him this election?
    Biden is from Pennsylvania and is well liked there. Will pick up voters Hillary did not get. Trump has being losing Michigan all by himself with his treatment of the Governor.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  11. #15266
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    Actually, it's the other way around. There is no discernible demographic among non Trump voters that Trump has any chance of swaying. With his 42% he will have to pull another inside straight while losing by more votes than last time. You don't think any of those non Hillary voters will vote for Biden? I can't see that being the case. And with Biden Trump will not win Pennsylvania, and probably Michigan.
    Trump may have lost Michigan this time all on his own, although Biden might try to cement that via his Veep pick. Speaking of which, Biden has informed Sanders that he is starting his search for Veep and cabinet picks. Although Joe's lead is virtually insurmountable, Bernie hasn't been mathematically eliminated yet, so Biden decided to let Sanders know in advance to avoid the appearance of presumption. He is also going to be looking specifically at younger politicians to help raise the profile (and give relative experience to) the next generation of leaders for the next 4-16 years.
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  12. #15267
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
    Problem with this is that the Democratic Party relies on the less likely and more malleable than Trump’s
    True. A big get out the vote effort will be necessary. But they showed up in 2018, and Trumps base didn't.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  13. #15268
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    None of the polling says that is true. More than half the voters polled say they will not vote for Trump. His base is 43% at best. His base only voters lost the GOP the biggest Congressional swing in 50 years in 2018. Not sure why you think his base can win him this election?
    Biden is from Pennsylvania and is well liked there. Will pick up voters Hillary did not get. Trump has being losing Michigan all by himself with his treatment of the Governor.

    The day before Super Tuesday all the polls had Sanders having an insurmountable win. It’s the 4th month of the year and the election is the 11th month of the year. Hillary looked she was going to win most of the election.

    I’m not saying this to say the polls are wrong right now, but this isn’t the time to be optimistic. It’s the time to act desperate like you think you will lose and claw for every advantage

  14. #15269
    Latverian ambassador Iron Maiden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    There is a thing called soap.
    Yes, I think you can do that with the sturdier mask. Wash it when you get home and let it dry. I found a couple I forgot I had from when I would use bug spray on my roses. I've been wearing those.

  15. #15270
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    True. A big get out the vote effort will be necessary. But they showed up in 2018, and Trumps base didn't.
    I am wondering if anyone on Trump's campaign team is worried that parts of Trump's base are currently exercising their freedoms by packing church pews and socializing in other non-liberal, non-distanced ways.

    But I guess it's balanced out by large cities with mass transport being hit hard, and they being very Biden blue.
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

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