All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[Tazirai]

A separate party will have to fight against two parties and will be a gift to the republicans. Taking over the Democratic party is more efficient.

The Dem loyalists should have done a better job if they didn't want to lose the party. Losing to Trump was the final straw.

Tell em again. I don't think they heard you.
They think the Democratic party is gonna save us. Lol.
How?
The Democratic party is a ghost ship that needs boarding and retrofitting.

[Superbat]

And she still crushed Sanders by about four million votes.

He lost so badly that he stayed in the race just to try to force her to adopt his policies.

Because he couldn't win with them.

In the primary.

He was more liked in the country, she was the choice of the people that voted in the primary. That's why the Democrats made the wrong choice, they chose someone who was nearly as unpopular as Trump and so she lost to him.

[Tazirai]

Sanders "lost" in that election as well.

I'll add that you sound like a fascist, so you shouldn't be surprised if you don't get people to vote for your candidate in the process.

He lost a primary that had a lot against him.
He most likely would have won the general.

Seems like the Establishment hates Trumpian fascism, but they love them some Bloomberg racist fascism.

[Tazirai]

Way to burnish that Bernie Bro image, kid.

This sort of talk and fight did Labour no favors in the UK. It won't help here, either.

No, Media lies, like how ours is doing it to Sanders, lost the Labour Movement.
When you have the UK version of Bloomberg running the TV, not a lot you can do yeah?

Labour as a whole did nothing wrong, except forget they won on Brexit, then they forgot how they won.
Kinda like the idiots that run the DNC.

[aja_christopher]

In the primary.

Because he didn't even get enough votes to get into the general.

Because he was even less liked than Hillary by the voters who chose between them.

[Tazirai]

Moderates compose the majority of democratic voters. Many of those moderates will vote for progressives, but voters generally will choose the candidate who is PERCEIVED as more moderate, lest we forget that Trump ran to Clinton's left on more than one issue.

What you are describing will lead to a rump party. Some folks may be fine with that, but if you want to actually enact your agenda, you're going to need more moderate, dare I even say centrist, voices to have room in the party.

Most moderates are more progressive than you think.

Problem with our electoral system is that people don't know labels.

If you take all of the candidates and put their stances on a sheet of paper and don't label whose platform it is. Most will choose the progressive one. Because moderates are so 1980's/90's.

But sure there are more moderates...

Moderates who literally do nothing for the people that vote for them.

[Superbat]

Don't blame Democrats for Sanders' lousy campaigning. He knew what he was getting into and failed to account for what the voters wanted.

He lost because so many voters barely knew him. It wasn't his policies that made him lose the primary, it was him not doing a good job of making more voters aware of him.

Guess what'll happen when Sanders enters the general.

They'll still be higher than everyone else's.

[numberthirty]

Because he didn't even get enough votes to get into the general.

Because he was even less liked than Hillary by the voters who chose between them.

Who have selected losing nominees more than once.

[Superbat]

Because he didn't even get enough votes to get into the general.

Because he was even less liked than Hillary by the voters who chose between them.

Yes, he was more liked overall but in the primary voters chose Hillary.

That was the mistake Democrat's made, they chose a nominee that couldn't beat Trump. They could have chosen the most popular politician in the country but instead they chose the 2nd most unpopular.

[Malvolio]

He lost the primary. He would have won the general.

This time he'll win both.

"You have to have a plan to deal with whatever comes your way." Your words explaining why Bernie lost the primary and why Hillary lost the general election in 2016. So I ask in all sincerity, what plan does Bernie have? Because the obstacles he faced in the 2016 primary are still there even if Hillary Clinton is no longer a candidate and the obstacles she faced in the 2016 general election will still be there as well, because the Electoral College is still in the exact same format now as it was then. So what is Bernie's plan?

[aja_christopher]

That was the mistake Democrat's made, they chose a nominee that couldn't beat Trump.

You have absolutely no proof whatsoever that Sanders could have -- or can -- beat Trump.

Who have selected losing nominees more than once.

I see when Sanders' losses are brought up, suddenly losing in 2016 isn't the only thing that matters anymore.

The reason no one trusts your opinions on Sanders is because you are blatantly dishonest about his weaknesses.

And you are completely willing to drag everyone else down with you if you don't get your way.

[numberthirty]

"You have to have a plan to deal with whatever comes your way." Your words explaining why Bernie lost the primary and why Hillary lost the general election in 2016. So I ask in all sincerity, what plan does Bernie have? Because the obstacles he faced in the 2016 primary are still there even if Hillary Clinton is no longer a candidate and the obstacles she faced in the 2016 general election will still be there as well, because the Electoral College is still in the exact same format now as it was then. So what is Bernie's plan?

For starters...

Not just taking Wisconsin and Michigan for granted.

That's already a far better plan.

[Superbat]

"You have to have a plan to deal with whatever comes your way." Your words explaining why Bernie lost the primary and why Hillary lost the general election in 2016. So I ask in all sincerity, what plan does Bernie have? Because the obstacles he faced in the 2016 primary are still there even if Hillary Clinton is no longer a candidate and the obstacles she faced in the 2016 general election will still be there as well, because the Electoral College is still in the exact same format now as it was then. So what is Bernie's plan?

Those obstacles still remain but Sanders is winning now. He's leading nationally by double digits, and continues to rise in state polls.

He can win the electoral college. He's more liked in the states Hillary lost than she was.

[numberthirty]

I see when Sanders' losses are brought up, suddenly losing in 2016 isn't the only thing that matters anymore.

The reason no one trusts your opinions on Sanders is because you are blatantly dishonest about his weaknesses.

And you are completely willing to drag everyone else down with you if you don't get your way.

You are making it more complicated than it is.

Democratic primary voters have picked "The Person Who Is Next..." more than once.

Actual viability in a General has been, at best, a secondary concern.

[aja_christopher]

You are making it more complicated than it is.

Democratic primary voters have picked "The Person Who Is Next..." more than once.

Actual viability in a General has been, at best, a secondary concern.

Viability is a primary concern, which is exactly why many people would prefer a moderate -- even Bloomberg -- in the general election to Sanders.

You're just making excuses for Sanders' losses, which is to be expected any time someone engages in dialogue with you.

Blame the DNC, blame Democratic voters, blame Hillary, blame moderates -- blame anyone but Sanders for his losses.

Again, maybe you will manage to drag everyone else down enough this time to help Sanders win the primary.

But it remains to be seen how making so many enemies in the Democratic party will play out in the general.