Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT OF THE LAKE View Post
I mean Biden is running is as another Obama.

Obama got one thing passed, it's currently getting dismantled, meanwhile Democrats lost ground in Congress and got stonewalled for pretty much the entire Presidency and then an incredibly anti Obama candidate gave the Republicans the Presidency.

So we already saw what you just laid out happen with a canidate that is ideologically similar to Obama with less charisma and less vision.

So I don't really view that as a great counterpoint when we just saw that exact scenario happen in administration Biden was part of.
Passing the ACA is miles and miles ahead of any accomplishment I suspect that Bernie can pass. I'm not sure any current candidate could touch any piece of legislation at that level of complexity and significance for that matter. But on the ACA - you may not think it went far enough. You may hate the idea altogether. However, passing it required a ton of political capital and effort on the part of Obama. Yes, Biden is not Obama and may not have the ability to pass any close to that either. But, whatever else you think of what he has passed in his past, his record in political office has a much more robust slate of accomplishments. He has other flaws, but accomplishing things he sets out to do is not among those flaws. Bernie absolutely has that flaw.

I am not making a pro-Biden argument, much as you seem to keep steering it that way. Hell, I just stated my stance on him has weakened significantly as his gaffes appear to show more and more age/self-control issues. But if you can't make a pro-Bernie argument in reality, without constantly turning to "but what about Joe!" then you're basically admitting Bernie's faults, you just don't want to say them out loud.

And please remember, this discussion started with the idea that all candidates have flaws we have to accept to some degree or another. So pointing out a major flaw a candidate has shouldn't be all that controversial. Your issue with it should be about how you feel about it, not denying it exists or trying to steer attention away. Just say you don't care. That's fine. But trying to explain away Bernie's lack of executed plans is just refusing that have a conversation in reality.