All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[TheManInBlack]

Progressives kick ass at that!

I love all these lame analogies though. It's as if people cant recognize that, yes, Democrats lie (nature of politics) but Republicans are on a whole different scale. Yeah, that dude slashing your tires is irritating....these other mother fuckers are trying to burn your house down, salt the earth, and frame you for doing it. Yeah, both criminal acts. Not in the same ballpark.

AJA is right, why cling to such an obvious false equivalency unless you are trying to make excuses?

I can't speak for thirty, but my point isn't making excuses for ****-heel Republicans--I think both parties are abysmal and personally hate both of them--but to challenge the ridiculous assertion that flat-out lying one out of every four things a person talks about isn't habitual lying. Anyone claiming that it isn't habitual is just being willfully ignorant and letting their party loyalty blind them in a really glaringly obvious (and sad) way.

I find it impossible to believe that if any of you knew a person in real life who lies 24% of everything he says, that you wouldn't call him a habitual liar (or something much worse, really.) That's a monumental amount of lies. The fact that this is even being debated is stunning to me, and in any other context we'd all be in complete agreement, but because the subject is the Democrats, suddenly it's okay to lie constantly. Alrighty then.

[Jack Dracula]

I can't speak for thirty, but my point isn't making excuses for ****-heel Republicans--I think both parties are abysmal and personally hate both of them--but to challenge the ridiculous assertion that flat-out lying one out of every four things a person talks about isn't habitual lying. Anyone claiming that it isn't habitual is just being willfully ignorant and letting their party loyalty blind them in a really glaringly obvious (and sad) way.

I find it impossible to believe that if any of you knew a person in real life who lies 24% of everything he says, that you wouldn't call him a habitual liar (or something much worse, really.) That's a monumental amount of lies. The fact that this is even being debated is stunning to me, and in any other context we'd all be in complete agreement, but because the subject is the Democrats, suddenly it's okay to lie constantly. Alrighty then.

Actually, I'd call that person "average".

[JackDaw]

Actually, I'd call that person "average".

Would you?

It seems a high proportion of porkies to me.

[numberthirty]

Would you?

It seems a high proportion of porkies to me.

For real.

That said, let's say it's "Average..."

Why are we even taking a party to task that tells around two lies to the one of a "Average..." party? If I'm not supposed to even take note of a quarter of what someone says being lies, what's the bit whoop with a little over fifty percent being lies?

It's only about double what an "Average..." person lies(which is seemingly fine...)

[zinderel]

Re: “Both sides lie!”

I think we are pretending that people are...more honest than we are. People lie. People spin yarns. We stretch the truth. NO ONE tells the whole truth all the time, and anyone who says they do is...well, lying.

Now, Politicians lie more than average humans. We all know that. We accept it as part of politics, for good or bad, because it has ALWAYS been like this.

But lemme tell you...If I have two politicians (who are, by definition, professional liars) trying to get me to vote for them, and one lies to me and says “You can keep your old doctor on the ACA!” and I figure out that was a lie, and the politician is like, “Well, OK, MOST people can, but some will have to find new doctors after all...”, I’ll be disappointed. It’s a lie that didn’t need to be told, and it’s a hassle, but...I’ll get over it.

Now, the other guy lies to me and says “We aren’t locking up immigrants in camps!” and then I find out they ARE, and they say, “Well, Ok, we ARE locking them up, but they are living in great conditions!” And then I find out they are sleeping on floors in piles? And the response is, “Well, OK, they are caged like animals, but at least the kids are well fed and cared for!” And then I find out that kids are starving and dying of preventable illnesses and being molested and abused and ripped from their mothers and family and denied the use of toilets? And the response when I call the liar out is, “Well, they’re ONLY illegal immigrants...”?

Yeah. One liar is HANDS DOWN worse and flat out evil...

[worstblogever]

Perhaps the most telling thing going on here in this thread is that folks that lean to the left are noting that lying is bad, and that Republicans do it far more and far more egregiously...

And Republicans just want to say the Democrats are "just as bad" (when they aren't) rather than expect their politicians from either side of the aisle to not lie to them.

But lying is now all that they're left with. It's why they get their news from Fox News and conspiracy-theory level sites like WorldNetDaily and InfoWars.

[numberthirty]

Re: “Both sides lie!”

I think we are pretending that people are...more honest than we are. People lie. People spin yarns. We stretch the truth. NO ONE tells the whole truth all the time, and anyone who says they do is...well, lying.

Now, Politicians lie more than average humans. We all know that. We accept it as part of politics, for good or bad, because it has ALWAYS been like this.

But lemme tell you...If I have two politicians (who are, by definition, professional liars) trying to get me to vote for them, and one lies to me and says “You can keep your old doctor on the ACA!” and I figure out that was a lie, and the politician is like, “Well, OK, MOST people can, but some will have to find new doctors after all...”, I’ll be disappointed. It’s a lie that didn’t need to be told, and it’s a hassle, but...I’ll get over it.

Now, the other guy lies to me and says “We aren’t locking up immigrants in camps!” and then I find out they ARE, and they say, “Well, Ok, we ARE locking them up, but they are living in great conditions!” And then I find out they are sleeping on floors in piles? And the response is, “Well, OK, they are caged like animals, but at least the kids are well fed and cared for!” And then I find out that kids are starving and dying of preventable illnesses and being molested and abused and ripped from their mothers and family and denied the use of toilets? And the response when I call the liar out is, “Well, they’re ONLY illegal immigrants...”?

Yeah. One liar is HANDS DOWN worse and flat out evil...

If you are going to accept that way of framing things?

Sure.

Meanwhile, that one you seem fine with a "get over it..." approach tp also executed an American citizen without a trial and was in on untold numbers of non-combatant casualties.

So, yeah.

It's not like one is most likely worse than the other.

It's the blinders one would have to put on to see it the way you just laid it out that is the issue.

[Tendrin]

If you are going to accept that way of framing things?

Sure.

Meanwhile, that one one you seem fine with a "get over it..." approach also executed an American citizen without a trial and was in on untold numbers of non-combatant casualties.

So, yeah.

It's not like one is most likely worse than the other.

It's the blinders one would have to put on to see it the way you just laid it out that is the issue.

As usual, 30 likes to spend more time trashing Democrats from something that Obama did nine years ago when the GOP just waived white nationalists into the military.

[worstblogever]

On this date in 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, as well as 2018, “Crazy/Stupid Republican of the Day posted profiles of Chuck Winder, who in 2012, joined the ranks of Republicans who were talking about rape during a discussion about a mandatory ultrasound anti-abortion bill, when he intimated that a married woman could not be “truly raped”. When he was criticized for his comments, he defended them by saying that he just meant women should be “tested” to prove if they were actually raped or not. Winder has still has other issues with women, including supporting a bill so their employers could deny them contraceptive coverage on their insurance plans. Winder also has the staggering hypocrisy to demand federal marijuana laws should allow the states to override state law and continue to make the drug illegal, and then simultaneously push for legislation to nullify the Affordable Care Act on “states’ rights”, and supports the highly unconstitutional idea that states should be able to sue the federal government to annex federal lands. in 2016, he co-sponsored a bill to make the Bible as a reference tool in all public school courses. (Because when it's time to discuss evolution, you want to be able to cite a man being made of clay and a woman being made out of one of his ribs, for sciences' sake.)

Chuck Winder’s latest attacks on public education were in 2017 and were a move to pass legislation to remove the discussion of climate change from school classes, because heaven forbid the children learn that his party has been denying it’s happening and causing a global crisis for decades. (Spoiler Alert: He failed.)

Chuck Winder did receive a primary challenger in 2018, defeating him with 60% of the vote. And thus he remains a fixture in Idaho politics, not unlike an old leaky toilet that needs replacing. He accomplished virtually nothing while leading the Idaho State Senate in the past session in the state legislature, and wistfully wished for different legislators after 2020 to maybe accomplish… something, or anything.

[numberthirty]

As usual, 30 likes to spend more time trashing Democrats from something that Obama did nine years ago when the GOP just waived white nationalists into the military.

If you are actually stating the facts of what happened?

That ain't "Thrashing..."

It's what was actually done.

If you don't want deal with being asked answer for it, don't do it to start with.

[Tendrin]

If you are actually stating the facts of what happened?

That ain't "Thrashing..."

It's what was actually done.

If you don't want deal with being asked answer for it, don't do it to start with.

Factually, yes. It's what happened, leaving aside the fact that you're talking about the hunt for terrorist Anwar Al-Awlaki who has inspired and countinues to inspire terrorist attacks world wide. In a more sober world, we could have a serious conversation about this and the death of his son. That is not this world.

Your use of it here, however, in the context of this discussion at this moment amounts to mere concern trolling. Trump has escalated the very drone war, and the corresponding deaths of civilians, you're pretending to care about here, and pardoned a war criminal who's own team turned him in and fired warning shots at civilians to get them to run away so he couldn't murder them.

Spare me your self-righteous sanctimonious concern over 'democrats' when you can barely find a word out of your voluminous posts to point at ongoing slaughter abroad that your willing inaction, and continuing greenwald inspired nonsense, aids and abets.

[aja_christopher]

If you don't want deal with being asked answer for it, don't do it to start with.

Says the individual who never complains about what Republicans have "actually done".

[numberthirty]

Factually, yes. It's what happened, leaving aside the fact that you're talking about the hunt for terrorist Anwar Al-Awlaki who has inspired and countinues to inspire terrorist attacks world wide. In a more sober world, we could have a serious conversation about this. That is not this world.

Your use here, however, amounts to mere concern trolling. Trump has escalated the very drone war, and the corresponding deaths of civilians, you're pretending to care about here, and pardoned a war criminal who's own team turned him in and fired warning shots at civilians to get them to run away so he couldn't murder them.

Spare me your self-righteous sanctimonious concern over 'democrats' when you can barely find a word out of your voluminous posts to point at ongoing slaughter abroad that your willing inaction, and continuing greenwald inspired nonsense, aids and abets.

I've already pointed out that Republicans don't get much of a mention since they are(barring nothing short of a truly miraculous heel turn...) completely unacceptable.

I fully expect the "Unacceptable" party to do what you have mentioned. There is right around "Zero..." point in addressing it because any attempt will fall on utterly deaf ears.

[aja_christopher]

I've already pointed out that Republicans don't get much of a mention since they are(barring nothing short of a truly miraculous heel turn...) completely unacceptable.

I fully expect the "Unacceptable" party to do what you have mentioned. There is right around "Zero..." point in addressing it because any attempt will fall on utterly deaf ears.

Instead of "expecting" wrong from the Republicans, take a stand against it their "unacceptable" behavior.

Your vote against Trump wouldn't fall on deaf ears so stop making blatantly false excuses for your behavior.

[numberthirty]

Instead of "expecting" wrong from the Republicans, take a stand against it.

Your vote against Trump wouldn't fall on deaf ears so stop making blatantly false excuses for your behavior.

Making a stand with an "Against" vote is how we got to where we are now.

Never mind that Trump truly is a politician that thrives on those "Against" him being a part of the equation.