All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[Michael Watkins]

By that same token, read the damn thread for yourself. I’m far from the only person who has seen it. I’m not tossing accusations into a vacuum, here. Go read the earlier threads too. Go back as far as 2015 and take a look for yourself. You have the resources and ability to do exactly what you expect me to do. I’m not doing your emotional labor for you.

I have seen that claim that Bernie is ahead, yet whenever I see an ACTUAL poll, it isn’t nearly as big a deal as the fanatics make it out to be.


And, again...if you don’t do the things Bernie Bros do, which I pretty clearly laid out, then the label doesn’t apply to you.

You can defend your candidate, as long as you don’t demand perfection of them that you don’t expect of Bernie.

So no one said it. You are just casting aspersions to provide cover for an anti-Bernie agenda. Got it.

[Michael Watkins]

It’s disturbingly enlightening that you take posts criticizing fanaticism among certain Bernie followers and being ‘anti-Bernie’ posts...

I only posted to criticize fanaticism. The palpable hatred of Sanders is what i’m reacting to. I’m actually a Warren supporter. But she’s hemorrhaging support; mostly because of her health care stance changing and the recent infighting.

[zinderel]

So no one said it. You are just casting aspersions to provide cover for an anti-Bernie agenda. Got it.

And you wonder why people say Bernie supporters are unreasonable...

You can literally read the thread for yourself, but you demand someone else do the work for you. That isn’t my job. I lived through that slog once, and have no interest in doing it again, especially for someone who doesn’t want to put in the most minimal effort.

Also? Lol. ‘Hatred of Sanders’? Seriously? So criticizing his most fervent and unreasonable supporters = hating him?

Sure, Jan...

[BeastieRunner]

Bernie is doing that with AOC but she's too young to run as of now.

I am aware of that.

Even so, it's not really helpful when it's not somebody that can't run for POTUS.

But that is better than Biden.

Harris, Duckworth, Mayor Pete, Rebecca Pinn, Mohammed Tazbir Alam (recently won man of the year), Patty Murray, Dick Durbin, heck even Warren and Schumer qualify. Many more, too, like Tammy Baldwin, MJ Hegar, and others.

Biden and Bernie need to pass the torch and go home.

[Theleviathan]

Have a look at the Impeachment Trial. The Democrats prosecuting Trump are all stars.


... I just hope their roles of impeachment prosecutors don't make them cops.

I guess most of them just didn't strike me as the "young progressives" being referenced.

On the other points people brought up - I'm thrilled Beto is doing that. The left needs to care about winning every level of government.

[Billy Batson]

I am aware of that.

Even so, it's not really helpful when it's not somebody that can't run for POTUS.

But that is better than Biden.

Harris, Duckworth, Mayor Pete, Rebecca Pinn, Mohammed Tazbir Alam (recently won man of the year), Patty Murray, Dick Durbin, heck even Warren and Schumer qualify. Many more, too, like Tammy Baldwin, MJ Hegar, and others.

Biden and Bernie need to pass the torch and go home.

But those people are unlikable with bad policies so Sanders has to run.

[Tazirai]

I am aware of that.

Even so, it's not really helpful when it's not somebody that can't run for POTUS.

But that is better than Biden.

Harris, Duckworth, Mayor Pete, Rebecca Pinn, Mohammed Tazbir Alam (recently won man of the year), Patty Murray, Dick Durbin, heck even Warren and Schumer qualify. Many more, too, like Tammy Baldwin, MJ Hegar, and others.

Biden and Bernie need to pass the torch and go home.

Several you posted can be attributed to MILD Progressivism. As a black man, Kamala gets no support from me. Her history in her own community is testament to how she really feels.

[Theleviathan]

Several you posted can be attributed to MILD Progressivism. As a black man, Kamala gets no support from me. Her history in her own community is testament to how she really feels.

Do you ever feel like you're making the perfect the enemy of the good?

[JCAll]

Well....who would that even be? The closest thing in the field is Buttigieg and all you hear about is his lack of qualifying experience. We need more progressives to hold significant offices and win elections so we can cultivate them as candidates. Then, yeah, I totally agree....that should be Biden and Bernie's roles.

Isn't Buttigieg one of the more conservative people running?

[JCAll]

Last week my Insurance company literally denied my Metformin because of something in the code that I had to opt out of that they never told me existed. When I called UHC, they said there was nothing they could do it was up to CVS Caremark.
CVS Caremark rep didn't even know it existed, then told me my only option was to have the doctor provide me a 90 day Scrip, not a 30 day scrip.

Our Healthcare system is insane.

I'm sure somewhere along the line someone is making a nice profit on everything being so obtuse.
It's positively unethical.

[Theleviathan]

Isn't Buttigieg one of the more conservative people running?

I guess it depends on how you want to define that. He has some moderate tendencies and some progressive tendencies. Even still, if the qualifiers are "young" and "progressive" he's the only one that has a shot at 100% on that test.

[aja_christopher]

But those people are unlikable with bad policies so Sanders has to run.

Many people find Bernie unlikable.

Paying for his policies even more so -- especially with mainstream voters.

Again -- nearly all of these criticisms are subjective.

I have yet to hear an objective reason why Sanders supporters think the majority of voters will support paying higher taxes as he intends.

Kamala was a cop, and I hate cops, but I’d have supported her had she made it through and won the primary to secure the party nomination. Because, cop or not, she isn’t Trump and his lackeys and sycophants and masters...

I supported her because I wanted that cop to prosecute Trump, and possibly Barr, and put them in jail.

Republicans won't change until they have to suffer consequences for their criminal behavior.

[kidfresh512]

Isn't Buttigieg one of the more conservative people running?

I think part of his "cultivation" as a Democratic candidate would be getting exposure to the concerns of minority voters. Not just face time at a black church for a vote. It is currently one of his largest weaknesses. What concerns do those communities have that you aren't really addressing yet in your platform to appeal and earn their votes over others?

Things like that getting more of an education and a larger sample of issues and concerns than he would have had to deal with as Mayor Pete.

Maybe that will open him up and change his views and be more useful as a candidate to a larger section of the Democratic electorate.

[BeastieRunner]

Many people find Bernie unlikable.

Paying for his policies even more so -- especially with mainstream voters.

Again -- nearly all of these criticisms are subjective.

I have yet to hear an objective reason why Sanders supporters think the majority of voters will support paying higher taxes as he intends.

I'm not a Bernie Bro or a Bernie Basher but ...

Some of his policies (like most of his healthcare plan) are not about paying for it with higher taxes but taking the current tax structure and reallocating breakdowns to pay for needed objectives.

But some of his plans (like schooling) are about raising taxes.

As an aside, I think Val Demings has bright future for the dems. Same with Zoe Lofgren and Sylvia Garcia.

[aja_christopher]

I'm not a Bernie Bro or a Bernie Basher but ...

Some of his policies (like most of his healthcare plan) are not about paying for it with higher taxes but taking the current tax structure and reallocating breakdowns to pay for needed objectives.

But some of his plans (like schooling) are about raising taxes.

Maybe if I had more clarity on the plan, I might understand it better, but from what I've seen he hasn't even clarified how to pay for it himself.

And that's only one aspect of his policies -- how will the others be paid for? How will he get Republicans to agree to raise/reallocate taxes?

I don't say this to attack Sanders -- I say this because these are key issues that will have to be addressed if he wins the nomination.

With regards to the future of the party -- and candidates like AOC -- I can see that generation taking us in a new direction if only by virtue of demographics, but I don't think we are there yet.

Admittedly, the next election could prove me wrong, but I'll have to see it to believe it.

------
"The Sanders plan goes into great detail about the type of coverage Americans would receive. But it provides significantly less detail about how it would finance such a generous health care system. Instead, Sanders released a five-page paper that included a list of financing options, such as a new tax on “extreme wealth.”

Americans’ taxes would have to change to pay for this kind of proposal. But it’s impossible to tell who would pay significantly more for their coverage and who would pay less, and by how much. This is a crucial part of any health care plan, and in the Sanders proposal, it is notably absent.

So while the plan would move the American uninsured rate from around 8.8 percent to, in theory, nearly zero, it’s impossible to tell what it would take to get there and what the bigger economic picture would look like if we did."

https://www.vox.com/2019/4/10/183044...dicare-for-all