All purpose news and politics thread part v: The quickening

[Michael Watkins]

I dismiss nonsense conspiracy theories rooted in silliness like videos about 'coin flips' for an individual delegate, and an untested app crashing. There's nothing substantial there so far. I'm definitely going to dismiss preemptive BS about it from the same crowd who declared it was 'rigged' last time around.

Hillary's loss is a /bit/ of a different animal, rooted in things we actually know happened rather than speculation

yes. we know that the shady stuff that she was up to was revealed by wiki leaks. and we know that she was dismissive to the black woman who called her out on her super predators comment. and we know that her ground game was weak; something confirmed by her husband. what an awful candidate.

[kidfresh512]

Imagine Dragons frontman to talk LGBTQ advocacy with Democrats

The House Democratic Caucus on Wednesday will host Dan Reynolds, the lead vocalist of the Grammy award-winning band Imagine Dragons, to discuss his advocacy work for LGBTQ youth in his home state of Utah, according to people familiar with the planning.Reynolds, who belongs to the Mormon Church, created the LoveLoud Foundation in 2017 to help raise awareness of struggles faced by the LGBTQ community, including higher rates of suicide, particularly in socially conservative strongholds like Utah.


Later on Wednesday, the House Equality Caucus will hold an event on Capitol Hill with Reynolds and Carmen Carrera, a one-time contestant on RuPaul’s Drag Race, to discuss gay conversion therapy policy.

Reynolds is straight and married to a woman. But he has said he took on LGBTQ issues in part because of the inherent conflicts with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which has a history of anti-gay stances and still opposes same-sex marriage.

“I have family and friends I grew up with who are LGBTQ and Mormon or religious,” Reynolds told People Magazine in 2019. “I watched their constant struggle. They were told to change something about them that is unchangeable.”

Since then, Reynolds has taken to global stages like the Billboard Music Awards to condemn policies like gay conversion therapy. He also organizes an annual concert, LoveLoud Festival, to raise money for local and national LGBTQ groups — which has won an endorsement from the Mormon Church.

This the day after Rush fucking Limbaugh gets a Presidential Medal of Freedom is something to smile about at least.

[Michael Watkins]

You act like fear and hatred of trump is a bad thing? He is a terrible person, a terrible president, a horrible role model and an embarrassment. Using his character traits to raise funds to beat him and help other Democrats get in positions to vote against his horrible policies is bad now?

of course not. my issue is them turning those tactics against progressives and, generally, equating the two.

The entire primary process is designed to "stop the momentum" of the candidate that is not yourself. That's what an election is.

you can't be serious. the primary process is about advertising yourself to potential voters and spurring them to vote for you. you know what isn't a part of that process? burying the results so that the winner can't benefit from them.

Yes it is unrealistic to think that they would rather keep Trump in power than to have the Democrat the people who vote choose at the end of the Primary get in the White House.

the ultimate goal of the democratic establishment is to determine the winner of the democratic primary so they can turn their attention to their republican opponent. but they are incompetents and it's more difficult to hide things in the information age. they've taken a calculated risk that slowing Sanders momentum will at least provide someone like Pete 'Wine Cave' Buttigeg to gain the lead or, at least, weaken Sanders. i'm sure that they would settle for someone like Mike Bloomberg or Amy Klobuchar as well. the media pretended that Biden was the clear choice through the scandal with his son and the numerous gaffes. they did so because he suited their needs. but he was only one of their choices. i'm sure that they would have accepted Kamala Harris as well. Warren backed off of medicare for all to better fit their model of a candidate. but this type of democrat is being rejected by voters. this is something that the establishment isn't accustomed to. they don't want a Trump on their hands; a democrat that they can't control. so they are acting out of desperation now. that's why the Iowa debacle seems so chaotic. they didn't expect Bernie to do as well as he has. i have every right to be skeptical of the process.

[Billy Batson]

of course not. my issue is them turning those tactics against progressives and, generally, equating the two.



you can't be serious. the primary process is about advertising yourself to potential voters and spurring them to vote for you. you know what isn't a part of that process? burying the results so that the winner can't benefit from them.



the ultimate goal of the democratic establishment is to determine the winner of the democratic primary so they can turn their attention to their republican opponent. but they are incompetents and it's more difficult to hide things in the information age. they've taken a calculated risk that slowing Sanders momentum will at least provide someone like Pete 'Wine Cave' Buttigeg to gain the lead or, at least, weaken Sanders. i'm sure that they would settle for someone like Mike Bloomberg or Amy Klobuchar as well. the media pretended that Biden was the clear choice through the scandal with his son and the numerous gaffes. they did so because he suited their needs. but he was only one of their choices. i'm sure that they would have accepted Kamala Harris as well. Warren backed off of medicare for all to better fit their model of a candidate. but this type of democrat is being rejected by voters. this is something that the establishment isn't accustomed to. they don't want a Trump on their hands; a democrat that they can't control. so they are acting out of desperation now. that's why the Iowa debacle seems so chaotic. they didn't expect Bernie to do as well as he has. i have every right to be skeptical of the process.

Basically what you've just said

[kidfresh512]

of course not. my issue is them turning those tactics against progressives and, generally, equating the two.



you can't be serious. the primary process is about advertising yourself to potential voters and spurring them to vote for you. you know what isn't a part of that process? burying the results so that the winner can't benefit from them.



the ultimate goal of the democratic establishment is to determine the winner of the democratic primary so they can turn their attention to their republican opponent. but they are incompetents and it's more difficult to hide things in the information age. they've taken a calculated risk that slowing Sanders momentum will at least provide someone like Pete 'Wine Cave' Buttigeg to gain the lead or, at least, weaken Sanders. i'm sure that they would settle for someone like Mike Bloomberg or Amy Klobuchar as well. the media pretended that Biden was the clear choice through the scandal with his son and the numerous gaffes. they did so because he suited their needs. but he was only one of their choices. i'm sure that they would have accepted Kamala Harris as well. Warren backed off of medicare for all to better fit their model of a candidate. but this type of democrat is being rejected by voters. this is something that the establishment isn't accustomed to. they don't want a Trump on their hands; a democrat that they can't control. so they are acting out of desperation now. that's why the Iowa debacle seems so chaotic. they didn't expect Bernie to do as well as he has. i have every right to be skeptical of the process.

What results were buried?

The media pretended Biden was the clear choice? What are you talking about? There are these things called polls. And they have results. You can argue the validity of polls and their usefulness and methodology of course. But, its better than using "feeling" to gauge the popularity of a candidate. Biden clearly led the field in polling and was personally targeted in trumps campaign to discredit him which resulted in the Impeachment inquiry SPECIFICALLY because he was seen as the front runner. That's not "the media".

I certainly am not here to tell you what "right" you have to be skeptical.

But, to have a realistic reality based discussion there do need to be more than unsubstantiated conspiracy theories with no evidence provided at all to suggest they are based in reality.

[aja_christopher]

Let's be real here -- these guys just know that once Sanders gets out of the predominately white states that he focused on to help win him the election, he's going to face a real challenge with the voters who are much more representative of the Democratic party as a whole.

Iowa and New Hampshire's votes are no more important than those of any other state -- the only people trying to make an issue of it are those who are afraid their candidate can't win in all of the other states as well.

Arguing doesn't win elections -- voting wins elections.

Yeah, there's a fair argument to be made that "momentum" was slowed, but if your candidate is in first (or second) then build on that and stop complaining.

All this focus on one state just makes it look like you're afraid he can't win the others.

[Zauriel]

Let's be real here -- these guys just know that once Sanders gets out of the predominately white states that he focused on to help win him the election, he's going to face a real challenge with the voters who are much more representative of the Democratic party as a whole.

Iowa and New Hampshire's votes are no more important than those of any other state -- the only people trying to make an issue of it are those who are afraid their candidate can't win in all of the other states as well.

All this focus on one state just makes it look like you're afraid he can't win the others.

Then why do the losing candidates drop out of the race after finishing last in Iowa or New Hampshire primary?

[aja_christopher]

Then why do the losing candidates drop out of the race after finishing last in Iowa or New Hampshire primary?

I don't know of any candidate that's dropping out of the race based on Iowa.

I've already said before that I don't like arguing hypotheticals -- the facts in this situation seem to bear out that either Sanders or Buttigieg won or finished second respectively, so good on both of them for their success.

Let's just go with those facts and move on to the next states in the primary instead of just blindly speculating about why an app didn't work.

[Zauriel]

I don't know of any candidate that's dropping out of the race based on Iowa.

I've already said before that I don't like arguing hypotheticals -- the facts in this situation seem to bear out that either Sanders or Buttigieg won or finished second respectively, so good on both of them for their success.

Let's just go with those facts and move on to the next states in the primary instead of just blindly speculating about why an app didn't work.

Martin O'Malley suspended his campaign after finishing third in the Iowa caucuses during the 2016 Presidential Election primaries.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin...ntial_campaign


Bill Richardson withdrew from the race on January 10, 2008 after only placing fourth in the Iowa and New Hampshire primaries

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_R...ntial_campaign


Joe Biden ultimately dropped out of the race on January 3, 2008, after coming in fifth place and capturing less than 1% of the vote in the Iowa caucus.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Bi...ntial_campaign


Chris Dodd ended his campaign on January 3, 2008 after a sixth-place finish in the Iowa caucuses.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_...ntial_campaign



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_D...tial_primaries

[aja_christopher]

Martin O'Malley suspended his campaign after finishing third in the Iowa caucuses during the 2016 Presidential Election primaries.

I was referring to this election cycle since that's the one we're in.

What someone else did in another election doesn't necessarily equate to what another candidate does in this one.

It's a hypothetical argument that I'm not going to bother with -- people can always find excuses for why their candidate lost if they don't win an election.

Even when they lose by millions of votes.

[Otto Gruenwald]

Did Sanders win Iowa?

[aja_christopher]

Did Sanders win Iowa?

"The Iowa Democratic Party released the majority of the results from the Iowa caucuses on Tuesday, showing Pete Buttigieg with a narrow lead over Bernie Sanders in state delegates but Sanders with a slight edge in the popular vote. No winner has been announced, but the state party has provided results from 71% of precincts from all 99 counties.

In the reported precincts, Buttigieg won 26.8% of the delegate share and Sanders 25.2%. Elizabeth Warren came in third with 18.4% and Joe Biden fourth with 15.5%. Amy Klobuchar had 12.6%, Andrew Yang 1.1% and Tom Steyer 0.3%."

https://www.cbsnews.com/******update...ay-2020-02-04/

[shooshoomanjoe]

"The Iowa Democratic Party released the majority of the results from the Iowa caucuses on Tuesday, showing Pete Buttigieg with a narrow lead over Bernie Sanders in state delegates but Sanders with a slight edge in the popular vote. No winner has been announced, but the state party has provided results from 71% of precincts from all 99 counties.

In the reported precincts, Buttigieg won 26.8% of the delegate share and Sanders 25.2%. Elizabeth Warren came in third with 18.4% and Joe Biden fourth with 15.5%. Amy Klobuchar had 12.6%, Andrew Yang 1.1% and Tom Steyer 0.3%."

https://www.cbsnews.com/******update...ay-2020-02-04/

Why does this forum not accept the word 'live' on links?

[aja_christopher]

I'm not necessarily big on polls, but hopefully this one is a reminder of what the real focus should be going into the general election.

This is also why I'm not against Sanders -- so long as he can maintain his momentum and prove that he's the best candidate to both unite Democrats and beat Trump in the election.

------
"NEW POLL SHOWS EVERY DEMOCRATIC FRONTRUNNER BEATING DONALD TRUMP IN 2020 ELECTION"

"New poll results from Morning Consult released Monday showed all five of the leading contenders for the Democratic presidential nomination defeating President Donald Trump in hypothetical match-ups.

Mike Bloomberg, an entrepreneur and the former mayor of New York City, had the greatest lead over Trump. Forty-seven percent of respondents said they would vote for him if he were nominated to run against Trump, while 40 percent said they would vote for Trump and 13 percent were undecided.

Former Vice President Joe Biden came in second with 46 percent of respondents saying they would support him in the theoretical race. Forty-two percent said they would instead cast their ballot with Trump, while 12 percent were undecided.

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders tied with Biden—46 percent of registered voters said they would vote for him if he were to face off against Trump, while 42 percent would support Trump in is re-election and 12 percent said they were not sure.

Forty-three percent of registered voters said they would vote for Sen. Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts if she were chosen as the Democratic nominee. Again, 42 percent said that they would instead vote for Trump. In this case, 15 percent were undecided.

Former South Bend, Indiana, mayor Pete Buttigieg came in last with 42 percent of support from surveyed voters, while 41 percent said they would vote for Trump and 17 percent were undecided.

The latest results from Morning Consult were based on 35,888 surveys among registerd voters between January 27 and February 2, according to the report. All results from the hypothetical election match-ups have a margin of error of plus or minus one percentage point."

https://www.newsweek.com/new-poll-sh...ection-1485852

[Malvolio]

With 29% of the vote still yet to be tallied and Buttigieg ahead by less than 2%, his declaring victory could turn out to be his "Howard Dean Scream."