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  1. #46
    Mighty Member Koriand'r's Avatar
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    Forty-six posts on this thread and half of them are us going back and forth. I feel some things are lost by not having Diana Prince, you think some things are gained. It's always going to be that way, let's just agree to disagree.

  2. #47
    Incredible Member franckd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    Pretty much this.

    I'm still in favor of having the 'Diana Prince' identity in the event of Diana just needing a way to blend in without drawing too much attention to herself - either to go undercover or just to relax. It could also be her way of exploring life as an ordinary woman in 'Man's World' - the way some people believe Superman uses 'Clark Kent' to explore living a human life.

    But no, I don't think 'Diana Prince' is fundamental to the Wonder Woman mythos the way Bruce Wayne or Clark Kent are to Batman and Superman respectively.
    That one of the point of the unaired TV pilot. It's not a mean comment from me : I'm in the minority here, but I liked the pilot. It wasn't perfect, but I enjoyed it. Maybe because the last time I read Wonder Woman was decades ago. So I didn't have huge expectations. Anyway, that's the point of my message : I'd like to go back to WW (not World War but... Well you know who) but I just want to read good stories. Can fans advice me some trades, if possible ? Thanks.

  3. #48
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    I think Wonder Woman having a secret identity would help her blend in with the average crowd and have her associate with humanity more. Sort of what was explained in Infinite Crisis to Diana for all her amazing feats she has forgotten how to be human and truly connect with humanity.

  4. #49
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cmbmool View Post
    I think Wonder Woman having a secret identity would help her blend in with the average crowd and have her associate with humanity more. Sort of what was explained in Infinite Crisis to Diana for all her amazing feats she has forgotten how to be human and truly connect with humanity.
    But the thing is unlike Bats or Supes who are out to mostly preserve the status quo with the occasional change here and there, Diana’s mission is to radically change up the way Man’s World works. Her job is less to blend in than it is to stand out. I’m not sure that having her get invested in the status quo is the best idea for her character. And of course Diana is a princess. She’s always been special, above the rest in a way that not even Batman is.

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    On the one hand, the secret ID won't apply to WW the way it applies to Batman and Superman because she arrived in the US/man's world when she was already an adult and didn't have a pre-established ID/persona before becoming a superhero. There's no obvious practical need to have one, like Batman uses (steals) Bruce Wayne's resource to help his war on crime, and Superman used to use Clark Kent as a means to learn of emergency situations or retreat from Superhero life. Off the top of my head, I don't know why WW needs to live a double life. I can understand pretending to be an anonymous civilian once in a while, but that's like Batman's Matches Malone persona and not like Golden Age Superman's Clark Kent who seemed like a means to an end.

    On the other hand, when I think about what fans' expectations are, I think a lot of fans don't care about the secret ID largely in part because the comics undermined the need for it for over thirty years now. Not all of us were alive and kicking in 1978, let alone collecting WW comics. I don't know the atmosphere in 1986 when Diana Prince effectively was laid to rest, but I imagine a lot of fans were annoyed that the secret ID was taken away. Likewise, I think some fans whose only real exposure to WW was through the DCEU might have an expectation that WW walks around in civvies with the implication that people either ignore her or assume she's someone other than the world's greatest hero. If the next WW movie spends significant time with Diana out of costume and pretending to be someone other than Wonder Woman of Themyscira, fan expectations might change dramatically.

    Anyway, for me the most important aspect of the Diana Prince secret ID was that other than being a gender-swapped Superman story, it's that in the Lynda Carter show she was powerless. I have no need for the Billy Batson schtick. I guess if I had a preference, I'd say civilian Diana Prince exists and shows up on occasion, not as something like Clark Kent or Bruce Wayne, but more of a Ron Mexico sort of thing (minus the shenanigans ;p ).

    Also, do secret ID's protect people in comics? Probably not, but that's for a variety of reasons not necessarily pertaining to the ineffectiveness of secret ID's. I would point out to MCU's Hawkeye. I'm doing a lot of assuming here, but I imagine that Hawkeye's family lives an otherwise normal life, have normal social lives, people see Clint Barton walking around here and there, and nobody knows or assumes he was this world-hopping superhero. Maybe it's more akin to how Hollywood portrays the life of a spy and less of a "secret ID."

  6. #51
    Mighty Member Koriand'r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    But the thing is unlike Bats or Supes who are out to mostly preserve the status quo with the occasional change here and there, Diana’s mission is to radically change up the way Man’s World works. Her job is less to blend in than it is to stand out. I’m not sure that having her get invested in the status quo is the best idea for her character. And of course Diana is a princess. She’s always been special, above the rest in a way that not even Batman is.
    Which is why she needs an identity to explore how it is to be like everyone else. She could experience the human condition without the advantages of being a princess, ambassador, super-heroine, authority figure. We'd see how her mission could be aided by being a regular person accomplishing goals and becoming a role model.
    Last edited by Koriand'r; 10-28-2019 at 09:52 AM.

  7. #52
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koriand'r View Post
    Which is why she needs an identity to explore how it is to be like everyone else. She could experience the human condition without the advantages of being a princess, ambassador, super-heroine, authority figure. We'd see how her mission could be aided by being a regular person accomplishing goals and becoming a role model.
    Hmmm, like an Amazonian Mork from Ork? Na-Nu Na-Nu.

  8. #53
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Which is why I think Holliday College is a nice place for Diana to go to. She can be a international student. Who is to say instead of being a citizen she is first a international student than a citizen of the US?

    Gateway city is a city which many mythical creatures and humans live. So Diana can see both regular life and the life she is use to. She makes the Holliday Girls and they are the first to learn the Amazon ways.
    Last edited by AmiMizuno; 10-28-2019 at 12:23 PM.

  9. #54
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    Wonder Woman's problem is stability. She keeps being revised, with new cities, new characters, new revisions of established characters, new costume designs. This happened before Crisis, but went into hyperdrive after Crisis. I don't know if a secret indentity solves the problem--but if she's Diana Prince as a matter of course (but not maybe secretly), then she can have a regular life in a city, in an apartment or house, with neighbours, a circle of friends, and a calm existence in between the action adventures. If she doesn't have that then all she has is Paradise Island--if she can actually ever go there--and a company of Amazons that keep getting killed off; or maybe relationships with the U.S. military, although that's questionable in her role as Princess of Peace. A stable civilian life is what she needs to anchor her. That and a longterm editor dedicated to maintaining a steady course for the character.
    🇨🇦

  10. #55
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Bruce and Clarke have cities that match them. So the city should match Diana

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    Wonder Woman's problem is stability. She keeps being revised, with new cities, new characters, new revisions of established characters, new costume designs. This happened before Crisis, but went into hyperdrive after Crisis. I don't know if a secret indentity solves the problem--but if she's Diana Prince as a matter of course (but not maybe secretly), then she can have a regular life in a city, in an apartment or house, with neighbours, a circle of friends, and a calm existence in between the action adventures. If she doesn't have that then all she has is Paradise Island--if she can actually ever go there--and a company of Amazons that keep getting killed off; or maybe relationships with the U.S. military, although that's questionable in her role as Princess of Peace. A stable civilian life is what she needs to anchor her. That and a longterm editor dedicated to maintaining a steady course for the character.
    DC tried to bring back Diana Prince twice. The first was after Infinite Crisis where she was made a DEO agent and the only supporting character of significance was Tom Tressor who was her partner. The second was when she was dating Superman. In both cases, Diana never used the identity to interact with a civilian supporting cast, she was just hanging around her partner in crimefighting in both cases. It is provable that Diana Prince does not equal a stable civilian cast and a break from the action.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    Bruce and Clarke have cities that match them. So the city should match Diana
    You mean it should be like the backgrounds for Russell Myers' BROOM-HILDA, constantly changing from panel to panel?
    🇨🇦

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Luthor View Post
    Expounding on this version: Diana is able to get citizenship because she is believed to be saved by Steve while he was out on a mission. She becomes an Argus agent after getting a degree at Holliday University. She tested into the college since she has no educational background and got some aid from joining ROTC and lived with the Kapatelis' until she graduated. This way she has a secret ID which isn't based completely on a lie and she gets her job as an agent in a legit way. It also makes her more relatable since she has a few years of just being a normal human though she does do a little hero work. She was friends with Priscilla while at Holliday but they drifted apart when she went to grad school and Diana got a job as an agent. This would also explain why Etta is Diana's bf despite being a college student. She could even work part time at taco whiz for a semester.

    I am curious if this would make the secret ID more ok for those that feel like her having one would be a little more dishonest than Bruce or Clark's stories.
    I posted this in another thread and now I am curious if something like this would make those that dont like the secret ID more open to her having one?
    Last edited by Lex Luthor; 10-31-2019 at 09:06 PM.

  14. #59
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    The thing about Diana being a secret agent is that it doesn’t really offer anything different from what she normally does. As a secret agent she would probably be out kicking butt and she already does that as WW, so what’s the benefit to her storytelling wise? Clark as a journalist offers different storytelling opportunities than him being Superman because it allows him to talk to people about topics that he can’t as Superman. Bruce being a billionaire playboy lets him do stuff that as Batman he couldn’t like mingle at parties to get info or try to shake off his female admirers. What does Diana being a secret agent with a secret ID offer her that she can’t do as WW?

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The thing about Diana being a secret agent is that it doesn’t really offer anything different from what she normally does. As a secret agent she would probably be out kicking butt and she already does that as WW, so what’s the benefit to her storytelling wise? Clark as a journalist offers different storytelling opportunities than him being Superman because it allows him to talk to people about topics that he can’t as Superman. Bruce being a billionaire playboy lets him do stuff that as Batman he couldn’t like mingle at parties to get info or try to shake off his female admirers. What does Diana being a secret agent with a secret ID offer her that she can’t do as WW?
    I mean if we are being honest. What has she gotten from being Wonder Woman?

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