So...are the mutants of Krakoa taking mutant children from their families?

[Tycon]

Wouldn't put it past them. It's very clear that the Krakoans are being written as the villains.

No, not really.

[RachelGrey]

Well so far I have not seen any X-men or mutant forcing mutant children to live in Krakoa and I didn't see them separating children from their parents but I have seen human governments doing this for years so until the situation is reversed I am still in favor of Krakoa and of the X-men.

Seriously some will not rest until Krakoa fails and say I warned . The point is that eventually Krakoa will fall this is not the endgame guys.

I understand why some do not like the current situation of the X-men but if you are going to try to prove your point at least use some more solid argument or wait until paradise begins to show their secrets and betrayals to point the finger.

At least for the time being until the situation changes (and will change) the X-men and Krakoa have done nothing so serious that other governments in the world have not done.

When X-men drop a chemical bomb that kills humans or transforms people against their will and let it happen for months before taking action as another group did then you can accuse them .

Some people prefer stories where the mutants are in hiding and are being hunted to death by the humans with no possible escape or succor. Look at the reason Magneto radicalized again in X-Men Black: Magneto, he found out the US government had 100's of secret detention centres where they were rounding up mutants for permanent detention. The whole issue was Magneto taking out 3 of the detention centres and killing the humans who were imprisoning the mutants against their will. At the end Magneto said if they want someone to hate, he'll give them someone to hate. I completely understand his anger and rage, when you see your people, men, women, and children being treated as nothing more than animals and being held against their will, experimented on, abused, and killed, at some point it just drives you to go to war.

The reason there are mutants who are militant is because they have seen humans hurt and experiment on mutants so much that these people are at the point of breaking.

Ororo, Scott, Lorna, and Erik just raided an Orchis facility where over 20 mutant children were being held for experimentation and execution by Orchis.

Kate, Ororo, Bobby, and Pyro just attacked a Russian port where a very large number of mutants were being held in a cage to be shipped somewhere for permanent detention because they were trying to escape persecution and subjugation in Russia. They freed the mutants and helped them get to Krakoa.

At the moment all I have seen from the Krakoan government is missions to rescue their people and to stop the building of a genocidal weapon.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Some people prefer stories where the mutants are in hiding and are being hunted to death by the humans with no possible escape or succor. Look at the reason Magneto radicalized again in X-Men Black: Magneto, he found out the US government had 100's of secret detention centres where they were rounding up mutants for permanent detention. The whole issue was Magneto taking out 3 of the detention centres and killing the humans who were imprisoning the mutants against their will. At the end Magneto said if they want someone to hate, he'll give them someone to hate. I completely understand his anger and rage, when you see your people, men, women, and children being treated as nothing more than animals and being held against their will, experimented on, abused, and killed, at some point it just drives you to go to war.

The reason there are mutants who are militant is because they have seen humans hurt and experiment on mutants so much that these people are at the point of breaking.

Ororo, Scott, Lorna, and Erik just raided an Orchis facility where over 20 mutant children were being held for experimentation and execution by Orchis.

Kate, Ororo, Bobby, and Pyro just attacked a Russian port where a very large number of mutants were being held in a cage to be shipped somewhere for permanent detention because they were trying to escape persecution and subjugation in Russia. They freed the mutants and helped them get to Krakoa.

At the moment all I have seen from the Krakoan government is missions to rescue their people and to stop the building of a genocidal weapon.

And just because people prefer it does not mean that should be the status quo; I mean isn't that what Hickman's trying to do? Shift that so that they aren't in hiding?

I'm not going to argue that destroying the Orchis facility and punishing everyone involved was wrong; that wasn't villainous. It wasn't, when you're fighting for your rights that's part of it--it's the broader strokes of anti-humanity most characters seem to speak with now that people are questioning. Characters like the Guthrie parents, who have been as pro-mutant as anyone can ever be; why should it be that those families have to consider breaking-up or completely uprooting themselves?

[cranger]

Some people prefer stories where the mutants are in hiding and are being hunted to death by the humans with no possible escape or succor.

I bolded that part because I do not think anyone prefers that story because then the X-Men would be dead and we would not be reading X-Men. I also question whether people actually prefer that kind of story not bolded. My impression is that most people have been sick of the extinction angle for a long time.

However, that is actually the story Hickman is telling. They are hiding on an island. They will be hunted to death. Extinction is the threat in this era.

[Digifiend]

Operation: Molly Hayes Hijack is a go!

Solicits show she just took on a new name: Blue-J.

[Vegan Daddy]

Most of the X-forums are either paranoid or horny.

Most of the time I’m both.

[Tycon]

Operation: Molly Hayes Hijack is a go!

Solicits show she just took on a new name: Blue-J.

Operation: Steal Blue-J from the Nest is a go!

[RachelGrey]

And just because people prefer it does not mean that should be the status quo; I mean isn't that what Hickman's trying to do? Shift that so that they aren't in hiding?

I'm not going to argue that destroying the Orchis facility and punishing everyone involved was wrong; that wasn't villainous. It wasn't, when you're fighting for your rights that's part of it--it's the broader strokes of anti-humanity most characters seem to speak with now that people are questioning. Characters like the Guthrie parents, who have been as pro-mutant as anyone can ever be; why should it be that those families have to consider breaking-up or completely uprooting themselves?

We actually don't have confirmation that a human can't stay on Krakoa. We do know a human can't go through the portals unless allowed to do so by an attending mutant and Krakoa itself. Perhaps the sentient mutant island isn't entirely safe for humans because it only acknowledges a connection to other mutants. It's possible that humans get sick if they stay on the island too much. We honestly don't know.

But with the huge number of Krakoan portals, I am pretty sure any mutant who wants to visit their human family can easily go do so whenever they want to.

There is a reason that the mutants use Krakoa as a home, it's probably the only place on Earth that humans cannot take from them because you have to have permission from the sentient mutant island to live on it.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

We actually don't have confirmation that a human can't stay on Krakoa. We do know a human can't go through the portals unless allowed to do so by an attending mutant and Krakoa itself. Perhaps the sentient mutant island isn't entirely safe for humans because it only acknowledges a connection to other mutants. It's possible that humans get sick if they stay on the island too much. We honestly don't know.

But with the huge number of Krakoan portals, I am pretty sure any mutant who wants to visit their human family can easily go do so whenever they want to.

There is a reason that the mutants use Krakoa as a home, it's probably the only place on Earth that humans cannot take from them because you have to have permission from the sentient mutant island to live on it.

We don't have confirmation for that either, though, as you say; it's all conjecture.

I've no doubt that they can visit whenever they want, but some families might just want to stay together. Like, not every kid wants to be shipped off to a boarding school; if there's a means for them to stay closer to parents that they love and who love them in return, surely they have the right to ask about that? To want that, even?

[RachelGrey]

I bolded that part because I do not think anyone prefers that story because then the X-Men would be dead and we would not be reading X-Men. I also question whether people actually prefer that kind of story not bolded. My impression is that most people have been sick of the extinction angle for a long time.

However, that is actually the story Hickman is telling. They are hiding on an island. They will be hunted to death. Extinction is the threat in this era.

It has been for years.

This is what I mean, in order to have the mutants living among the humans you have to change the humans in the story. You have to have the American government rescind the Mutant Registration Act. You have to have the human government change the running of the O.N.E. and have it run equally by members from the mutant community and humans so that the focus of the O.N.E. is to detain only mutants who commit crimes, but otherwise just help young mutants with their powers, and de-escalate conflicts between humans and mutants.

The governments of the Marvel Universe would have to actively be trying to find a way to sit at the table with mutants and try to make peace with each other.

I like Krakoa because I think they have the right idea here, they are using economic power to get the humans to sit at the table and talk. Now we are all talking, you are letting any mutants who want to leave to go peacefully to Krakoa, you aren't detaining mutants anymore, and you allowed Krakoa to have status as a member nation of the United Nations. So far so good.

So finally mutants have achieved goal #1, convince the humans to sit at the table and talk and negotiate peace and economic treaties. From this starting point we can move toward real peace and acceptance, but at least we have a break in hostilities for a bit.

Krakoa has also taken steps to reign in the mutant villains, to contain them, and monitor them. I guarantee that X-Force has the duel purpose of investigating crimes against mutants, but also to investigate mutants who are committing crimes against humans. Because right now the nation of Krakoa wants peace treaties, they don't want to go to war with anyone.

[RachelGrey]

We don't have confirmation for that either, though, as you say; it's all conjecture.

I've no doubt that they can visit whenever they want, but some families might just want to stay together. Like, not every kid wants to be shipped off to a boarding school; if there's a means for them to stay closer to parents that they love and who love them in return, surely they have the right to ask about that? To want that, even?

It depends if the local government will allow it. Does the US government allow mutants to remain in the United States, or does it enforce that all mutants should be deported to Krakoa upon detection. It may not be the Krakoan government that is forcibly separating families, the treaty human governments may actually be forcibly deporting anyone who is detected as a mutant and making them go through the portal to Krakoa.

I think we will find out that Wakanda isn't persecuting mutants and they may not even be stopping mutants from going to Krakoa or coming back to visit, they just have no need for Krakoan medicines, but they may mostly be neutral to Krakoa as a country because mutants are already protected with equal rights inside of Wakanda. I am making a presumption here, and I guess we'll see if the X-Men and the Agents of Wakanda cross paths at some point.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

It has been for years.

This is what I mean, in order to have the mutants living among the humans you have to change the humans in the story. You have to have the American government rescind the Mutant Registration Act. You have to have the human government change the running of the O.N.E. and have it run equally by members from the mutant community and humans so that the focus of the O.N.E. is to detain only mutants who commit crimes, but otherwise just help young mutants with their powers, and de-escalate conflicts between humans and mutants.

The governments of the Marvel Universe would have to actively be trying to find a way to sit at the table with mutants and try to make peace with each other.

I like Krakoa because I think they have the right idea here, they are using economic power to get the humans to sit at the table and talk. Now we are all talking, you are letting any mutants who want to leave to go peacefully to Krakoa, you aren't detaining mutants anymore, and you allowed Krakoa to have status as a member nation of the United Nations. So far so good.

So finally mutants have achieved goal #1, convince the humans to sit at the table and talk and negotiate peace and economic treaties. From this starting point we can move toward real peace and acceptance, but at least we have a break in hostilities for a bit.

Krakoa has also taken steps to reign in the mutant villains, to contain them, and monitor them. I guarantee that X-Force has the duel purpose of investigating crimes against mutants, but also to investigate mutants who are committing crimes against humans. Because right now the nation of Krakoa wants peace treaties, they don't want to go to war with anyone.

And again; why shouldn't we change the humans in the story? Wouldn't that show growth? Progress on the mutant front, even? Even just setting up a distinction between GOVERNMENT wants and COMMUNITY wants. We're going around in circles on this one.

And I'm not saying Krakoa isn't a step in the right direction, I'm not even saying it's wrong! It's exactly what's needed! But I don't think that co-habitation beyond Krakoa should be shoved off the table and decried as impossible.

[RachelGrey]

And again; why shouldn't we change the humans in the story? Wouldn't that show growth? Progress on the mutant front, even? Even just setting up a distinction between GOVERNMENT wants and COMMUNITY wants. We're going around in circles on this one.

And I'm not saying Krakoa isn't a step in the right direction, I'm not even saying it's wrong! It's exactly what's needed! But I don't think that co-habitation beyond Krakoa should be shoved off the table and decried as impossible.

It's only impossible if the human governments make it impossible. Currently we don't know the full status quo of off Krakoa mutants yet. Are the economic and peace treaties enough to get treaty countries to treat mutants better? We don't know yet.

It's very possible that treaty countries are using this opportunity to round up and forcibly deport all mutants in their country to Krakoa. It's hard to know what the current state is until we see it.

We'll probably find out soon what the state of mutants in the United States is, it's obvious some of the New Mutants are going to go and check in on mutants who choose to stay in their home countries to make sure everything is ok, as well as give them a pitch about coming to Krakoa.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

It's only impossible if the human governments make it impossible. Currently we don't know the full status quo of off Krakoa mutants yet. Are the economic and peace treaties enough to get treaty countries to treat mutants better? We don't know yet.

It's very possible that treaty countries are using this opportunity to round up and forcibly deport all mutants in their country to Krakoa. It's hard to know what the current state is until we see it.

We'll probably find out soon what the state of mutants in the United States is, it's obvious some of the New Mutants are going to go and check in on mutants who choose to stay in their home countries to make sure everything is ok, as well as give them a pitch about coming to Krakoa.

On the forced deportation: by the looks of things though, that seems to be the exact opposite where Marauders is concerned? At least in part. Like I'm not saying those bastards are lobbying for any kind of equality (more like looking for expendable cannon-fodder) but it's not the case in, at least, Russia.

[RachelGrey]

On the forced deportation: by the looks of things though, that seems to be the exact opposite where Marauders is concerned? At least in part. Like I'm not saying those bastards are lobbying for any kind of equality (more like looking for expendable cannon-fodder) but it's not the case in, at least, Russia.

True, but Russia is a non treaty country. They kind of treat their mutants like the original Genosha did, mutants are to be used as assets of the government.

I was wondering if the United States is force deporting mutants to Krakoa now that they have a peace treaty with them, or are they just giving people the option to stay or go. Is the general day to day life of mutants in the United States getting better now that Krakoa has negotiated their peace and economic treaty? Or is the oppression worse than before?

I will be curious to see what the state of mutants in treaty countries is like. We do know that in Taipei in Taiwan that that woman is really trying to stir up the anti-mutant and anti-Krakoa hate hard core. So the racists are still out in force, and they are obviously protesting the peace treaty with Krakoa that China and Taiwan appear to have both signed.