Page 3 of 41 FirstFirst 123456713 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 607
  1. #31
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Right. It was MLK's dream, rooted in his faith. He talked it and walked it and died for it. Xavier certainly has put himself out there in defense of it too. Not sure who is forcing anyone to dream without skin in the game...but it IS interesting to me both in the comics and in real life who chooses to buy in, who walks away, and where the risk tolerance threshold is for different people.

  2. #32
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    2,345

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JTFSXX View Post
    Right. It was MLK's dream, rooted in his faith. He talked it and walked it and died for it. Xavier certainly has put himself out there in defense of it too. Not sure who is forcing anyone to dream without skin in the game...but it IS interesting to me both in the comics and in real life who chooses to buy in, who walks away, and where the risk tolerance threshold is for different people.
    Walking away from what exactly? Dying a lot after doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result?

  3. #33
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by powerpax View Post
    Be very careful with that parallel when you talk about how 'pragmatic' people should be when dealing with murderous white supremacists. Thanks.
    Yes, you are correct, if one were to use the word pragmatic to mean anything other than effective.

  4. #34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JTFSXX View Post
    Right. It was MLK's dream, rooted in his faith. He talked it and walked it and died for it. Xavier certainly has put himself out there in defense of it too. Not sure who is forcing anyone to dream without skin in the game...but it IS interesting to me both in the comics and in real life who chooses to buy in, who walks away, and where the risk tolerance threshold is for different people.
    It always amazes me too. Especially when it's the voices of those who say All lives Matter but don't actually stand up or get out for All lives. Or those who aren't targetted by the police telling those who are to respect the cops while actually offering nothing else but a "it's not everybody." I actually have respect for women like Heather Heyer who put her money where her mouth was. I don't really have much for people who drone direct what should be right but can say so since it comes at no cost to them. But yet somehow they always have a voice.

    Those people don't even have to walk away they just turn their backs.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.
    Number of People on my ignore list: 0
    #conceptualthinking ^_^
    #ByeMarvEN

    Into the breach.
    https://www.instagram.com/jartist27/

  5. #35
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by powerpax View Post
    Walking away from what exactly? Dying a lot after doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result?

    Why do you assume that walking away is necessarily a bad thing? Sometimes one must walk away, at least for a time, for exactly the reasons you mention.

  6. #36
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    It always amazes me too. Especially when it's the voices of those who say All lives Matter but don't actually stand up or get out for All lives. Or those who aren't targetted by the police telling those who are to respect the cops while actually offering nothing else but a "it's not everybody." I actually have respect for women like Heather Heyer who put her money where her mouth was. I don't really have much for people who drone direct what should be right but can say so since it comes at no cost to them. But yet somehow they always have a voice.

    Those people don't even have to walk away they just turn their backs.
    That is very well said.

  7. #37
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    Xavier had easy dreams of utopian ideals when he was a white millionaire with no visible mutations. Magneto had easy talk about superiority and direct violence when he had the power of a god.

    None of them offered solutions for the mutant Average Joe.
    Very good observation. That's really what draws me to this story...with both of these approaches discredited, what are the other possible responses? How will they play out. Keeps me reading.

  8. #38
    Extraordinary Member Glio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Posts
    6,187

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JTFSXX View Post
    Very good observation. That's really what draws me to this story...with both of these approaches discredited, what are the other possible responses? How will they play out. Keeps me reading.
    Some characters like Cyclops in Utopia and now Krakoa seem to offer an intermediate path.

  9. #39
    Amazing Member JTFSXX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Covington, KY
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    Some characters like Cyclops in Utopia and now Krakoa seem to offer an intermediate path.
    Yes! I think that this is why I am drawn to Cyclops as a character...he seems to be the embodiment of this struggle to stay connected to the original vision but deeply aware of its limitations in the real world.

  10. #40
    Astonishing Member Frobisher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    4,270

    Default

    There have been so many arcs called stuff like Dream’s End, Death Of The Dream and so on - maybe it finally took this time.

  11. #41
    Astonishing Member Zelena's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    4,523

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    Xavier had easy dreams of utopian ideals when he was a white millionaire with no visible mutations. Magneto had easy talk about superiority and direct violence when he had the power of a god.

    None of them offered solutions for the mutant Average Joe.
    And, during years, it was the crux of the problem: Xavier experimented coexistence because no one has any idea he was a mutant unless he showed it. His difference was internalized while others's was open to all. What he felt, he wanted that every mutant will able to feel, integrated in the population. That dream seems impossible to reach… but what is the alternative? It's all about politics to find ways to cooexist, it may less pure than in the ideal but possible if both parties receive pledges of good will.
    “Strength is the lot of but a few privileged men; but austere perseverance, harsh and continuous, may be employed by the smallest of us and rarely fails of its purpose, for its silent power grows irresistibly greater with time.” Goethe

  12. #42
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    1,423

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tycon View Post
    Martin Luther King Jr regretted his dream a few years later because it was too naively optimistic and not grounded in reality.
    Citation please.

  13. #43

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FUBAR007 View Post
    Citation please.
    We are MUTANT..Krakoa, FOREVER!!! “Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité”

  14. #44

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    And, during years, it was the crux of the problem: Xavier experimented coexistence because no one has any idea he was a mutant unless he showed it. His difference was internalized while others's was open to all. What he felt, he wanted that every mutant will able to feel, integrated in the population. That dream seems impossible to reach… but what is the alternative? It's all about politics to find ways to cooexist, it may less pure than in the ideal but possible if both parties receive pledges of good will.
    I also remember when Xavier went on TV and told the world he was a mutant (just before he left for space). He ended up putting a big giant target on the Xavier Institute which led to mass protests around the Institute. I remember Jean was trying to decide what to do with the protesters outside the gates because they were getting violent. Emma came up and said, we are telepaths, this is easy, and she made everyone have an orgasm and pee themselves and then walked back inside the mansion. I can't remember which group it was that attacked the mansion a few weeks after that, but it got Jean so angry because they were being so violent and cruel that she started to flare up with the full Phoenix Force around that time and she took them all out at once.
    We are MUTANT..Krakoa, FOREVER!!! “Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité”

  15. #45
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    1,423

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RachelGrey View Post
    MLK isn't repudiating his dream and calling for black separatism. He's saying it's harder than he thought it would be, that the Vietnam War is making it even harder than it would be otherwise, and then he closes with a call for non-violence.

    Xavier has explicitly renounced integration in favor of separatism and nationalism.

    The allegory doesn't hold.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •