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  1. #76
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    We should stop changing characters race and sexuality. Why not make another character who was trans and not a established character. Unless it’s outside the main cannon

  2. #77
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WonderScott View Post
    (If I'm honest, I'd rather see some thing like this interestingly and thoughtfully play out with the Green Lanterns and Zamorans and their leaders, considering the longstanding setup of the Guardians and Zamarons for decades. I don't think I've ever read a story about Men are from Mars and Women are from Venus with them that tackled that idea, unpacked it, dismantled it, broke it apart, and came to an interesting, let alone warranted, conclusion about some strict men vs women construct.)
    Kyle Rayner's tenure as GL saw the writers poke at it, even if they didn't address it in depth. At the end of the original Parallax story, Hal Jordan killed all of the Guardians but Ganthet. Kyle eventually became Ion but gave up the god-like powers it came with in order to bring the Guardians back. But Kyle apparently didn't understand why all the Guardians were male, and arbitrarily made half of them female. that went..... not well.

  3. #78
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Hunter and Steve are important for a bridge but there is also a question. Should the Amazons like in some runs open their Island to the outside world?

  4. #79
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    Hunter and Steve are important for a bridge but there is also a question. Should the Amazons like in some runs open their Island to the outside world?
    Possibly, if the story calls for it. But not to men.
    ęSpeaking generally, it is because of the desire of the tragic poets for the marvellous that so varied and inconsistent an account of Medea has been given outĽ (Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History [4.56.1])

  5. #80
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    One of the main reasons for no men is due to their sexual and physical abuse. If the Amazons were to make a system where it can kick out terrible people would that help? I mean Amazons by now would see even women can be evil. Honestly has of now Steve would be okay on the island for a few things. Not all the time.

  6. #81
    Astonishing Member WonderScott's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Kyle Rayner's tenure as GL saw the writers poke at it, even if they didn't address it in depth. At the end of the original Parallax story, Hal Jordan killed all of the Guardians but Ganthet. Kyle eventually became Ion but gave up the god-like powers it came with in order to bring the Guardians back. But Kyle apparently didn't understand why all the Guardians were male, and arbitrarily made half of them female. that went..... not well.
    Yeah, I remember this... To me, it wasn't a well thought out or interesting use of the characters in a meaningful way. That fell kinda flat... to me.

  7. #82
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WonderScott View Post
    Yeah, I remember this... To me, it wasn't a well thought out or interesting use of the characters in a meaningful way. That fell kinda flat... to me.
    I thought it was... I guess the best way to put it is "meaningfully flat". IE the lack of exciting stuff is part of why the story makes sense. IE, the Guardians didn't have a good reason for the gender divide. Their quarrel with the Zamarons was stupid. But.... that raises the question of why/how the split occurred in the first place... which in fairness never made sense at all.

  8. #83
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    So I'm curious would it be fine if Superman or Batman to come on the Island? I feel a way around this is that they have to get an amazons blessing. That thanks to Steve and the JL the Amazons for special reasons will allow men on the Island. I feel that maybe the best way is the Amazons are willing to chnage. However, they still have their duties. Maybe one reason is Ares ties to get men to be terrible? That in order to truly move fowarded the Amazons have to heal from their past?

  9. #84
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    So I'm curious would it be fine if Superman or Batman to come on the Island? I feel a way around this is that they have to get an amazons blessing. That thanks to Steve and the JL the Amazons for special reasons will allow men on the Island. I feel that maybe the best way is the Amazons are willing to chnage. However, they still have their duties. Maybe one reason is Ares ties to get men to be terrible? That in order to truly move fowarded the Amazons have to heal from their past?
    I think it should be fine if Batman and Superman come to the Island but it's not the amazons who allow them to come. It wasn't them who allowed Steve to come either, it was the greek gods. So if they come to the Island, the greek gods have to let them in. So Steve can still come since he was already granted passage, but no other men can yet (except Jason, but being the son of Zeus help). If a story would be written about that, would it be a wonder woman story, a batman (or superman, action comic or detective comic) story or a justice league story ?

    As you said, the best way is the amazon to be willing to change but instead of men coming to the island, it's easier for them to leave.

  10. #85
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manakel View Post
    I think it should be fine if Batman and Superman come to the Island but it's not the amazons who allow them to come. It wasn't them who allowed Steve to come either, it was the greek gods. So if they come to the Island, the greek gods have to let them in. So Steve can still come since he was already granted passage, but no other men can yet (except Jason, but being the son of Zeus help). If a story would be written about that, would it be a wonder woman story, a batman (or superman, action comic or detective comic) story or a justice league story ?

    As you said, the best way is the amazon to be willing to change but instead of men coming to the island, it's easier for them to leave.
    "

    Maybe it should be the Amazons still time. That due to Diana telling her mother about JL. They true Batman and Superman. I feel that would be more step.

  11. #86
    The Comixeur Mel Dyer's Avatar
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    Greek myth presents the Isle of Heroes or 'White Isle', as an honored paradise, reserved for Greek heroes, after mortal death. Gail Simone takes the haunted island, Thalarion, from H. P. Lovecrafts White Ship, and creates meta-myth: her Thalarion is haunted by the heroes of Greek myth! She takes another Greek myth, that of the Gargareans, and associates them with the heroic citizens of the classical White Isle, though mythology offers these societies, as two distinctly different groups. This new, Gargarean Thalarion, from its classical inspiration, is a virtuous place...a utopia. Thalarion should stay, that way - a place where the greatest heroes of Greek myth reside, ..and where future heroes will come from.

    Is there really a need to install male Amazons on Paradise, when Thalarion offers a perfectly good match for similar race, on its storied, mystical shores? Im not against a male companion race for the Amazons - Greek myth offers, at least, TWO - just don't see a need for adding them to Paradise Island. They have their own utopia, and their own champion. Furthermore, if there is ever a male answer to Wonder Woman, like a new Olympian, ..why can't he become from here?



    We're Prince Jason to be reintroduced, as a male Amazon, having been trained by the Greek heroes, beside his fellow Amazon sons, ..he would be a living link, between the two island civilizations. If he became their champion, he would be serving a polysexual king, Achilles, and assuming his mantle...that of the Olympian. Hercules and the other Argonauts, like Glaucus and the original Jason, would likely also be citizens of Thalarion and recurring characters, in stories that involved Jason - mostly told outside the pages of Wonder Woman, perhaps.

    Yes, male Amazons, living among the Gargareans of Thalarion, could prove a very interesting addition to the mythos.
    Last edited by Mel Dyer; 12-04-2019 at 11:17 AM.
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  12. #87
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I don’t know. Everything about him and how he was used is what turns people off. Let’s not make him Zeus’s son. Let’s not have Hippolyta give him up. Instead Gargareans live near the Amazons. Have him just be the same age as Diana. They are brothers and sisters in a different sense.


    If not than have Hippolyta and Phillppus use Amazons tech and they have Diana and Jason. However, the issue is why Jason? Nubia should be the twin. Unless we make them triples

  13. #88
    The Comixeur Mel Dyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I donít know. Everything about him and how he was used is what turns people off. Letís not make him Zeusís son. Letís not have Hippolyta give him up. Instead Gargareans live near the Amazons. Have him just be the same age as Diana. They are brothers and sisters in a different sense.


    If not than have Hippolyta and Phillppus use Amazons tech and they have Diana and Jason. However, the issue is why Jason? Nubia should be the twin. Unless we make them triples
    If there was a Captain Wonder or similar hero in the WW family - wearing the w-brand, similar powers, etc - would we still want male Amazons? Though he would be unique, among the women, I think he would be enough. Of course, he would have to come from somewhere, and its unlikely he could be from Themiscyra, ..after so long without men.

    I think some of us would like to see superhuman males, other than the JLers, join Diana's crusade and follow her lead. I am not certain that what we really want is a co-ed Paradise Island or another island civilization, featuring male Amazons.

    There seems to be a quiet misogyny at play here.

    It is the idea that no male hero, especially a super-powered one, who would follow a womans lead, ..should be taken seriously...ever. He can be a villain, pretending to do so. He can be Mister Genie, the bumbling, buffoonish uncle. He can even be Steve Trevor, fantasizing about being Captain Wonder. He cannot be a male, born of an Amazons or converted to Amazon ways, who shares Wonder Woman's mission and fights beside her, as Drusilla, Donna or Nubia do.

    I think we want the same thing that fans wanted, when DC created Supergirl and Batgirl...same thing. It is sad that not one story, introducing a male hero for the Wonder Family, has been bold or sincere enough to do it.
    Last edited by Mel Dyer; 12-06-2019 at 04:29 PM.
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  14. #89
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Don’t know. I mean for the most part supporting cast generally is more male than female in Clarke and Bruce’s case. I mean for the most part people don’t mind not having male Amazons. We can have a guy much like Cassie use the magic scandals.

  15. #90
    The Comixeur Mel Dyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    Don’t know. I mean for the most part supporting cast generally is more male than female in Clarke and Bruce’s case. I mean for the most part people don’t mind not having male Amazons. We can have a guy much like Cassie use the magic scandals.
    Something wrong with the Thalarion men? I dont like how Achilles turned out, but loved the island!
    Look alive, Kangaliers!

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