'Superman & Lois' in development at the CW

[Vordan]

So, considering this is WB, who don't usually believe a character should have both a film series and a tv series, does this mean I should abandon hopes of Superman getting another movie in the next decade?

If your hope was for Cavill to return yes, this pretty much shuts the door on him. But it might not be the end for Supes, if some director takes an interest in him and wants to tell a story with him then that possibility is always open. He was offered to Gunn at the very least so they haven’t totally written him off.

[Valentis]

So, considering this is WB, who don't usually believe a character should have both a film series and a tv series, does this mean I should abandon hopes of Superman getting another movie in the next decade?

It is Disney that never considers a character having a TV series and a film or two characters in a film by different studios like Fox using Quicksilver. WB had Superman Returns in 2006 when Smallville was still on in 2006.

[Myskin]

It is Disney that never considers a character having a TV series and a film or two characters in a film by different studios like Fox using Quicksilver. WB had Superman Returns in 2006 when Smallville was still on in 2006.

Allow me to quote myself (with some slight changes)

In every case of conflicting portrayals of characters in a movie or a TV series (Batwoman/Batman/Pennyworth/Gotham, Supergirl/Krypton/Smallville etc.) there was no real conflict between the movies and the TV shows because the latter were mainly spin-offs which dealt with secondary characters or the main character of the TV series was not the main character of the movie (or the other way round). WB's unwritten rule about avoiding conflicts between portrayals of the characters in the movies and the TV series has generally been proven true.
The main character of this Superman and Lois TV series is Superman. Classic Superman, with costume and everything. Not Smallville Superman, who was pretty discernible from Kal-El in Superman Returns. I really don't think that we should expect a live action Superman anytime soon.

[Vordan]

There have been two popular Sherlock-related movies with Robert Downey Jr in the latest years, a third one is in the works and there has been an immensely popular TV series with some of the finest British actors. The same guys who did Sherlock are currently producing a new Dracula series. Which is more than we could say about Superman in the latest 20 years.

Those might as well be different characters entirely, they have little to nothing at all in common with Sherlock Holmes. People went to see RDJ not Sherlock Holmes. I mean if we’re accepting those than Superman was the co-star of two extremely popular fighting games (even though I personally hate them). The Death of Superman and Reign of the Supermen were two of the most popular animated movies DC has put out in years and we’re getting two more next year. We’re getting a TV series for goodness sakes, it might not be GOOD, but I’ve seen TV Sherlock and that is an awful, awful show lmao. This doom and gloom you’re espousing just doesn’t hold up, the idea that Supes is in danger of being forgotten is just laughable. Not unless DC itself goes under will you see Supes disappear.

Edit: Again go compare where GL is now with where it was at the start of the decade under Johns. Now there’s a character who has severely fallen off.

[manwhohaseverything]

I don't think that it is possible to think of these icons in terms of inferiority or superiority. It doesn't make sense. To put it simply, some icons become dated earlier than others, no matter how popular they were in their days. Flash Gordon was extremely popular and important and influenced a lot of works which followed, but it belongs to the past now. Doc Savage and John Carter influenced Superman and they are a thing of the past too. Superman will become a thing of the past one day, no matter how popular he was in the 1950s.
Also, I wouldn't say that Dragon Ball was influenced by Superman. I mean, there are some jokes/references (there were in Toriyama's Dr Slump as well), but the influences from purely Asian works like Hong Kong movies and the ancient Chinese novel Journey to the West, are way stronger than Superman's.

journey to the west influenced dragon ball. Not dbz. Dbz goku and gohan has superman in him. It's pretty much not even subtle.i see no sunwukong in either goku nor gohan in characterisation. Journey to the west, hinduism, shinto stories had influenced things in dragon ball. But, i don't think it can be discernable like ofcourse the superman troupes. I mean, i am hindu i never notice king yama(god of death in hinduism) and other things. The only thing that visibly connects sunwukong and goku is the tale i feel. Even that is gone now. Toriyama pretty much loves to parody superman. Heck! Even loves to add elements from the mythos


I am not saying superman is main influence. But, its their.mainly because toriyama loves to have fun with superman. I can see your point regarding flash gordon.

[Myskin]

Those might as well be different characters entirely, they have little to nothing at all in common with Sherlock Holmes.

That's Elementary for you. Sherlock is universally acclaimed and praised as one of the finest adaptations of Conan Doyle's works. Faithful to the spirit of the books, and sometimes to the plot of the stories as well. You don't like it? Fine, nobody forces you to like it, but could we just please put this entire thing beyond the trite "I like it/I don't like it" line? Come on. Could we just discuss in objective terms, that is that Sherlock is one of the most popular, multi-awarded TV series of the latest years, with a huge following even outside the country where they were made? Am I supposed to copy and paste a list of the awards it won? Are we seriously putting it in the same league with the Death of Superman/Reign of Superman DVDs which, no matter how many fans liked them, are not even remotely popular as other works?

Downey Sherlock and Sherlock TV series are updated revamp/reinvention of icons whose original dynamics, no matter how old they are, still work. That's the point here. Reinvention. Revamp. Like Batman in basically every recent adaptation. Not like the umpteenth version of the Superman/Lois romance, with Donnerlike aesthetics.

And why this "gloom and doom" thing? Every cultural icon dies at one point. James Bond and Batman will become dated at one point. That's the way pop culture works. Superman is clearly more dated than other icons at this point in his long, long life. Will they relaunch/revamp him in a meaningful way? Maybe. That's not the direction they are taking, though.

It's not that I won't survive if Superman disappears. I mean come on. It's just a piece of fiction in an ocean of books, comics, movies. There are so many interesting things besides Superman.

[Crabble]

I thought this was a thread to discuss the potential "Superman & Lois" show, not a debate on whether Superman will still be relevant in 50 years?

[stargazer01]

The Arrowverse shows don't appeal to me at all, and what little I've seen of this take on Superman appeals to me even less. The long and short of why he seems to be more liked than Cavill's is that he's nicer, smiles more and is in less grim subject matter. He still seems bland and inoffensive, who exists only to prop up someone else.

And the premise brings the family stuff in, which I'm not a fan of. It's SOMETHING, but I'd prefer a Superman show on a different network/streaming service by another creative team.



100% agree.

I'm not against a Superman TV show, but he doesn't need mediocrity or subpar storytelling. Superman needs quality stories and productions to show how special and awesome he is. I really, really doubt the CW will do that, because so far, they have disappointed me with everything they have done for DC and specially for this Superman. There are episode gems occasionally, but they don't have the talent to write consistently good shows, imo. Tell me when was the last time they won something for writing or acting? ....

BTW, Superman still matters to many people. Last night The Voice show mentioned him (and Wonder Woman) comparing them to the best of the best. Someone, I think John Legend, praised a singer saying he didn't expect him to be Superman. Meaning he was just so good at singing. So in sports too, Superman is still considered the best and the top. And he could be even more loved and respected, but sadly, WB just doesn't get it. It's his sheer legend and shining star that keeps him up there still, but that could change if he doesn't get better material more consistently. People could get bored with this stories. It's why Batman is more popular now, because he gets better material all around.


Vakanai said,

So, considering this is WB, who don't usually believe a character should have both a film series and a tv series, does this mean I should abandon hopes of Superman getting another movie in the next decade?

Not in the next 5 years or so at least, imo. You don't have a new live action Superman TV show, costume and everything, and then make a Superman film at the same time. It just doesn't make sense to have them compete so directly. It also dilutes the IP and divides the fandom. In Smallville he never wore the suit or was called Superman. So, no Superman movie any time soon. WB are taking their time for people to forget Cavill probably. And until they get a new pitch that interests them. Meanwhile they give us fans this.. distraction to keep us busy... :/

My only hope to enjoy Superman right now is animation and MAYBE in the comics...

[manwhohaseverything]

I thought this was a thread to discuss the potential "Superman & Lois" show, not a debate on whether Superman will still be relevant in 50 years?

Those two aren't mutually exclusive. The viability, ability to attract new audience and push from this project adds to the Superman ip's continual prominence in the world.if it's mediocre then it will affect the ip as adversely and add to the decline. Especially, in this climate where ip is has been hit and hard. I might add.

[Crabble]

Now I'm curious. Would you guys be so generous as to answer my questions on the "Classic Superman" thread, instead of here? I don't want to derail this thread any further.

[stargazer01]

I don't think that it is possible to think of these icons in terms of inferiority or superiority. It doesn't make sense. To put it simply, some icons become dated earlier than others, no matter how popular they were in their days. Flash Gordon was extremely popular and important and influenced a lot of works which followed, but it belongs to the past now. Doc Savage and John Carter influenced Superman and they are a thing of the past too. Superman will become a thing of the past one day, no matter how popular he was in the 1950s.
Also, I wouldn't say that Dragon Ball was influenced by Superman. I mean, there are some jokes/references (there were in Toriyama's Dr Slump as well), but the influences from purely Asian works like Hong Kong movies and the ancient Chinese novel Journey to the West, are way stronger than Superman's.

I'm sure more people in the world have heard about Superman than those.

[SiegePerilous02]

I'm sure more people in the world have heard about Superman than those.

I think it depends on where in the world you are.

Journey to the West is a stronger influence, at least in early Dragon Ball. Once the Saiyans are introduced, there definitely appears to be more Superman influence.

[manwhohaseverything]

I'm sure more people in the world have heard about Superman than those.

Maybe in the west.journey to the west is pretty famous in everywhere in asia. Did you know that sun wukong is influenced by hanuman a hindu god? And i am not trying to appropriate anything.Ramayana (hindu epic) was pretty wide spread in asia due to Buddhism and hinduism.

[Ascended]

I'm kind of bummed so many here are automatically dismissing it before we've even seen one episode.

Let's take a breath and wait till we see this thing before automatically trying to kill it with fire,ok?

Honestly man, it's another Arrowverse show on CW. We've had something like five of those now? I feel like we have a pretty good idea of what the show is going to be like, between CW's formula and the Superdad synopsis they posted.

I'm not a fan of the CW's melodrama. I put up with it for a few years just because these were DC characters but the shows don't do it for me. Im not the target demo and the odds of them making a Superman show that I like are pretty slim. I'll watch the trailers for this and maybe give the pilot episode a shot, just because this is Superman and there's always that outside chance of them doing something I like. But the odds aren't good at all. I'm not being cynical here, this is just recognizing that I'm not the kind of viewer CW appeals to.

[manwhohaseverything]

I think it depends on where in the world you are.

Journey to the West is a stronger influence, at least in early Dragon Ball. Once the Saiyans are introduced, there definitely appears to be more Superman influence.

Bingo, superman is basically toriyama favourite plaything. Something he like to have fun with when writing.