'Superman & Lois' in development at the CW

[superduperman]

https://drive.google.com/drive/mobil...13&direction=a

How did this get out? And why do I get the feeling someone's getting fired for this?

[Vordan]

How did this get out? And why do I get the feeling someone's getting fired for this?

Someone screwed up for sure, but it does make for an entertaining read.

[Frontier]

How did this get out? And why do I get the feeling someone's getting fired for this?

Do you think anyone got fired for the Death of Superman leak?

[superduperman]

I wonder if they're not setting up this Jordan kid to become a supervillain. Assuming this script is legit.

[rpmaluki]

I wonder if they're not setting up this Jordan kid to become a supervillain. Assuming this script is legit.

They better not. Let's subvert that trope for once.

[Superlad93]

I think I still need to sit with this a bit, but first impressions are good--very good, honestly. The main plot is character driven, and devoted primarily Clark and Lois (mainly Clark), and the secondary plot goes to the boys. That's pretty much exactly what I wanted it to breakdown to. You really get inside Clark's head in a way that's never been allowed so far, and he rounds out as a pretty fully realized character.

There are several stand out moments (big and little) with and between the characters that I'm really looking forward to seeing fully realized. And the inciting incident for our change in status quo is as effective as an origin story. The climatic ending confrontation is a well paced cut back and forth between a Superman thing and a Super Sons thing. I'm into the way Lois is written in this, and there's an obvious set up for what she's going to be getting into as the show progresses.

I do have a few reservations though, but chief among them is the handling of Jon and Jordan, and what they decided to adapt. I'll just come out an say it, Jordan cribs from some of Jon's defining moments in comics similar to how Kara has with Clark in these shows. I expected it of course--even welcomed it--but having read how it's broken down, I'm a little more, I guess, shaken in my confidence for how they'll handle Jon. Jordan gets a version of comic Jon's heat vision scene, his outbursts over his origin scene, and the budding romance with the small town girl. The strength of Jon's character for this first episode is really gonna hang on the actor's performance.

I see what they're going for. Had this version of Jon developed his power before Jordan on top of already being as gifted as he is, it'd be really hard to connect with him going forward. I mean, they more or less shout it out when they have Clark say that his Pa said that Jon was just one of those happy kids who was "born privileged". There's one of two ways they can go about this--and I'm fairly certain on one--and that's 1) Jon is a late bloomer when it comes to super powers, and his time sorting through what I most assuredly going to be complicated feelings with his brother having them first will build character and make him appreciate them when he eventually gets them, or 2) Jon stays normal, and he has to deal with that as a character. Since Jon's be the new Superman in the comics in about a year, I have to imagine option 1 is most likely. This whole situation is assuredly there to subvert expectations a bit. In any case, it's only the first episode, and this show is surprisingly methodical and measured in how it's written, so I'm not actually even upset.

I have a question though: is this implying that Lex (our Lex) and Clark both rewrote reality? That's fascinating because it was established in Elseworlds that only a very, very few people had the, I guess, cosmic will power to use the book of destiny to rewrite reality, and Clark and Lex are two of those people. Is what happened with the DEO and Clark having two kids like he always wanted examples of these two flexing their will powers? Clark seems to imply as much in this.

I heard that the tie-in comic for Crisis that had Lex going around killing all the Supermen actually had a Council of Reeds style Council of Supermen in it. Given the fact that there's a alternate Lex here already, and this is cribbing pretty hard from Tomasi's run already, do you suppose we're going to get a version of Multiplicity that doesn't suck? Hell, I pretty much bet you anything we'll see President Superman and New Super-Man as alternate versions.

All in all, this seems like the best of the CW's pilot episodes from what I'm reading here.

[stargazer01]

read the rumored spoilers... some of it sounds fine, but the part about the boys not knowing that feels so wrong to me. Out of character.

[manwhohaseverything]

I didn't read it. That privilege line is making me cringe. Already i am only half on board. If this thing is pissing on jon and sinking him in larger media then i am done. Does this thing even has anything good for jon Or is it just making jordan into jon?

[Yoda]

It's a pilot script, so who knows where stuff will actually go once they shoot it and how things change once it gets to series. There's some stuff in there that I liked and some I didn't.

spoilers:

They handled Clark/Superman stuff really well I thought. While I don't agree he's been treated as bad as people have made it out to be, they likely did need to do a little bit of rehab on his character. So the lopsidedness with Lois here (who with less appearances I think Tulloch has already made the role hers) isn't as worrying yet. I liked his reaction to getting laid off. His interactions with the boys was interesting and handled well I thought (for a pilot) and has some interesting potential. It's a little too generic in some ways, but again it's a pilot so I'm going to give a little leeway with them to hopefully shake it out and flesh out the roles. Sam Lane as not a jackass was a nice change and having him know Clark's Superman is interesting as well. If they make the alt-Luthor's suit look like Rogal Zaar, that'll be pretty funny. If they have someone other than Cryer play Luthor here that'd be a shame. I'm also curious if they'll use the old Smallville farm as the farm here. Given they seem to have ready access to it. They seem to be leaning into adapting a variation of Rebirth set up, with them living on the farm. I'm not crazy about Ma Kent seemingly wanting Clark to come back to Smallville. That seems like a very un-Kent-like thing for her to do. The Kents have long been portrayed as having a very clear understanding of the greater calling Clark faced and their attempts to give him a "normal" childhood always seemed to me to be in recognition that he ultimately would be call to a larger things. I'm thinking there's probably more to her "come back home" than we see here. It's only the pilot, while I do think Hoechlin needed a little bit to give himself some room from his Supergirl appearances, they definitely need to give Lois more to do going forward. She is under served in this script both with the interactions with the kids and otherwise. But are setting up the Morgan Edge angle for her story (I liked that she sniffed out the story there immediately) and if that's going to tie into the major Smallville plot I can see it getting more mileage down the line. Similarly, I liked that she seemed to have more of a connection to Jordan than Clark and it'll be interesting to see if that plays more of a role in the development of their relationships going forward. They seem to leave Clark still working with the DP open a little bit. It'd be nice if we got to see more of that and see Lois & Clark working together in that capacity. That's what I wanted to see out of this show, not really Smallville 2.0. I hope they drop the tension between Lana, Clark, Lois, and Lana's husband. I hope that is a bit of misdirection though since I think that's kind of a lowest common denominator storytelling and I have little interest in. See how that goes. The husband seems like little more than a MAGA caricature at this point. I'd like them to subvert those tropes and show Lois to be secure in her relationship with Clark, and Lana not go down the "what could have been road." One interesting thing about all that was that it seems Lana doesn't know Clark is Superman.

end of spoilers

[Superlad93]

They better not. Let's subvert that trope for once.

He's the CW's original character similar to Alex on Supergirl. I have to imagine he was created in part so they could have a level of freedom that wouldn't be afforded to them with Jon, so I wouldn't rule it out. Between the script pointing out that he has an anger problem, him picking the guy that opposes Superman in his video game (and calling Superman boring), the casting call describing him as a kid with an "inherent darkness" to him, and him getting the powers first kind suggests that that is on the table for Jordan.

I wouldn't be surprised if Jon ends up getting his powers to stop his brother from going too far. Jon playfully teases Jordan, but between him knowing when his brother needs to take his pills (and bringing him pie to take them with) and him saving his brother from bullies, Jon feels responsible for Jordan. It's to the point where he even hides his feeling of being left out because he cares more about his brother.

Certainly a "I'm my brother's keeper" feel here with that dynamic. But, I also imagine it's also gonna be their bond as brothers that pulls them through whatever.

[stargazer01]

I like that Jordan sounds like a very complicated character. We need some conflict and drama. He probably isn't their son but he doesn't know it. That has potential for interesting stories. Love should win at the end because they can't make a kid evil, even if he turns out to be Zod's kid.

[Superlad93]

I like that Jordan sounds like a very complicated character. We need some conflict and drama. He probably isn't their son but he doesn't know it. That has potential for interesting stories. Love should win at the end because they can't make a kid evil, even if he turns out to be Zod's kid.

Jury's still out on if Jordan is Zod's kid, but I wanna say no at this juncture. It's written in a way where that reveal would be super odd.

But I honestly can't shake the...odd implication that pre-crisis Clark said he wanted two kids, but Lois said no, and then post-crisis Clark basically said "f#%k that" and rewrote the universe so that Lois had twins. I'm kind of unnerved by the idea a bit if I'm honest. But it's steeped in so much cosmic craziness and subconscious wants that I can't really call character foul.

[Yoda]

Jury's still out on if Jordan is Zod's kid, but I wanna say no at this juncture. It's written in a way where that reveal would be super odd.

But I honestly can't shake the...odd implication that pre-crisis Clark said he wanted two kids, but Lois said no, and then post-crisis Clark basically said "f#%k that" and rewrote the universe so that Lois had twins. I'm kind of unnerved by the idea a bit if I'm honest. But it's steeped in so much cosmic craziness and subconscious wants that I can't really call character foul.

I think it's been set up that Oliver was the one driving the merger of the universes, along with the Paragon's, which explains why Lex got his "wish." So I don't necessarily think that you can place the split of the kids completely at Clark's feet. Supergirl has dealt with the cosmic leftovers and Batwoman just addressed duplicates having trouble co-existing. I'm still not putting a Reborn type issue where we find out that the two kids are really supposed to be one and how that plays out.

[Superlad93]

I think it's been set up that Oliver was the one driving the merger of the universes, along with the Paragon's, which explains why Lex got his "wish." So I don't necessarily think that you can place the split of the kids completely at Clark's feet. Supergirl has dealt with the cosmic leftovers and Batwoman just addressed duplicates having trouble co-existing. I'm still not putting a Reborn type issue where we find out that the two kids are really supposed to be one and how that plays out.

Hmm, you think maybe the boys are actually the same person, but from different universes? Granted I may just be pulling that from my ass because I recently watched an anime film where that's the big twist, but I'm still sort of baffled by the scene in Crisis where they send Jon off to another Earth in the rocket, and an alternate Oliver finds him. What was the point of that ultimately? I'm looking back on stuff like that because Clark's seemingly throwaway comments about wanting two kids are now extremely important.

Maybe one of the boys is a refugee from another Earth and another Lois and Clark, but Clark doesn't remember because, as the script points out, post-crisis memories are foggy. I mean, there's no mention of the birth, and we are dealing with an alternate Lex already...

You may be on to something, man.

[Yoda]

Hmm, you think maybe the boys are actually the same person, but from different universes? Granted I may just be pulling that from my ass because I recently watched an anime film where that's the big twist, but I'm still sort of baffled by the scene in Crisis where they send Jon off to another Earth in the rocket, and an alternate Oliver finds him. What was the point of that ultimately? I'm looking back on stuff like that because Clark's seemingly throwaway comments about wanting two kids are now extremely important.

Maybe one of the boys is a refugee from another Earth and another Lois and Clark, but Clark doesn't remember because, as the script points out, post-crisis memories are foggy. I mean, there's no mention of the birth, and we are dealing with an alternate Lex already...

You may be on to something, man.

Well they definitely established that there are refugees from lost Earth's stuck on Earth Prime. That was hit upon with Supergirl. I still think there's a possibility that we'll see some element of either Jon and Jordan being separated in Crisis and Clark and Lois eventually having to address that, if not Jon and Jordan addressing it themselves. It's possible they'd merge them into one kid at some point - but I don't know if they'd go that route, but possibly. CW has done stuff like that with major characters before. I think an alt/Jon is more likely than like Zod's kid. Because presumably Zod's kid would not be half human.

Now that I think about, Green Arrow also hinted at this type of cosmic shenanigans with Diggle ending up with two kids as well. Oliver fixed Barry's Flashpoint gender swap by giving Diggle and Lyla both kids back.