Battle Angel Alita (movie) VS Grace (Terminator Dark Fate)

[Kuro]

Battle Angel Alita is sent back in time to protect John Conner from Grace who wants to make Dani the new leader of the resistance by assassinating Conner.

Yes, this is an insanely stupid ass scenario but in my defense, the movie isn't exactly respectful to the Terminator mythos, so why should this be.

Alita has her berserker body and Zipang's sword.

[Nik Hasta]

Alita wins this pretty easily. Grace strong, fast and pretty deadly but she has a hard limit on her abilities while Alita doesn't.

Grace burns out in short order and then Alita kills her.

Also, what do you mean "not respectful"?

[Oswin]

Alita wins this pretty easily. Grace strong, fast and pretty deadly but she has a hard limit on her abilities while Alita doesn't.

Grace burns out in short order and then Alita kills her.

Also, what do you mean "not respectful"?

I think he means what they did with John Conner. and kinda slapping T2 in the face.

[Iron_Twister]

I think he means what they did with John Conner. and kinda slapping T2 in the face.

Granted, I figured there was no way any sequel to T2 was going to avoid this.

I mean I didn't watch the film but it's kind of subtle what's up at least to me.

[Totoro Man]

I can see how people think this is disrespectful. however, the idea that somehow ONE person gets killed and changes the future of the entire world is, on the face of it, a bit silly. but it fits in with this romantic notion writers have about the value of the individual.

yeah, the idea that somehow John Connor was a "problem" that was "holding the franchise back" must have come up during the writing stages. of course, the problem wasn't the character of John Connor... it was that the sequels had terrible scripts!

so then they give Skynet a new name and then they replace Connor with another character. as if that somehow "solved" the earlier "problem". it's like switching out Megatron for Galvatron in the G1 cartoons at this point. a bland, goofy villain who suffers from epic levels of villain decay gets replaced by an even more bland, even goofier villain as a way of "raising the stakes".

since John wasn't even the main character in the first film... I guess it's not a deal breaker for everybody. I enjoyed T2 as a fun action movie... but "Terminator" never should have had sequels to begin with... it "breaks the world", so to speak.

as per the Rumble.... Alita could probably solo dozens upon dozens of terminators without even breaking a sweat. I have a hard time imagining her having trouble with Grace.

[Nik Hasta]

I think he means what they did with John Conner. and kinda slapping T2 in the face.

Again, I don't understand how this somehow translates into a "lack of respect". Like I literally don't understand what that's meant to mean.

[Cleric of Hell’s Brigade]

Again, I don't understand how this somehow translates into a "lack of respect". Like I literally don't understand what that's meant to mean.

Because from what I understand, the principle behind the Terminator movies has been Skynet needing to defeat/kill/stop John Connor.

1: Tried to kill his mom.
2: Tried to kill him.
3: Tried to kill him and his future wife/closest future allies.
4: Tried to kill him and had a cyborg created to fit in better to possibly kill him.
5: Managed to defeat him only for his mom/dad to beat the system.
6 (newest): Apparently decides John Connor doesn’t matter.

Now, the new movie is only canon with the first two, but still, Connor is a heavy plot point that, apparently, gets heavily discarded in the new one.

[Nik Hasta]

Because from what I understand, the principle behind the Terminator movies has been Skynet needing to defeat/kill/stop John Connor.

1: Tried to kill his mom.
2: Tried to kill him.
3: Tried to kill him and his future wife/closest future allies.
4: Tried to kill him and had a cyborg created to fit in better to possibly kill him.
5: Managed to defeat him only for his mom/dad to beat the system.
6 (newest): Apparently decides John Connor doesn’t matter.

Now, the new movie is only canon with the first two, but still, Connor is a heavy plot point that, apparently, gets heavily discarded in the new one.

I still don't get what is meant by "respect" here.

This reads to me like a "lack of respect" here means "changing stuff".

This is a bad take not least because Dark Fate "respects" T2 enough to give the Connors their victory.

Part of the whole premise of Dark Fate is that John and Sarah /were/ successful. They stopped Skynet from happening in T2 and the future changed.

However, it did not stop the rise of a machine intelligence conceptually because humans keep building smarter AI regardless of the actions of the Connors.

Legion is not Skynet but the future is still similar because machine war is, on some level, inevitable.

Saying it's not respectful because it carried on the plot of the previous film just doesn't make sense to me.