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Thread: Homo novissima

  1. #16
    Spectacular Member Criticalfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Quiet Councilor View Post
    I think itís a great way to reframe non-mutant superhumans within the context of the X-Men. Captain America and Iron Man are suddenly part of an evolutionary conflict in which theyíve historically had little to no part.

    Itís also a great way to elevate X-characters like Omega Sentinel and the Children of the Vault and give them inherent narrative and thematic importance they didnít have before.
    This seems right to me. It's maybe the best way Marvel has to stitch all this disparate continuity and its comics universe together into something that seems of a whole.

  2. #17
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Totally underdevolped and underutilized. Just another 'humans are terrible' example. People becoming robots and machine people is a common bad guy trope even in the Marvel comics universe, and framing them as some kind of 'wrong' form of evolution compared to the 'right' kind from mutants felt like two villains from two different B movies whining at each other.
    They've literally just been introduced

  3. #18

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    I love the idea...but i hope some of the human.villiams hate them too. I would love to see friends of humanity clling them no better then muties.

    I also.wnder if the extremise and super soldier stuff will come up more..
    In the real world i would be BOTH pro registration and Pro mutant rights. Xavier and Trask were both right.

  4. #19
    Incredible Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    They've literally just been introduced
    Fair. They just annoyed me because it felt like a capstone to the 'its hopeless and humans are always evil bastards who hate mutants' vibe that I was getting.

  5. #20
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Makes perfect sense to me. What use is natural evolution when you can genetically engineer yourself, or use technology to reshape the environment to your whim? And posthumans would probably view us the way we do our great ape cousins so I like that there’s now a third or fourth side to this conflict.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member AbnormallyNormal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Fair. They just annoyed me because it felt like a capstone to the 'its hopeless and humans are always evil bastards who hate mutants' vibe that I was getting.
    That's definitely the vibe so far but I mean it seems pretty clear to me that over the course of the run it will evolve and there will be human allies again

    But again I think it's also a bit more nuanced , it's not that humans even are "evil" they're presented as being rightfully afraid of mutants and their resorting to posthuman status is simply a way to boost their own thriving in a more advanced world really. That's what is nice about X-Men mythos "both sides are right" to some degree
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  7. #22
    Incredible Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AbnormallyNormal View Post
    That's definitely the vibe so far but I mean it seems pretty clear to me that over the course of the run it will evolve and there will be human allies again

    But again I think it's also a bit more nuanced , it's not that humans even are "evil" they're presented as being rightfully afraid of mutants and their resorting to posthuman status is simply a way to boost their own thriving in a more advanced world really. That's what is nice about X-Men mythos "both sides are right" to some degree
    We also have had at least some hints at, and one of Moira's timelines confirms, that the mutants might go all mad scientist gene splicing to make super mixed mutants, which is another wrinkle to the problem.

    I really want more nuance, because if I have to sit through another Magneto/Apocalypse rant about puny inferior mutants with not a single X-men responding I'm going to blow a gasket. And the same applies to the purple genocide robots.

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Fair. They just annoyed me because it felt like a capstone to the 'its hopeless and humans are always evil bastards who hate mutants' vibe that I was getting.
    Well that's kind of how it is in the MU hahaha humans always try to erase mutants.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartofTheStoriesWeTell View Post
    I love the idea...but i hope some of the human.villiams hate them too. I would love to see friends of humanity clling them no better then muties.

    I also.wnder if the extremise and super soldier stuff will come up more..
    Probably will, in light of Project Rebirth being meant to create a kind of "ultimate human" and Extremis being a more advanced version of Project Rebirth's Super-Soldier Serum that could essentially reprogram and rebuild a human body at the genetic and cellular level for superhuman capabilities. Come to think of it, Captain America just found out in the Weapon Plus one-shot about his unwitting role in precipitating the entire Weapon Plus project, so there's that to consider, too.
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  10. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Well that's kind of how it is in the MU hahaha humans always try to erase mutants.
    No, they don't. Holy crap, no one ever blames ALL the Asgardians for Loki's crap, but all humans everywhere are responsible for Zero tolerance and the purifiers? What a litmus test.
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  11. #26
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Handsome men don't lose fights View Post
    No, they don't. Holy crap, no one ever blames ALL the Asgardians for Loki's crap, but all humans everywhere are responsible for Zero tolerance and the purifiers? What a litmus test.
    In universe, they do blame all mutants for the behavior of some. Moira's previous 9 lives showed that humans do always come together to erase mutants tho. Plus if you read Rosenberg's or even the Terrigen stuff it shows quite a wide-spread hate/intollerance towards mutants.

  12. #27
    Fantastic Member The Thunderbird's Avatar
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    I think Homo novissima is a brilliant concept and quite meta when referring to real life human evolution. In real life, no one is concerned by being overtaken by mutants anymore. Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group. The concept of entire groups evolving rapidly were known as saltations and the concept of evolution by saltation has been out of date for so long Charles Darwin himself opposed it and his theories were partially a refutation to that idea. Meanwhile, Homo novissima are obviously a reference to transhumanism. Cybernetic and genetic engineering have improved greatly over recent years and the concept of transhumanism relies on those sciences to build a better human. We can already see in real life how human engineering creates products far superior to natural selection. No bird can fly as fast as an F-22 fighter jet or breach the atmosphere the way the Apollo Space program did. The plating on armadillos, turtles, or even the ankylosaurus cannot compare to the armor of an Abrams tank. No animal can lift as much weight as a crane and so on. If humans were to be naturally supplanted by other hominids through evolution it would be through a gradual generation shift lasting for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and nobody would notice. Through transhumanism, baseline humanity can potentially be marginalized within a generation.

  13. #28
    Proud Krakoan Jbenito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Thunderbird View Post
    I think Homo novissima is a brilliant concept and quite meta when referring to real life human evolution. In real life, no one is concerned by being overtaken by mutants anymore. Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group. The concept of entire groups evolving rapidly were known as saltations and the concept of evolution by saltation has been out of date for so long Charles Darwin himself opposed it and his theories were partially a refutation to that idea. Meanwhile, Homo novissima are obviously a reference to transhumanism. Cybernetic and genetic engineering have improved greatly over recent years and the concept of transhumanism relies on those sciences to build a better human. We can already see in real life how human engineering creates products far superior to natural selection. No bird can fly as fast as an F-22 fighter jet or breach the atmosphere the way the Apollo Space program did. The plating on armadillos, turtles, or even the ankylosaurus cannot compare to the armor of an Abrams tank. No animal can lift as much weight as a crane and so on. If humans were to be naturally supplanted by other hominids through evolution it would be through a gradual generation shift lasting for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and nobody would notice. Through transhumanism, baseline humanity can potentially be marginalized within a generation.
    Too bad they're being created to kill mutants, but all good points. This sentence struck me:

    "Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group."

    It made me think... what if such mutations are commonplace in real life but there's a media blackout on them because they're being rounded up and disposed of? We would never know! We must free the mutants!
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Thunderbird View Post
    I think Homo novissima is a brilliant concept and quite meta when referring to real life human evolution. In real life, no one is concerned by being overtaken by mutants anymore. Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group. The concept of entire groups evolving rapidly were known as saltations and the concept of evolution by saltation has been out of date for so long Charles Darwin himself opposed it and his theories were partially a refutation to that idea. Meanwhile, Homo novissima are obviously a reference to transhumanism. Cybernetic and genetic engineering have improved greatly over recent years and the concept of transhumanism relies on those sciences to build a better human. We can already see in real life how human engineering creates products far superior to natural selection. No bird can fly as fast as an F-22 fighter jet or breach the atmosphere the way the Apollo Space program did. The plating on armadillos, turtles, or even the ankylosaurus cannot compare to the armor of an Abrams tank. No animal can lift as much weight as a crane and so on. If humans were to be naturally supplanted by other hominids through evolution it would be through a gradual generation shift lasting for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and nobody would notice. Through transhumanism, baseline humanity can potentially be marginalized within a generation.
    Especially by the wealthy elite, who can basically buy their way into being not only superior in terms of social class, but physically, mentally, and even genetically as well, calcifying those preexisting social inequities.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jbenito View Post
    Too bad they're being created to kill mutants, but all good points. This sentence struck me:

    "Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group."

    It made me think... what if such mutations are commonplace in real life but there's a media blackout on them because they're being rounded up and disposed of? We would never know! We must free the mutants!
    Hmm, food for thought.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  15. #30
    Mighty Member Frobisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbenito View Post
    Too bad they're being created to kill mutants, but all good points. This sentence struck me:

    "Natural mutations are random and the odds of a single individual ending up with mutations that put them above the human race are quite slim never mind a whole group."

    It made me think... what if such mutations are commonplace in real life but there's a media blackout on them because they're being rounded up and disposed of? We would never know! We must free the mutants!
    If you’d ever driven through Skelmersdale you’d know that mutants are real.

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