Page 35 of 65 FirstFirst ... 2531323334353637383945 ... LastLast
Results 511 to 525 of 968
  1. #511
    Astonishing Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    2,414

    Default

    Ya know something, I’m rather surprised that I didn’t think of this sooner, but, does Professor X even have any willingness to progressively integrate within human societies anymore now that he has helped build up a credible, successful empire for himself and his mutants? I suppose an answer that immediately comes to mind is that “Why go to back to bad countries like America when there’s always going to be Krakoa?” though then again, when it’s put like that, then it starts to sound a little like a defeatist attitude, doesn’t it?

  2. #512
    Fantastic Member Maestro 216's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    492

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Comics don't allow for nuance at times, The X-line is famous for that. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Rogue wanting her powers gone. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having countermeasures for a person who can blow up a city.

    But X-men comics rarely let us talk about these things without going to the extreme. America doesn't allow certain cough medicine or fertilizer to be sold because of people misusing them do people honestly think it logically possible for mutants to be around and some sort of limiter not be in place? Do people think any country will willing allow people to run around in costumes without oversight?

    Liberties are allowed for the genre, Teens can't drive car before 16 and can't drink and smoke before 18 but adults are letting teens who aren't trained under 18 run around and fight crime. Has anyone ever meet a 16 or 17 year old police officer? Less restrictions let these stories happen easier many of these discussions we having are because the genre does want to flesh out certain things.
    I mean the fact I praise X3 for even letting Rogue lose her powers WILLINGLY even if the motive was just I want boys to love me is at least somewhat progressive. Then, the sequel just gave Rogue her power back for reasons.

  3. #513
    Astonishing Member Electricmastro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    2,414

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Comics don't allow for nuance at times, The X-line is famous for that. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Rogue wanting her powers gone. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having countermeasures for a person who can blow up a city.

    But X-men comics rarely let us talk about these things without going to the extreme. America doesn't allow certain cough medicine or fertilizer to be sold because of people misusing them do people honestly think it logically possible for mutants to be around and some sort of limiter not be in place? Do people think any country will willing allow people to run around in costumes without oversight?

    Liberties are allowed for the genre, Teens can't drive car before 16 and can't drink and smoke before 18 but adults are letting teens who aren't trained under 18 run around and fight crime. Has anyone ever meet a 16 or 17 year old police officer? Less restrictions let these stories happen easier many of these discussions we having are because the genre does want to flesh out certain things.
    Yep, been realizing more and more how superhero comics, at least mainstream ones, don’t really lend themselves the best when attempting to give productive overviews and analyses of real-life sensitive issues, which I think has a good time and a good place as I really don’t think a drastic, big course of action needs to be come to every single time, or in other words like how it was touched on earlier, that I’m sure it’s possible for an unpowered human in the Marvel universe to simply suggest that superpowered beings should be kept in responsible check without eventually being found out as a raving, genocidal lunatic. Given the general history of superhero comics though, it’s rare to see someone simply suggesting powers being kept in check without being portrayed or hinted at as villainous, because that seems to be how such situations are framed most often.
    Last edited by Electricmastro; 04-03-2020 at 06:54 PM.

  4. #514
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    New Jersey, U.S.A.
    Posts
    8,512

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    Yep, been realizing more and more how superhero comics, at least mainstream ones, don’t really lend themselves the best when attempting to give productive overviews and analyses of real-life sensitive issues, which I think has a good time and a good place as I really don’t think a drastic, big course of action needs to be come to every single time, or in other words like how it was touched on earlier, that I’m sure it’s possible for an unpowered human in that Marvel universe to simply suggest that superpowered beings should be kept in responsible check without eventually being found out as a raving, genocidal lunatic. Given the general history of superhero comics though, it’s rare to see someone simply suggesting powers being kept in check without being portrayed or hinted at as villainous, because that seems to be how such situations are framed most often.
    I think a lot of the issue is that the superhero genre itself deals in and is often dominated by extremes. Superheroes are depicted as an extreme, although necessary, response to crime, terror, and other evil(s) that would completely overwhelm humanity on both an individual and institutional/societal level, while supervillains are another such extreme in response to the existence of superheroes. As such, the genre seems to have an inbuilt skepticism of moderation and restraint, especially where the really good stuff, from a dramatic standpoint, resides in seeing both heroes and villains cut loose. Of course, that makes it difficult to present a more balanced portrayal of how superhumans would impact the world and society in which they live, because the temptation is always going to be to go for the most dramatic angle or exaggerated outcome. That's just what makes good entertainment, apparently, even if it's not exactly a realistic portrayal of how superhumans would be viewed and treated by the world at large.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  5. #515
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,668

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    Ya know something, I’m rather surprised that I didn’t think of this sooner, but, does Professor X even have any willingness to progressively integrate within human societies anymore now that he has helped build up a credible, successful empire for himself and his mutants? I suppose an answer that immediately comes to mind is that “Why go to back to bad countries like America when there’s always going to be Krakoa?” though then again, when it’s put like that, then it starts to sound a little like a defeatist attitude, doesn’t it?
    Nope, that Charles is dead. He's completely give up on humanity, it's why Magneto is the face of Krakoa.

  6. #516
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    1,584

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    I think a lot of the issue is that the superhero genre itself deals in and is often dominated by extremes. Superheroes are depicted as an extreme, although necessary, response to crime, terror, and other evil(s) that would completely overwhelm humanity on both an individual and institutional/societal level, while supervillains are another such extreme in response to the existence of superheroes. As such, the genre seems to have an inbuilt skepticism of moderation and restraint, especially where the really good stuff, from a dramatic standpoint, resides in seeing both heroes and villains cut loose. Of course, that makes it difficult to present a more balanced portrayal of how superhumans would impact the world and society in which they live, because the temptation is always going to be to go for the most dramatic angle or exaggerated outcome. That's just what makes good entertainment, apparently, even if it's not exactly a realistic portrayal of how superhumans would be viewed and treated by the world at large.
    It hasn't been always the case… Mostly at the beginning, there were elements more realistic while more light-hearted.
    I'm thinking about Spider-man and the way he was treated, both praised and despised. People didn't resurrect back then and there weren't extravagant powers.

  7. #517
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    1,584

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Do people think any country will willing allow people to run around in costumes without oversight?
    In UK, I'm sure there wouldn't be any problems…


  8. #518
    Incredible Member Su_Whisterfield's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    878

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    In UK, I'm sure there wouldn't be any problems…


    But they must wear a helmet.

    Ah, I did so love Excalibur.

  9. #519
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    1,668

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    It hasn't been always the case… Mostly at the beginning, there were elements more realistic while more light-hearted.
    I'm thinking about Spider-man and the way he was treated, both praised and despised. People didn't resurrect back then and there weren't extravagant powers.
    Characters and events are sensationalised since it's adventure comics. Marvel knows readers want the characters to fight and will take the slightest opportunity to have super-heroes fight each other. It's a Marvel tradition.

  10. #520
    Spectacular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kisinith View Post
    They didn't go to war with the Avengers, it was the other way around. The Avengers showed up on Utopia, in force, and demanded they turn over a mutant teenager (Hope) or else. Something Cable had expressly told Cyclops would result in the destruction of all life on Earth. The Avengers then continued to attack up to and including assaulting kids who were playing video games in order to kidnap Hope. The P5 did not go after the Avengers until after they were repeatedly attacked.

    Now I've no desire to go down the rabbit hole on debating the steaming hot mess that was AvX. I'm fully willing to admit that everyone involved took turns juggling the idiot ball and were repeatedly bludgeoned with plot induced stupidity beat stick but, the Avengers were unambiguously the aggressors and in the end their grand plan for stopping the Phoenix was doing what the X-Men had wanted from the very beginning.
    I don't even think they brought it up even once during the whole event just to make Avengers (or simply because of how incompetent editorial seemed to be) look good.

  11. #521
    Astonishing Member LordUltimus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    2,379

    Default

    AvX had, like, eight writers, it was doomed to be a mess of contradictions.

  12. #522
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    New Jersey, U.S.A.
    Posts
    8,512

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Nope, that Charles is dead. He's completely give up on humanity, it's why Magneto is the face of Krakoa.
    Funny enough, if you believe him in X-Men #4, he hasn't given up on humanity as much as it would seem he has. It's just that at this point, his overtures toward humanity are more of a carrot-and-stick thing, using a very heavy stick in the person of Magneto, who is there as proof that Xavier's serious about building a mutant nation and won't concede to humanity as he has in the past, at least not without humanity making serious concessions of its own. That's the lesson he's learned after years of attempting to forge a path to peaceful coexistence with humankind and being violently rejected each and every time.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  13. #523
    Incredible Member pkingdom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    892

    Default

    Why did the X-men think the Phoenix was coming to help them? It destroyed multiple planets on the way, so I can see why the Avengers were being jumpy from the get-go.

    Relying on a stupid future vision from Cable is BS, especially if they never brought it up again. These 'we have to do (insert crazy thing) to avoid (bad future #28) plots need to die in a fire. They've lost all meaning given how many revolved around Apocalypse. Scott and Cable are now taking orders from the man!

  14. #524
    Incredible Member pkingdom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    892

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    Funny enough, if you believe him in X-Men #4, he hasn't given up on humanity as much as it would seem he has. It's just that at this point, his overtures toward humanity are more of a carrot-and-stick thing, using a very heavy stick in the person of Magneto, who is there as proof that Xavier's serious about building a mutant nation and won't concede to humanity as he has in the past, at least not without humanity making serious concessions of its own. That's the lesson he's learned after years of attempting to forge a path to peaceful coexistence with humankind and being violently rejected each and every time.
    Honestly at this point Charles feels more like his Ultimate Universe counterpart. He's even more patronizing than he used to be. I know that you are right, and that's what that speech was supposed to mean, but having him say that flanked by Apocalypse and Magneto, who literally joked about ending civilizations minutes prior, makes the whole thing ring hollow. And his mission statement/temper tantrum in HoXPoX had him saying that their goal is no longer acceptance, but replacement.

    Or, to put it bluntly, Magneto was right. Just instead of using war first, they start with subversion and subterfuge. According to Moira, war is inevitable, so they're preparing for that by consolidating mutant power in one place. Or at least that was my interpretation

  15. #525
    BANNED spirit2011's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    11,386

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Why did the X-men think the Phoenix was coming to help them? It destroyed multiple planets on the way, so I can see why the Avengers were being jumpy from the get-go.

    Relying on a stupid future vision from Cable is BS, especially if they never brought it up again. These 'we have to do (insert crazy thing) to avoid (bad future #28) plots need to die in a fire. They've lost all meaning given how many revolved around Apocalypse. Scott and Cable are now taking orders from the man!
    X-men stopped making sense

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •