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  1. #16
    Legendary Member daBronzeBomma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    Thought Robot Superman isn't technically Superman either.
    False.

    He is still every bit as much Clark with the TR as Thanos is still Thanos with the IG.

  2. #17
    The Tentacle God Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daBronzeBomma View Post
    False.

    He is still every bit as much Clark with the TR as Thanos is still Thanos with the IG.
    It was a machine created by the monitors imbued with Superman's personality, and memories iirc.
    "... and when the Golden Toad started to sing, there was no turning back." - grampagen (Ochazuke)

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  3. #18
    Extraordinary Member The Dork Knight's Avatar
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    Not exactly. Superman beyond was the consciousness' (god, writer whatever) response to the stories it had created (the multiverse). The monitors were also part of that "response" to contain the bad parts of the consciousness spinning out of control

    In any case, the "machine" was powered by both superman and Ultraman, not just superman. I don't know if that falls under "composite"

    Edit- or rather it was the response to the response. The first response to creation (the first monitor) went crazy, "infected" by the stories of the multiverse. The machine was created to prevent the first response from attacking the multiverse . In a way it represents superman not only because it is the "first" one but also as the ultimate deux ex machina to "fix" stories
    Last edited by The Dork Knight; 11-17-2019 at 12:42 PM.

  4. #19
    Extraordinary Member The Dork Knight's Avatar
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    In any case the sun dipped superman that destroyed a multiverse and one shotted a casual universe buster is probably more relevant here

    Also there are versions of superman that are outright reality warpers on a scale of being part of group efforts that go "universe reset" and throw down with Krona
    Last edited by The Dork Knight; 11-17-2019 at 12:56 PM.

  5. #20
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Honestly, I'd be surprised if Composite Clark wasn't stronger than Composite Goku, due to the fact that even Wolverine has been a cosmic being at least once and Clark has existed in multiple forms across multiple media for far longer than Logan has, and usually operates on a far higher tier.

    I was just responding to the proposition that Composite Goku didn't approach "just" Superman Prime.

    Also, is Ultraman also named Clark? I thought that he was just an alternate version of Kal-El, in which case his feats should probably also count.
    Last edited by The Drunkard Kid; 11-17-2019 at 01:53 PM.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    Nope. Superman 1 Million is one of Clark's descendents (hence why he has 5D Imp ancestry as well), and Clark was living with a resurrected Lois Lane in the Super Sun as Superman Prime at that point in the timeline.

    I honestly don't remember the ending of GT, but I could swear that Goku went around to talk to his friends (or at least Kuririn) before going in to become the new Dragon God, them came out to chat with Goku Jr in the future when the latter was trying to summon Shen Long.


    You forgot the part where Goku fired a Kamehameha that would have destroyed the universe by itself, if Bills didn't neutralize it, or that the entire point of that clashing scene seemed to be for Goku to learn how to use God Ki without accidentally destroying the universe, which he explicitly did learn.

    Also, when Goku summoned Zen'o, he was *not* trying to destroy the local multiverse, he just had no way of stopping a guy that was significantly more powerful than himself and was on his way to assimilating the entire multiverse, and freaked out when he realized that Zen'o's solution was to just destroy that guy instead of something like undoing the assimilation instead.
    1. Goku left with Shenron at the end of GT, but there was no mention of him becoming a Dragon god or anything like that.

    2. That doesn't change the fact that none of Goku's later battles, including against much strong foes, resulted in such destruction.

  7. #22
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jcogginsa View Post
    1. Goku left with Shenron at the end of GT, but there was no mention of him becoming a Dragon god or anything like that.

    2. That doesn't change the fact that none of Goku's later battles, including against much strong foes, resulted in such destruction.
    The first point is fair, as I can't really remember if it was explicitly stated. The second point doesn't matter since he explicitly learned how to *not* accidentally destroy the universe while going full out and he's on the tier of the Gods of Destruction who are about to wreck universes.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    The first point is fair, as I can't really remember if it was explicitly stated. The second point doesn't matter since he explicitly learned how to *not* accidentally destroy the universe while going full out and he's on the tier of the Gods of Destruction who are about to wreck universes.
    He learned how to not cause the weird Shockwaves, which were the actual threat the the universe because they crew stronger as they traveled as opposed to getting weaker.

  9. #24

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    Goku is a universe buster now. People in his weight class can muck with reality as side scatter of their fights, threaten the universe and overpower fundamental aspects of nature. They have been capable of damaging spacial reality since the Buu saga.

    Goku learned specifically how NOT to blow up the universe while fighting Beerus so saying "he didnt do stuff on that scale later" is bunk.

    And even if you somehow just ignore all that evidence..... Last I checked, Goku was Moderator Ruled as a universe buster as an official Rumbles stance.
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  10. #25
    The Tentacle God Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Wait wut.

    Link to the ruling ?
    "... and when the Golden Toad started to sing, there was no turning back." - grampagen (Ochazuke)

    "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn."

  11. #26
    The Tentacle God Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    To be clear I don't disagree. Gogeta and Broly were straight punching in and out of dimensions like they were just going to the store to pick up some milk; just didn't realize it had been ruled on.
    "... and when the Golden Toad started to sing, there was no turning back." - grampagen (Ochazuke)

    "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn."

  12. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    Wait wut.

    Link to the ruling ?
    No problem - it's easy to miss. See attached.
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    "At the end of the day, Arby is a pretty prolific poster proposing a plurality of proper posts for us."
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  13. #28
    The Tentacle God Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Hm, I suppose you can infer Goku is on that level based on what's said, but it more says "he contributed half". Which is like saying Blackbolt is a galaxy buster cuz he powered that bomb.

    He only trades even with Zamasu types after he fuses, as far as I remember.
    "... and when the Golden Toad started to sing, there was no turning back." - grampagen (Ochazuke)

    "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn."

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Arbiter View Post
    No problem - it's easy to miss. See attached.
    I mean, I don't want to contradict the mods here, but that mod ruling is in direct contradiction with what we told and shown in the episode itself.

    The Old Kai directly states that the waves gain strength the farther they travel. The threat to the universe is also described as be the result of a chain reaction caused by cumulative strikes. , So it's not even as if there were a chance of a true universe busting feat. It's destruction over time, not in a single burst

    We see the waves passing through the earth, and doing no damage to the planet, then it vaporizes a planet that is further away, backing up what the Old Kai says.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    Hm, I suppose you can infer Goku is on that level based on what's said, but it more says "he contributed half". Which is like saying Blackbolt is a galaxy buster cuz he powered that bomb.

    He only trades even with Zamasu types after he fuses, as far as I remember.
    Goku contributes half* to an attack the explicitly grows stronger over time, requires multiple uses to do the job, and doesn't even destroy the universe all at once. There are a lot of asterisk here.

    *Probably slightly less than half sense Beerus is still stronger than him
    Last edited by Jcogginsa; 11-17-2019 at 04:21 PM.

  15. #30

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    Seems like you do in fact want to contradict the mods
    "At the end of the day, Arby is a pretty prolific poster proposing a plurality of proper posts for us."
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