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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Default Do these Kathleen Kennedy comments worry or bother you ?

    https://www.rollingstone.com/movies/...r-wars-912393/

    Every one of these movies is a particularly hard nut to crack. Thereís no source material. We donít have comic books. We donít have 800-page novels. We donít have anything other than passionate storytellers who get together and talk about what the next iteration might be
    Now honestly I couldn't tell you if the the Star Wars EU stuff is good or bad I haven't really read them, And I am not one of people who are upset with the current direction of the franchise. But I have always been baffled at the decision to throw out everything and go let's start from zero. To me that was just a crazy move when the easy decision would have been to let your high paid screenwriters use the EU stuff with no strict adherence to them, Throw away the bad stuff,Keep the good stuff. And write new stuff where it is needed. I get the reasoning behind going in new direction if you had strong new story that you wanted to tell but from everything I am seeing that is not case. And it is seems like they are struggling to come up with good new stories. Forgive me if this was talk about before I was looking to see thread and I didn't see a topic. Anyways do these comments worry about the direction of Star Wars because to me it seems like they just threw out usable stuff without a better plan. What are you guys thoughts on that quote.

  2. #2
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Not worried; the movies -- good and bad -- have always been written without source material. Having the right people working on the projects is all you need to maximize the chances of the final product being good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    But I have always been baffled at the decision to throw out everything and go let's start from zero. To me that was just a crazy move when the easy decision would have been to let your high paid screenwriters use the EU stuff with no strict adherence to them, Throw away the bad stuff,Keep the good stuff. And write new stuff where it is needed. I get the reasoning behind going in new direction if you had strong new story that you wanted to tell but from everything I am seeing that is not case. And it is seems like they are struggling to come up with good new stories.
    The pre-Disney Expanded Universe (EU)/Legends was decanonized to allow the new movies complete creative freedom. I think they've done well with it, but, IMHO, the Legends stuff at the end (the things that the sequel trilogy replaced) were really bad, so it is admittedly a low bar. However, the Star Wars people can and do borrow Legends stuff for new projects. You mostly see it in the new tie-ins, but the movies do it some, too. Solo is littered with Legends Easter eggs and re-canonized ideas, and that's before you factor in the reference material for it.
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  3. #3
    "Emma is STILL right! Vegeta's Avatar
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    I thought George Lucas gave Disney all his story ideas for a third trilogy which they flat out rejected. What's better "source material" than the creator of Star Wars himself?

    Her comments don't worry me, they just sadly confirm what I long suspected after episode 8.
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  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Starter Set's Avatar
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    Well, why use old material when you can write new masterpieces such as a new hope 2.0, the last joke or "no one cares" Solo right?

    That being said, let's not put more blame on Kennedy than she deserves. Let's not forget the "fantastic" contribution to that mess of Jar Jar Abrams.
    Last edited by Starter Set; 11-21-2019 at 01:14 AM.
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  5. #5
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    It strikes me as a bit inaccurate. The TV shows in particular have pretty much re-canonized a lot of the old EU, although with modifications to fit into the new continuity. So they did throw away the bad stuff, keep the good stuff in a sense.


    -Grand Admiral Thrawn is the big one, although he's no longer a post-ROTJ villain (Well, yet) but causes problems for the Lothal Rebels.

    -The TIE defender from the video games is brought back as one of Thrawn's projects.

    -The Darktroopers, although reimagined as Thrawn's training droids.



    -The Cloud Riders in Solo, although altered to be a proto-Rebellion.

    -Some elements of the KOTOR/TOTJ ancient Jedi mythology is still canon, such as Malachor.

    -Speaking of which, the Hammerhead cruiser from those games was changed into a Rebellion-era vessel and used quite prominently in "Rogue One".


    Also, the old EU was already on somewhat shaky ground, with the prequels contradicting a lot of it, but then in came Clone Wars, with renditions of the nightsisters and Mandalorians which drastically differed from other sources. Also the CW pretty much ignored everything about the Wars established by comics, novels, and the other animated series at that point, which showed that Anakin didn't get his promotion to Knight (and get a new haircut) until late in the wars, definitely did not have an apprentice etc. Keep in mind this was years before Disney too.

    Granted, the entire post-ROTJ era is pretty much been paved over (Although in both cases there was a "New Republic", although with different ways of doing things), but the old EU still kind of lives on in the new.
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  6. #6
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
    I thought George Lucas gave Disney all his story ideas for a third trilogy which they flat out rejected. What's better "source material" than the creator of Star Wars himself?

    Her comments don't worry me, they just sadly confirm what I long suspected after episode 8.
    Lucas in an interview with James Cameron last year said that while the new trilogy would mainly focus on some of the deeper mysteries of the Star Wars universe; however, that would be Midichlorians and the Whills. While the second could be interesting, the first of course has it's problems....He also described something like visiting a microscopic world, which seems a bit Ant-Man.
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  7. #7
    Non-fanboy Member Cel's Avatar
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    I think Kennedy was comparing Star Wars to other literary franchises like Game of Thrones, The Hunger Games, The Walking Dead, etc., in which there is a main story that can be adapted almost in its entirety. In comparison, Star Wars has a largely open narrative that can splinter off in countless different directions. Lucas had lots of ideas, but he was pretty much making up things as he went along. That gave him the freedom to take both the original and prequel trilogies wherever he wanted, but there really wasn't a set-in-stone story for Star Wars. I believe that's what Kennedy was alluding to, IMO.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    You have to realize that the people involved in the purchase and running of Lucasfilm were primarily interested in the movie aspect of the franchise. They ignored the rest because they primarily were movie people. To them stuff like the games/novels/comics were just ephemera that could be discarded and downplayed. Their goal was to crank out as many movies (to pay for the 4 billion dollar purchase of Lucasfilm) and maybe setup SW as a new MCU (which has failed). The powers that be simply did not understand the importance of the lore or the wealth of material of the Expanded Universe or that the SW brand needed to be maintained with the fans.

    And despite the success of the MCU, they did NOT understand the shared universe aspect of the Legends Universe. Which is natural since they comes from an environment that venerates the director as an auteur and the movie as the vision of that one person (never mind that it's not true).

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Lucas wasn't really a big fan of the EU either, often referring to it as an "alternate universe". Most of the EU references in the prequels (apart from stuff like Coruscant and Quinlan Vos) were largely from DROIDS which he had sort of a small hand in.


    It's likely that Lucas's concepts for the sequel trilogy would've tossed out EU material as well.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Lucas wasn't really a big fan of the EU either, often referring to it as an "alternate universe". Most of the EU references in the prequels (apart from stuff like Coruscant and Quinlan Vos) were largely from DROIDS which he had sort of a small hand in.
    That's not true. He liked the comics. He put Aayla Secure in AOTC/ROTS. He was going to use Darth Talon for the Sequel Trilogy. He liked Dark Empire enough to give it out as Christmas presents to employees. He and Filoni used Ventress from Clone Wars comics/novels for TCW as well as random bits of lore like holocrons and nightsisters. And he was willing to share the sandbox, we can trace the ideas of Sith Lords as being evil Jedi in TOTJ from him.

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member cranger's Avatar
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    I just find it perplexing since adapting a source should be the exception anyway. Then again, the question is poorly worded so Kathleen is just covering all the bases with her basically canned response about making a movie.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    That's not true. He liked the comics. He put Aayla Secure in AOTC/ROTS. He was going to use Darth Talon for the Sequel Trilogy. He liked Dark Empire enough to give it out as Christmas presents to employees. He and Filoni used Ventress from Clone Wars comics/novels for TCW as well as random bits of lore like holocrons and nightsisters. And he was willing to share the sandbox, we can trace the ideas of Sith Lords as being evil Jedi in TOTJ from him.

    From Lucas's interviews in Cinescape and Starlog.

    There's my world, which is the movies, and there's this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universeóthe licensing world of the books, games and comic books. "

    "I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world."

    "And now there have been novels about the events after Episode VI, which isn't at all what I would have done with it."

    "Once Vader dies, the Emperor doesn't get cloned and Luke doesn't get married..."


    Then again, Lucas isn't the most consistent person. After ROTS was released he was pretty adamant that there never would be any more Star Wars movies, just the Clone Wars and the TV show. Then comes 2012....plus his many claims of having the whole saga mapped out perfectly from the beginning during many of the interviews from the prequels.
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  13. #13
    Mighty Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Doesn't matter anymore. She has one foot out the door and everything is pointing towards John Favreau being the new guy in charge with Filoni as the number two guy. Here is an excerpt from the Hollywood Reporter Article

    "Creating a new mythology is, of course, the challenge that Disney faces with Star Wars. Kennedy is an experienced and competent producer, but she is not a creative visionary. (She made her name as a producer for creative visionary Steven Spielberg.) So who better than Favreau to play a leading role in charting the course? He has fan loyalty. He is as Team Disney as they come, having directed The Jungle Book and The Lion King. He worked with Kennedy on the all-important effort to launch Disney+. And having consulted on, executive produced and acted in Marvel movies, he is also close with Feige.

    So with or without Kennedy, sources say it seems likely that Favreau will have a lot of say over the future of Star Wars. These sources also say Kennedy's ideal team includes key roles for Michelle Rejwan, a producer on Episode IX and Lucasfilm's senior vp live action development and production, and Dave Filoni, the veteran animation director and George Lucas protege who directed live action for the first time with two episodes of Mandalorian. Even if remaining at Lucasfilm is not in the cards for Kennedy, this plan would enable her to trumpet that she has done the job she was hired to do — completing the Skywalker saga — and left the franchise in good hands."


    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/he...future-1256357
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  14. #14
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    You have to realize that the people involved in the purchase and running of Lucasfilm were primarily interested in the movie aspect of the franchise. They ignored the rest because they primarily were movie people.
    To be fair, Star Wars is a movie franchise; one that happens to have extremely successful in branching out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    To them stuff like the games/novels/comics were just ephemera that could be discarded and downplayed.
    In other words, nothing's changed since day one?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    Their goal was to crank out as many movies (to pay for the 4 billion dollar purchase of Lucasfilm) and maybe setup SW as a new MCU (which has failed).
    A 75% batting average is anything but a failure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    The powers that be simply did not understand the importance of the lore or the wealth of material of the Expanded Universe...
    And yet Solo was stuffed with Legends Easter eggs, the TV shows and tie-ins liberally borrow from Legends, and the current tie-ins have a pretty high level of quality (and a level of consistent interconnectivity that Legends never had). They know the quality of the "EU," as well as they know that tie-ins are subservient to the films.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    ...or that the SW brand needed to be maintained with the fans.
    ????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne View Post
    ...And despite the success of the MCU, they did NOT understand the shared universe aspect of the Legends Universe. Which is natural since they comes from an environment that venerates the director as an auteur and the movie as the vision of that one person (never mind that it's not true).
    A.) The movies not being bound by the tie-ins has always been how Star Wars worked, and B.) the current EU is far more interconnected then the old one was.
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  15. #15
    Ultimate Member Lee Stone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Then again, Lucas isn't the most consistent person. After ROTS was released he was pretty adamant that there never would be any more Star Wars movies, just the Clone Wars and the TV show. Then comes 2012....plus his many claims of having the whole saga mapped out perfectly from the beginning during many of the interviews from the prequels.
    I think he was just exhausted from the work and Return of the Jedi finishing gave him a perfect time to take a break.
    News sources from before RotJ was released mentioned the possibility of six more films and that Lucas already had a story outline done for the next trilogy.
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