Did DC emerge from the '90s unscathed?

[Denirac]

DC’s Nineties started when Dan DiDio took over- Not before, It was delayed into the 00s

[Jekyll]

While this is certainly true, there was also some great stuff in the 90s that wasn't grim & gritty clenched teeth and trauma.

Young Heroes In Love
Major Bummer
Starman
The Ray
Superboy
Robin
Power of Shazam
The Flash

Some wonderful stuff!

Agree! Many wonderful, fun, and uplifting stories that I was going to mention as well.

[skyvolt2000]

The 90s were the Age of GrimDark.

If you enjoyed The Dark Knight Returns, they you would enjoy the 90s. Every issue of almost every comic was The Darker Night Returns Again: The Series.

There was no joy. There was no light. There were still heroes in underwear.

Characters were crippled, ignored or killed; some were simply erased from existence.

Levity was forbidden. Extreme Violence was the norm. If the Watchmen were cool, then the 90s were cooler. Absolute Darkness makes for better stories apparently.

I found the 90s depressing. I don’t know if DC was scathed or unscathed by 90s. I don’t think the GrimDark is finished yet.

Steel had a book
Jurden Teen Titans
Shazam
Superboy
Impulse
DC Showcase-you saw a lot of folks get a story to themselves for 4 years. Big guns and Z list guys.

You saw a crossover between POC and A list-Superman (Steel & Connor). When was the last time a crossover "event" had that happen? We are lucky to have an event where a POC or Teen Titan is NOT killed off now a days.

Priest was doing more than black lead books. Sad thing is those are the books not in trades now.

[failo.legendkiller]

Superman death & return
Great characters as Steel, Superboy and relative solo books
Chuck Dixon Batverse, Robin Tim, Huntress, Bird of prey, Nightwing
Waid Flash
Impulse
Jurgens Teen Titans
Kyle Rayner
Power of Shazam
And many others great books as Showcase.

One of the periods i most loved in comics. Far better than what DC offers nowadays.
I remember that i read almost everything.

I don’t know about Marvel, i never cared about it.

[scary harpy]

I agree with everything you wrote, except the "forbidden levity" part.

If you knew where to look, you could still find a fair amount of it (especially, if you're a fan of Peter David).

While this is certainly true, there was also some great stuff in the 90s that wasn't grim & gritty clenched teeth and trauma.

Young Heroes In Love
Major Bummer
Starman
The Ray
Superboy
Robin
Power of Shazam
The Flash

Some wonderful stuff!

Young Justice
The Ray
Wonder Woman
Superboy
Batgirl
Robin
Green Lantern

This just off the top of my head of books were levity was very much allowed.

Agree! Many wonderful, fun, and uplifting stories that I was going to mention as well.

Steel had a book
Jurden Teen Titans
Shazam
Superboy
Impulse
DC Showcase-you saw a lot of folks get a story to themselves for 4 years. Big guns and Z list guys.

You saw a crossover between POC and A list-Superman (Steel & Connor). When was the last time a crossover "event" had that happen? We are lucky to have an event where a POC or Teen Titan is NOT killed off now a days.

Priest was doing more than black lead books. Sad thing is those are the books not in trades now.

alright.

If you knew where to look, you could still find a fair amount of levity.

Make no mistake, you would have to look/search for it. It was not easily found.

Happiness was not in vogue.

I, for one, had a difficult time enjoying myself knowing that Robin was murdered and Batgirl was maimed. I was still mourning the loss for a while.

I was also amazed at DC's inconsistency. I assumed they went GrimDark to become more mature and tell gritter stories. Simultaneously, heroes were still wearing outer-underwear and swimsuits.

TPTB killed Supergirl and erased Krypto because their are too many Kryptonians but kept Superman's underoos because...it's so stylish?

I knew Batman's, Robin's, Superman's and Wonder Woman's costumes looked ridiculous when I was about 10 ± 2 years old. (I'm sure that's why many of my peers made theirs Marvel.) If DC wanted comics to be more serious, how their heroes dressed should have been the place to start IMHO.

It was a strange time. I remember someone comparing it to Casper, the friendly ghost, wearing a hockey mask and wielding a chainsaw. I think the point was that GrimDark is the opposite of what these characters were originally imagined/intended to be.

[Agent Z]

alright.

If you knew where to look, you could still find a fair amount of levity.

Make no mistake, you would have to look/search for it. It was not easily found.

Happiness was not in vogue.

It was impossible to find if you were actively looking for dark and depressing stories. There were plenty of light hearted comics coming out in the 90s. the period wasnÂ’t

I, for one, had a difficult time enjoying myself knowing that Robin was murdered and Batgirl was maimed. I was still mourning the loss for a while.

These two events didnÂ’t even occur in the 90s.

TPTB killed Supergirl and erased Krypto because their are too many Kryptonians but kept Superman's underoos because...it's so stylish?

What does keeping Superman as the last Kryptonian (a decision made in the 80s not the 90s) have to do with grimdark?

[Ascended]

alright.

If you knew where to look, you could still find a fair amount of levity.

Make no mistake, you would have to look/search for it. It was not easily found.

I dunno man, there was plenty of fun stuff at DC in the 90's. We had tons of fun books like Impulse and Young Justice, and lots of titles that weren't comedies but were far from dark. I'd say the vast majority of the Bat line wasn't all that dark. Dixon wrote some serious stuff but only occasionally went truly grim. The Super line was much the same, with the exception of Supergirl that dealt with some darker elements. Flash, JLA, Green Lantern, even J'onn's solo rarely, if ever, went grimdark.

I mean, what was truly dark at DC at the time? Maybe Aquaman? Arguably Supergirl? Most of the DC books that fell into the 90's abyss were short lived titles like (Spawn rip off) Manhunter, Fate, Extreme Justice and Firebrand. We had Azreal too, which I suppose was a darker title.

What we *did* get were individual stories that were pretty dark. Superman's death and return, Bruce being broken, Hal going crazy, Zero Hour, etc etc. That stuff was dark and deconstructionist and all that, but once those stories were over what did we have? Superman doing typical Superman things in books that were usually serious but not dark or depressing, Kyle having wild adventures and learning to be a hero, etc. I feel like by 94-95, once Zero Hour and all those short lived 90's edgelord books like Manhunter died, so too died DC's attempts to ride the 90's trends.

At least until Didio came along and gave us stuff like Infinite Crisis in the 00's.

[DrNewGod]

In terms of business, DC was really getting its ass handed to it in the 90s.

True.

The Superman books were really strong, Batman's books were strong, and JLA was strong, but otherwise...a lot of basically mid level stuff. Marvel was stomping them, and Image passed DC by as well. Had DC not had a parent company, which already tells us that something went way wrong some time beforehand, the company could have possibly ended up in dire straights like Marvel...

National Periodicals was purchased in 1967, and its parent was acquired by Warner's in 1969. That's the time-frame of the Adam West Batman TV show, and shortly before the Wonder Woman show. Marvel was gaining on them at the newstand time, but DC was still very large and strong at the end of The Silver Age. If anything, I'd say DC got a parent company because they were desirable acquisition rather than as a result of being a failing brand.

[Rod G]

You want to talk Grimdark? You can’t get any more Grimdark than Dark Nights Metal.

[superduperman]

Other than a few clunkers (Mullet-man, Electric powers) I would argue the 1990s were DC's strongest era. The continuity was really tight. It's not a coincidence that they made Jor-El and Lara look like the post-Crisis versions in TAS. You had the birth of Vertigo. The Super-marriage. Superboy. Kyle Raynor GL. As a Superman fan, my biggest quibble with the era was how they wanted to take a dump on anything that came before. Particularly pre-Crisis Superman. It's almost as if they wanted to go in the opposite extreme. So you ended up with a Superman who had to be nerfed to the point where he strained to lift a car over his head in TAS. That seemed pointless to me. As far as the "XTREME!!!!!111111" BS goes, I don't think DC indulged in that as much as Marvel and certainly not as much as Image did. Other than a few characters having ridiculous looking costumes for a short time (Roy Harper, Nightwing, Guy Gardner).

Where I would argue they really went off the rails was literally at the year 2000. Once they turned Metropolis into the retro-future version from the cartoon, the story quality just headed downhill. I have no idea what they planned to do with that "Hypersector" thing but it looks like it was thrown out at the last minute for the whole Brainiac 13 storyline. I would argue that's when DC really went downhill.

[scary harpy]

I dunno man, there was plenty of fun stuff at DC in the 90's. We had tons of fun books like Impulse and Young Justice, and lots of titles that weren't comedies but were far from dark. I'd say the vast majority of the Bat line wasn't all that dark. Dixon wrote some serious stuff but only occasionally went truly grim. The Super line was much the same, with the exception of Supergirl that dealt with some darker elements. Flash, JLA, Green Lantern, even J'onn's solo rarely, if ever, went grimdark.

I mean, what was truly dark at DC at the time? Maybe Aquaman? Arguably Supergirl? Most of the DC books that fell into the 90's abyss were short lived titles like (Spawn rip off) Manhunter, Fate, Extreme Justice and Firebrand. We had Azreal too, which I suppose was a darker title.

What we *did* get were individual stories that were pretty dark. Superman's death and return, Bruce being broken, Hal going crazy, Zero Hour, etc etc. That stuff was dark and deconstructionist and all that, but once those stories were over what did we have? Superman doing typical Superman things in books that were usually serious but not dark or depressing, Kyle having wild adventures and learning to be a hero, etc. I feel like by 94-95, once Zero Hour and all those short lived 90's edgelord books like Manhunter died, so too died DC's attempts to ride the 90's trends.

At least until Didio came along and gave us stuff like Infinite Crisis in the 00's.

Okay.

Maybe it was me; I was certainly in a dark place at the time. I was looking for a safe place to escape; a place where right won – preferably wearing a brightly colored costume. I guess I wanted my comics to be like the old DC cartoons I watched. (For example, Filmation’s Adventures of Batman.)

I did not often find a joyful escape from the world reading DC comics. The characters that I identified most with (like Robin, Batgirl, Hawk & Dove) were the more vulnerable characters; they did not fare too well (…until recently). Quickly, I didn’t want to identify with any more characters because I was tired of losing them. (This is why I will not read Legion of Super-Heroes: DC’s hunger games.)

Yeah, Bruce’s back was broken; he didn’t spend 20 years in wheelchair like Barbara. Did anyone think he would? (In Zero hour, we were introduced to another Barbara as Batgirl…so she could be killed. I felt that was a real slap in the face to her fans.)

Yeah, Superman died; Dove (Dawn), Flash (Barry), Robin (Jason) and Supergirl died. Did anyone think Superman would NOT return? (How many decades did Jason stay dead? Barry? Hey, anyone remember the issue of Young Justice where Jason was alive…so he could be killed again? More fun times.) I’m sure that Superman was doing typical Superman things in books that were usually serious but not dark or depressing; I wasn’t reading Superman because I can’t get into the demigod character. Also, remember the distaste for the Matrix-Supergirl? I actually like her; I thought she had potential (...she could have been DC’s Invisible Woman)…until Peter David butchered the character. (I have nothing against the Earth-Born Angel; I wanted to read about Matrix.)

Yeah, Hal went crazy…and so did Hank (Hawk). Remember the rage against Kyle? Did anyone care if Hank was vilified?

Yes, I read those fun books; I enjoyed Impulse and Young Justice. I guess I felt everything was tainted and tarnished by the darkness and grimness everywhere else. It didn’t help when Young Justice was disbanded and Bart was killed.

Unfortunately, Ascended, Didio did come along…and is still here. And the GrimDark remains; it’s now part of the “mythology”.

[Dr. Ellingham]

What we *did* get were individual stories that were pretty dark. Superman's death and return, Bruce being broken, Hal going crazy, Zero Hour, etc etc. That stuff was dark and deconstructionist and all that, but once those stories were over what did we have? Superman doing typical Superman things in books that were usually serious but not dark or depressing, Kyle having wild adventures and learning to be a hero, etc. I feel like by 94-95, once Zero Hour and all those short lived 90's edgelord books like Manhunter died, so too died DC's attempts to ride the 90's trends.

The key being is that if you were invested in DC's history and culture from before all the stunts, you might've seen DC's early 1990s stunts as crass and/or tasteless. I know I did.

Unlike a lot of longtime Green Lantern fans, I liked Kyle, and think Marz and Banks did some really fun comics. But during that era DC systemically took down every pre-existing Green Lantern-related character, killing them off, maiming them. Even easily-ignored side-characters like Arisia or Hector Hammond were dealt either a cheap death or heel turn. A bit mean-spirited, not unlike current DC's Wally West strategy, which could be subtitled "the 90s Hal treatment".

I mean - they took away the name Green Lantern from Alan Scott. I'll rest my case there. But beyond that? Sure, afterwards there was fun, light stuff to be found - but it was like the movie Poltergeist - a playground built on top of a burial ground.