What stories are you looking for to get into minority characters?

[Shockingjustice]

I believe this is my first thread post so hopefully I do this correctly.

This thread was inspired by a poster in another thread talking about which black character can reach trinity status.
The poster wanted to know what stories could be told to get people interested. In POC characters instead of shooting down characters and ideas. These type of threads have been made before about other DC characters so I thought about making one for minority ones since they usually are only talked about in these types of threads.

It's no suprise that minority characters have a tough road in gaining popularity (much like any new character in this age). But because they were not part of the original JL, JSA, JLA, Legion, and Teen Titans teams they don't have a large following. Since those teams will rarely expand to include POC characters (or if they do they're erased in a reboot) they barely gain traction. They don't have any popular solos (if any) and are mainly team characters with the least amount of development compared to the more popular DC characters.They don't even make it into people's top ten. If I remember correctly there was a DC favorite character pole recently and I believe I only remember seeing John Stewart ( a Greeen Latern Legacy) in the 40s?

With all that being said what stories would DC have to tell to get you invested in these characters just like you are with Batman, Superman, the Big 7, and even the original Fab 5 Titans?

[Midnight_v]

Hi. That was me. You've made a positive thread and sometimes I fear that its difficult for positive threads to gain traction.

If I might though.

After being in that thread for a while and thinking a lot about the topic.

I think that Jaime Reyes blue beetle did it perfectly in his first arc, and then I lost track of the book but I did watch a series of Teen Titans in which he and the Reach were a big game topic.

The last "new" book I bought was "Collider" I picked up 3 issues of it because the premise was interesting to me (a boy and his sentient black hole powering him) but I really dropped it because I didn't like
the art style.
Even though I'm black I really never look around and go "MAN I GOTTA PICK UP THIS NEW BLACK BOOK" I'm a reader so i'm looking for interesting Topics, Ideas, or takes on concept, as in my opinion all the stories have been
told in an archetypal sense.

You can tell every story that has been told with new characters, and do so in exiting ways, or you can pioneer newness and deal with inevitable comparisons.

I'd not seen this but there was a Justice league cartoon with:
Stargirl/Blue Bettle/ Firestrom
There was an injustice God amoung us game with these scenes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44L7x9rLmGI

JLAction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXDVizim9jM

As far as trinity level superheroes go? I'm checking for that team. They're not teen titans, they're not the JLA jr.
They're a goddamn powerhouse trinity that need exploring.
I'm checking for that.

Hell I'd write that.

As far as everything else that can be done? DC has had stubs of black and minority heroes planted here and there. They have a GUIDEBOOK how it could be done in the form of milestone comics.
Jim Lee isn't drawing anything right now is he?
Its not as hard as people make it out to be.

Just don't do it like Marvel. Don't enter into the culture wars. Make good stories about superheroes and dark stories about anti-heroes/villians and Monsters.
Don't use racist tropes/and don't try to get too preachy.
Stoneyard. Lady Underground. Rush and Silence
I'm checking for when Dc remembers these things

[Shockingjustice]

Hi. That was me. You've made a positive thread and sometimes I fear that its difficult for positive threads to gain traction.

If I might though.

After being in that thread for a while and thinking a lot about the topic.

I think that Jaime Reyes blue beetle did it perfectly in his first arc, and then I lost track of the book but I did watch a series of Teen Titans in which he and the Reach were a big game topic.

The last "new" book I bought was "Collider" I picked up 3 issues of it because the premise was interesting to me (a boy and his sentient black hole powering him) but I really dropped it because I didn't like
the art style.
Even though I'm black I really never look around and go "MAN I GOTTA PICK UP THIS NEW BLACK BOOK" I'm a reader so i'm looking for interesting Topics, Ideas, or takes on concept, as in my opinion all the stories have been
told in an archetypal sense.

You can tell every story that has been told with new characters, and do so in exiting ways, or you can pioneer newness and deal with inevitable comparisons.

I'd not seen this but there was a Justice league cartoon with:
Stargirl/Blue Bettle/ Firestrom
There was an injustice God amoung us game with these scenes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44L7x9rLmGI

JLAction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXDVizim9jM

As far as trinity level superheroes go? I'm checking for that team. They're not teen titans, they're not the JLA jr.
They're a goddamn powerhouse trinity that need exploring.
I'm checking for that.

Hell I'd write that.

As far as everything else that can be done? DC has had stubs of black and minority heroes planted here and there. They have a GUIDEBOOK how it could be done in the form of milestone comics.
Jim Lee isn't drawing anything right now is he?
Its not as hard as people make it out to be.

Just don't do it like Marvel. Don't enter into the culture wars. Make good stories about superheroes and dark stories about anti-heroes/villians and Monsters.
Don't use racist tropes/and don't try to get too preachy.
Stoneyard. Lady Underground. Rush and Silence
I'm checking for when Dc remembers these things

Well after seeing your positive post on Cyborg and for how that thread had its answers, I thought this thread would be a good idea.

I haven't read a lot of blue beetle, but I did enjoy him in the Young Justice series, even if his story did kind of overwrite everyone else's. Honestly the animation department of DC has done way more for their minorities than their comics department.

[Restingvoice]

Well, being a POC minority myself (I'm not in the US but I'm still a minority in my own country), honestly the main attraction would be culture.

Like when I see Ms. Marvel for the first time, the one that appeals to me the most is how "at home" it feels. Kamala's family members, some wear traditional Muslim clothing, some wear casual clothing, some are conservative, some more liberal. They have a large picture of the scripture in their wall.

All of that, when I saw that, this feels close. I know this. I'm not Muslim myself, but my friends, I've seen and visited houses like this. People like Kamala's family are all around me.

So that's the first thing. Seeing that culture that's so rare to see in American media, is what attracts me to it. That's what makes me want to read it.

Then there's characterization. The first Ms. Marvel book ended with Kamala being surprised her hair turned blond because she admires Carol Danvers. Some people call it racist, I call it accurate, because as a non-white who grow up in American media, I too, wished to be blonde and white once upon a time because that's what cool and attractive according to Hollywood.

So it's like "I get you"

The story can be whatever at that point, but the character and the world already speak to me.

Well... not whatever whatever, since I still have a specific taste. Like for example, I didn't stay interested in Kamala Kahn for long since it's also a teenage girl's high school story, and I have zero interest in that... but then I'm going to have to talk about my specific taste, and that's not gonna be applicable for all characters.

[Shockingjustice]

Well, being a POC minority myself (I'm not in the US but I'm still a minority in my own country), honestly the main attraction would be culture.

Like when I see Ms. Marvel for the first time, the one that appeals to me the most is how "at home" it feels. Kamala's family members, some wear traditional Muslim clothing, some wear casual clothing, some are conservative, some more liberal. They have a large picture of the scripture in their wall.

All of that, when I saw that, this feels close. I know this. I'm not Muslim myself, but my friends, I've seen and visited houses like this. People like Kamala's family are all around me.

So that's the first thing. Seeing that culture that's so rare to see in American media, is what attracts me to it. That's what makes me want to read it.

Then there's characterization. The first Ms. Marvel book ended with Kamala being surprised her hair turned blond because she admires Carol Danvers. Some people call it racist, I call it accurate, because as a non-white who grow up in American media, I too, wished to be blonde and white once upon a time because that's what cool and attractive according to Hollywood.

So it's like "I get you"

The story can be whatever at that point, but the character and the world already speak to me.

Well... not whatever whatever, since I still have a specific taste. Like for example, I didn't stay interested in Kamala Kahn for long since it's also a teenage girl's high school story, and I have zero interest in that... but then I'm going to have to talk about my specific taste, and that's not gonna be applicable for all characters.

That's actually interesting and it's nice to hear your opinion on the matter. I've never thought about culture being an aspect of comic that people would enjoy, but it does make sense in that it's something people can relate to.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

Honestly just cool concepts and characters.

I rather avoid making more minorities legacy characters but I understand the business behind that. So I'd settle for them to stand out more and not feeling like rethreads of other characters.

[El_Gato]

Hi. That was me. You've made a positive thread and sometimes I fear that its difficult for positive threads to gain traction.

If I might though.

After being in that thread for a while and thinking a lot about the topic.

I think that Jaime Reyes blue beetle did it perfectly in his first arc, and then I lost track of the book but I did watch a series of Teen Titans in which he and the Reach were a big game topic.

The last "new" book I bought was "Collider" I picked up 3 issues of it because the premise was interesting to me (a boy and his sentient black hole powering him) but I really dropped it because I didn't like
the art style.
Even though I'm black I really never look around and go "MAN I GOTTA PICK UP THIS NEW BLACK BOOK" I'm a reader so i'm looking for interesting Topics, Ideas, or takes on concept, as in my opinion all the stories have been
told in an archetypal sense.

You can tell every story that has been told with new characters, and do so in exiting ways, or you can pioneer newness and deal with inevitable comparisons.

I'd not seen this but there was a Justice league cartoon with:
Stargirl/Blue Bettle/ Firestrom
There was an injustice God amoung us game with these scenes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44L7x9rLmGI

JLAction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXDVizim9jM

As far as trinity level superheroes go? I'm checking for that team. They're not teen titans, they're not the JLA jr.
They're a goddamn powerhouse trinity that need exploring.
I'm checking for that.

Hell I'd write that.

As far as everything else that can be done? DC has had stubs of black and minority heroes planted here and there. They have a GUIDEBOOK how it could be done in the form of milestone comics.
Jim Lee isn't drawing anything right now is he?
Its not as hard as people make it out to be.

Just don't do it like Marvel. Don't enter into the culture wars. Make good stories about superheroes and dark stories about anti-heroes/villians and Monsters.
Don't use racist tropes/and don't try to get too preachy.
Stoneyard. Lady Underground. Rush and Silence
I'm checking for when Dc remembers these things

I thought I was the only one who liked to pair those three together! I actually like that they pair up Jaime and Jason, since they debuted around the same time and faced the same amount of backlash. I think 14 years later, the definitive versions of Blue Beetle and Firestorm are a Latino and a Black guy... pretty cool to see they endured despite all the original backlash. Hopefully Ryan can catch up someday!

I give props to DC animation, they’ve truly done more for minority DC characters than the comics (background characters mainly) and live action (they’d rather race swap) counterparts! John Stewart, Cyborg, Blue Beetle, Static, Katana, Jessica Cruz, Bumblebee...etc have animation to thank for their rise in popularity.

[Shockingjustice]

I thought I was the only one who liked to pair those three together! I actually like that they pair up Jaime and Jason, since they debuted around the same time and faced the same amount of backlash. I think 14 years later, the definitive versions of Blue Beetle and Firestorm are a Latino and a Black guy... pretty cool to see they endured despite all the original backlash. Hopefully Ryan can catch up someday!

I give props to DC animation, they’ve truly done more for minority DC characters than the comics (background characters mainly) and live action (they’d rather race swap) counterparts! John Stewart, Cyborg, Blue Beetle, Static, Katana, Jessica Cruz, Bumblebee...etc have animation to thank for their rise in popularity.

Yeah they have. Honestly it's a shame Justice League Action ended so early. I thought it was pretty good even if it wasn't like the Timmverse.

[Restingvoice]

Oh, now that I've talked about the culture that attracted me, I wanna talk about when it doesn't.

New Super-Man. He's Chinese, I'm Chinese, but he started out as a bully, and continue to be kinda arrogant early on, so even though I love, love all the covers and variants that show them eating Chinese food or hanging out in Chinese old town, and I squealed when Chinese Wonder Woman was revealed to be Green Snake from White Snake Legend, the initial characterization is a turn-off. So characterization matters. Once he humbled down, I like him more.

Cassandra Cain, and Damian Wayne. Despite them having a Chinese descent, they're not as drenched in the culture as New Superman or Kamala, but I like and interested in them more than the previous two because of two words:

Ninja. Assassin.

So this time it's more about the pop culture I already like since I was a kid. Ninjas are just cool. I love Snake Eyes, Storm Shadow, Kill Bill, Basilisk Ninja Scroll... No, I actually don't like Naruto that much. They are more like sorcerers than ninjas (a fun fact the author actually wanted to make a wizard story at first, which makes so much sense).

Anyway! It's both the coolness that appeals to me and their attempt to be normal children. Lots of angst and adorableness to be found, by themselves and their interaction with others.

I guess redemption story while still being cool and badass (and sometimes cuteness), like what Cassandra, Damian, Storm Shadow, Kill Bill, and Samurai X have (oh and Xena!) really appeals to me

[kjn]

I think Restingvoice is onto something here. I know that G Willow Wilson in an interview about how Kamala Khan became a hit, and one of the pieces she mentioned there was a strong sense of place for the comics. Both the factors that Restingvoice takes up, and the depiction of New Jersey in the comic are part of that.

What I think many people who try to force minority characters into comics is that it becomes surface deep, or only shows in story, but not in the setting. But the last one is arguably the most important piece to ground a character.

That Kamala made herself blond was arguably one of the most interesting aspects of the comic, because it showed exactly how she (and other minority characters) can internalise a form of structural racism: this is what beauty looks like; conforming to the established ideal is easier and simpler than challenging or changing it.

[charliehustle415]

Oh, now that I've talked about the culture that attracted me, I wanna talk about when it doesn't.

New Super-Man. He's Chinese, I'm Chinese, but he started out as a bully, and continue to be kinda arrogant early on, so even though I love, love all the covers and variants that show them eating Chinese food or hanging out in Chinese old town, and I squealed when Chinese Wonder Woman was revealed to be Green Snake from White Snake Legend, the initial characterization is a turn-off. So characterization matters. Once he humbled down, I like him more.

Cassandra Cain, and Damian Wayne. Despite them having a Chinese descent, they're not as drenched in the culture as New Superman or Kamala, but I like and interested in them more than the previous two because of two words:

Ninja. Assassin.

So this time it's more about the pop culture I already like since I was a kid. Ninjas are just cool. I love Snake Eyes, Storm Shadow, Kill Bill, Basilisk Ninja Scroll... No, I actually don't like Naruto that much. They are more like sorcerers than ninjas (a fun fact the author actually wanted to make a wizard story at first, which makes so much sense).

Anyway! It's both the coolness that appeals to me and their attempt to be normal children. Lots of angst and adorableness to be found, by themselves and their interaction with others.

I guess redemption story while still being cool and badass (and sometimes cuteness), like what Cassandra, Damian, Storm Shadow, Kill Bill, and Samurai X have (oh and Xena!) really appeals to me

I believe Damian is of middle eastern descent i.e. from the Al Ghul family line.

Nevertheless, it would definitely be looking at different cultures.

DC has explored more alien cultures in comics than Asian.

I would love for them to explore East Asian or South Asian like Hindu mythology or Buddhist mythology.

Marvel has started recently with Greg Pak at the forefront with Agents of Atlas, I love to see a DC hero who was of Indian descent, especially since DC loves rebooting why not explore the concept of rebooting with the concept of reincarnation?

That would give a awesome in story reason as to what is happening with the different Crisis.