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  1. #61
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Not really, hence the qualifiers of potentially and necessarily and so forth. We've seen him operate astrally with no body to tether to, but not killed physically while projecting. Essentially my notion here is as long as his astral form lasts long enough to do up the Flash and a while longer, that's a win. Or possesses the Flash or etc. But it's all dependent on that and the notion of that since he's already projecting, he's already left his body, as it were.
    Last edited by Pendaran; 12-10-2019 at 03:00 AM.

  2. #62
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronus View Post
    Sure. Not so sure he can bust through auto shields though. I was more referring to "are they even necessary if Strange can manifest in astral form in a half second?" Can Strange be hurt by Wally in this form?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Dork Knight View Post
    Doesn't that leave his physical body open to the attack ,that would lead to a victory for wally if he destroyed the physical body?

    Also wouldn't Strange not be losing valuable time shoring up his shields if he switches to astral form, allowing Wally to wreck his physical body that much easier ?

    To put it another way, during his fight against the living star, strange was counting on his physical body holding up long enough for the astral stuff to happen...here if strange gives up his physical body ,his defences will simply be lowered won't they?he still cant react faster than wally ....so the stakes remain the same. If wally busts through the shields and destroys his physical body it's still a win. If he doesn't, strange can beat him anyhow
    Quote Originally Posted by big_adventure View Post
    Strange going astral isn't really a viable tactic in the arena, because it would still leave his body there, and reduce his combat power at the same time.

    Strange's best bet is still going to be "gang-sign, shield amp" followed by "spam-something-AoE-autohoming-that-fills-the-arena." Whether the first thing is enough to resist the presented current screws-up-dimensions Wally is the only real question, and I don't think that we have enough specific feats to know 100%.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    The thing of high up enough magic people in Marvel is if you kill their physical body while they are astral projecting, that doesn't do up their Astral Projecting form necessarily. So Wally killing his physical body might only just do that, leaving Astral Strange still free to do various nonsense Wally can't do things about.

    I mean at one point Dormammu tricked Strange into projecting out of his body, then made it his own while he did. Strange was able to still mess around despite no longer being tied to any corporeal form, as it were. If he uses his small bit of time to project, then yeah, there's potentially not a whooole lot of anything the Flash can do to him other than wreck his body, whereas for Strange...
    Quote Originally Posted by The Dork Knight View Post
    Not having control of his body is one thing...his physical form being completely destroyed is another. This is what strange was worried about in the fight v the living star.

    Does strange have feats for going on after his physical body has been destroyed?
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    Not really, hence the qualifiers of potentially and necessarily and so forth. We've seen him operate astrally with no body to tether to, but not killed physically while projecting. Essentially my notion here is as long as his astral form lasts long enough to do up the Flash and a while longer, that's a win. Or possesses the Flash or etc. But it's all dependent on that and the notion of that since he's already projecting, he's already left his body, as it were.
    It's a valid possibility. I vaguely recall his astral form being able to survive for 24 hours after losing touch with his body, or somesuch. However, at least one of those events had to do with him losing touch not because his body had DIED, but because his body was POSSESSED (the Dormammu thing Pen mentioned).

    I'll look into it because yeah, if he can survive for a short time after his body dies, even in astral form he has more than enough oomph to take out Wally. Arena, bloodlust, PIS off, that would be enough for a win.

    But it needs to be checked.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers."
    - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move."
    - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman."
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  3. #63
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    I would note, I'm not saying that if he's killed, he'll immediately endure as some astral version of himself for a bit, more that if he's already projecting out of his body beforehand, and his body is killed out during, he could possibly endure for a bit.

  4. #64
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    I would note, I'm not saying that if he's killed, he'll immediately endure as some astral version of himself for a bit, more that if he's already projecting out of his body beforehand, and his body is killed out during, he could possibly endure for a bit.
    It's an interesting point that Strange once took a mortal wound -- one that would have killed him sans an operation, and that seemed to immediately punch his body into unconsciousness -- and still released his astral form to fight (Dr. Strange, MotMA #79 as I recall, and the very first Strange issue I picked up...it's a good one, setting aside the sad characterization of Morgana).

    Strange Wounded 1.jpg

    Strange Wounded 2.jpg

    It's also one of the times where Strange's autoshields get flat-out ignored by the writer (another being when Strange gets clocked on the back of the head with an ashtray, isn't PIS wonderful?). Either that, or Urthona had enchanted the weapon to pierce said shields; he had done something with the demonic (actually, more 'alien Lovecraft style' idea) guy's armor to make it proof against high-level spells, after all.

    PS - the sword Stephen is using is actually a butterknife. ^_^

    Anyway, I wouldn't argue that would be possible in this case due the fact that, bloodlusted, the Flash won't be giving him a 'soon you will die!' wound but rather killing him on the spot. ^_^
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers."
    - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move."
    - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman."
    - Pendaran

  5. #65
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    I'm aware of that sequence, but that's not really my notion here. That's more Strange being knocked into his Astral Form due to receiving a mortal wound. I'm talking more if he's already in his Astral Form in the first place when his body is killed out.

  6. #66
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    I get that - brought this one up because you noted that it ISNT what you’re saying, and that something similar to what you’er not saying, so to speak, has actually transpired.

    Word salad, there.
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 12-10-2019 at 09:00 AM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers."
    - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move."
    - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman."
    - Pendaran

  7. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    I get that - brought this one up because you noted that it ISNT what you’re saying, and that something similar to what you’er not saying, so to speak, has actually transpired.

    Word salad, there.
    Gonna toss some balsamic vinaigrette on that and serve it for dinner :P
    "At the end of the day, Arby is a pretty prolific poster proposing a plurality of proper posts for us."
    - big_adventure

  8. #68
    nice to meet ya! master of read's Avatar
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    i like the fact that we've now refer to strange's hand gestures as gang signs. lol.

  9. #69
    Death of Time Cronus's Avatar
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  10. #70
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    It's an interesting point that Strange once took a mortal wound -- one that would have killed him sans an operation, and that seemed to immediately punch his body into unconsciousness -- and still released his astral form to fight (Dr. Strange, MotMA #79 as I recall, and the very first Strange issue I picked up...it's a good one, setting aside the sad characterization of Morgana).
    I'll be honest, I was REALLY hoping that would happen in Endgame. That Strange would still be kicking around just in Astral form... after all, his body may be dusted, but... he doesn't ALWAYS need that

  11. #71
    Extraordinary Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by master of read View Post
    i like the fact that we've now refer to strange's hand gestures as gang signs. lol.
    I'm just waiting until we see him summon forth the Winds of Wu-Tang.

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